Do follicle sizes relate to egg quality?

[Eggfreezing36]

I am triggering tonight ahead of my third egg retrieval for egg freezing. As I am single I will be putting this behind me and concentrating on dating, so no further treatment/IVF for me, which brings its own sadness, but I am hoping this is a good insurance policy.

When I've had my scans I've listened to the numbers and understand the ideal of 16-18mm but my clinic haven't ever given me a report on the numbers and I haven't asked, I've just figured what will be will be.

Now I am reaching my third and final (unless I decide to do another) round of egg freezing I suppose I am just wondering, would asking for the reports of my follicle number and sizes prior to trigger be useful to then post on here and ask for people's thoughts re quality?

The clinic do state they cannot tell the quality of the eggs, so seems like it won't make any difference but I do see posts on here that state that if your follicles are 16 or above this makes a stronger egg? So just wondering if you would recommend I have these numbers.

[LittleBlueOwl]

Good luck in your next cycle, I hope it goes well. ❤️ As far as I know follicle size doesn't correlate to quality, some follicles might not even have an egg inside them. It is an indication of egg maturity though, the follicles have to reach a certain size for the eggs to be mature enough to fertilize and not get so big that they go too far the other way as well. Sadly, nothing much about ART is an exact science. Hope that's helpful. Xx

[Eggfreezing36 in reply to LittleBlueOwl]

Thanks xx

[NemoFish]

It can give an indication of maturity but not quality. My last collection I had 4 mature eggs but none of them fertilised, sadly there would’ve been no way of knowing that was going to happen. It really is a lottery 🤯😖

[Eggfreezing36 in reply to NemoFish]

I know!! Harder still cos I am single and want to feel this is an insurance policy but no way of knowing

[Football61 in reply to Eggfreezing36]

Hi. Do you have the option of sending a few of the highest-graded embryos from this cycle for PGT-A testing? It’s not cheap, but at least it would put your mind at rest that you have some euploids in the bank. I think that age is the biggest factor when it comes to egg quality, so fingers crossed luck is still on your side - and it’s brilliant that you’ve done three cycles to improve your chances. I’m 44 and single, and only wish that I’d had the guts and foresight to follow your path when I was in my 30s x

[Eggfreezing36 in reply to Football61]

I'm only freezing eggs so no embryos to send. I've made the decision that I don't want to (and also don't think I can) do a sperm donor option and parent alone....so am not creating embroys. Egg freezing is with the hope of meeting a man and if I struggle to get pregnant naturally (cos I am 37 and single so will be trying at 40 + surely) hope it can be an insurance policy. But you just don't know do you!! I would maybe consider donor egg option....but I feel I must have a partner to have a child otherwise don't think I will.

Fingers crossed but it's something I can't find out re quality it seems, I guess even if good quality there's so many ifs and buts aren't there, I mean will I even meet the right person!

Hopefully whatever your path is you are successful

[Football61 in reply to Eggfreezing36]

D’uh, sorry, PGT-A was a really stupid suggestion! 🤦🏻‍♀️. I think you’ve done all you can - it’s brilliant that you’ve carried out three cycles. Hopefully you’ll have some high-quality eggs in there. Bringing up a child on my own was definitely not in my plans, but ultimately I don’t feel like I have any other choice now if I want a baby. Best of luck to you x

[Eggfreezing36 in reply to Football61]

You too <3

I may end up making the same decision as you, and who knows maybe I will regret not making an embryo, but it's all just a bit much for me atm - the egg freezing has been enough mentally and grappling with that whilst numerous friends have babies. So I am sticking to that for now and hoping against hope I can have some luck with the terrible dating apps. I have heard there's a site to co parent so maybe if I get to 40 I will consider that. Keep me posted on how solo parenting goes, I do know some people who have done it xx

[Football61 in reply to Eggfreezing36]

I looked into egg freezing when I was in my 30s, but it was so overwhelming, and I was so busy at work, I just discarded the idea. Huge regret. You’ve definitely done the right thing, and fingers crossed you’ll meet someone wonderful ❤️

[Eggfreezing36 in reply to Football61]

I wish I'd done it earlier, I guess we all wish we'd done something differently. And it's certainly no guarantee as you don't know if it will work but I feel I have done what I can. I am going to do another post in a few weeks as I want advice on whether to do a 4th next summer, but right now after 3 in 6 months I def can't think about.

I hope your plan for solo parenting goes well and likewise that you also meet someone great. I honestly feel in my mind that's harder right now than the fertility stuff, cos the fertility stuff we can have a small amount of control, pay, get help....love - there's no paying your way out of that issue lol xx

[Football61 in reply to Eggfreezing36]

Definitely know where you’re coming from on that score. I’m fishing from a really small pool, because I’m looking for a guy who’s the same religion as me. And most of them are 🤢🤮. I’ve been on all the apps, I’ve been to literally hundreds of singles dinners, singles holidays, speed dating, etc - I even had a ‘match-maker’ at one point. All to no avail. When all of my friends were busy dating and getting married in their 20s and 30s, I was working 24/7 - another huge regret. I left it too late to try and find someone - although I know there’s always time. I might just have to do things in reverse and (hopefully) pop out a baby first! x

[Eggfreezing36 in reply to Football61]

I feel you. I am not religious but in London whilst it seems like it would be great as a big city, it's just full of crap. It's like a constant stream of rejection online dating, and only successful half the time if you want to really compromise and I don't. Half my friends who got married really settled/compromised with guys who are far less attractive, or who they earn way more than. I don't want to but have paid the price.

The only thing about the religious dating - I don't know what religion you are - but friends of mine who were muslim and jewish - the guys all had good jobs! So there's that. Half of the english men I earn way more than, some are lazy and just not driven and wouldn't be interested in being the breadwinner!

But trust me, I have been on the apps on and off since 27, I am now 37....and most of my friends were on the apps for years. It's very hard and crap whatever age you are, so don't beat yourself up you left it too late. It sounds like you made a lot of effort to me! It's not our fault the selection of men is rubbish, I mean there are some good ones but the good looking ones can be arrogant peter pans, narcissists etc, have been there, done that!

[Twiglet2]

the size of the follicle monitoring is to try and get mature eggs, but doesn’t tell quality they can’t even tell actually if that follicle contains an egg! You don’t need a report they just normally read it out the sizes to you when they are scanning it helps them know when to trigger you and do egg collection if you have a few above the 17mm then that’s usually when they do the trigger xx

[Eggfreezing36 in reply to Twiglet2]

Thanks, ok noted!

[Twiglet2 in reply to Eggfreezing36]

I usually count them on my fingers whilst I’m lying getting scanned 😂 but in case I don’t catch them they will tell you afterwards if you ask lol xx

[MariaHdz]

What I know is thay it does not mean that your egg is stronger or better quality. It helps the doctor to guess that there is a higher chance that the follicle contains an egg (sometimes the follicle might be empty) and that the egg has the best chance for being mature to be feetilized. But any follicle from 13mm might contain a mature egg. But 16 to 18mm indicates more chances of a mature egg. The doctors check that most follicles are around this size to trigger you, so that they can collect more eggs. Knowing the size of the follicles now, won't give you much information. The only thing is that it is positive correlated withthe follicle size is the quantity of eggs you already got. If they are high quality or not, is impossible to say.

Example: I was 32, I got over 30 follicles, most of them 16 to 19 mm. They got 25 eggs, 24 fertilized. Got 11 day 3 embryos. And I only got one BFP from all of them. So sometimes even if all looks the right size and fertilices and all, it does not tell you much over the quality of the egg (and sometimes, this also happens with the sperm as there are things that some clinics don't check). Apparently PCOS made my eggs to be many, and for me to respond nicely to medicines, but quality was an issue (but well, they just guess)

[Eggfreezing36 in reply to MariaHdz]

Thanks! Yes that's what my clinic said, I won't know the quality until or unless I go to use. That's what I find the most tricky, the uncertainty. I was just curious re follicles as they kept talking about it and I thought does that mean the egg inside is bigger or stronger? But noted it doesn't.

Thanks also for sharing your stats, that is quite sobering that a 32 year old's eggs got one pregnancy from 25 eggs. Although fantastic news of course, congratuations! I currently have 13 eggs frozen at present and I am doing my third and final egg retrieval tomorrow - I have got 6 eggs from first round frozen and 7 from second round, so they kicked my stims up for this round but I doubt I will get 25 total. The idea that I could have say 20 -22 eggs and not get one pregnancy is gutting. I need to consider whether I do a fourth round...

[MariaHdz in reply to Eggfreezing36]

Yes i know what you mean, it is very uncertain. But also there are so many factors at play. Even the medicines you were stimulated with. What some women do is to use donor sperm for a part of the eggs so that they can have some embryos as embryos have a higher chance of resulting in a pregnancy (but again, you never know. From 11 embryos that I had, i got one pregnancy, and you might not want to go the donor route).

I have also seen women that are older than i was during my retrieval a couple years ago, that got fewer eggs and only 1 or 2 embryos and it worked very fast. In my case, i wanted to wait at least 2 years before trying for another child, but seeing how the first took like 5 years, many eggs and 5 FET, and i am now older, i think i will start next year. I am now in another clinic so hopefully it will go good and also i hope the best for you

[Eggfreezing36 in reply to MariaHdz]

Yes I don't want to do the donor route, for me I feel I want to do it with a partner or just accept that I don't have it. In the UK nursery is 1.7k a month, it's just too much and too stressful. If anything I think i would do a donor egg if I had a partner over the solo parenting. But you never know!

Food for thought, i wish there was a magic number of eggs! I wouldn't do more than 1 round of egg freezing though, but I also don't like the side effects of more than 3 rounds...and I am having my third tomorrow. I don't believe there aren't cancer risks so let's see, I am not sure.

best of luck to you! xx

[MariaHdz in reply to Eggfreezing36]

Yeah! It is one of those things where you don't know how badly you felt, until the treatment is over. Also emotionally. Since I went thru it, i got white coat syndrome: a doctor check my pressure and it is in the clouds (and normal when someone else checks it).

I also have my doubts over the side effects on the long term. They say that it is very safe, but well. You never really know. I hope it goes very well and you don't feel badly during nor after the procedure

[Eggfreezing36 in reply to MariaHdz]

Yeah of course they say it is....but come on, fizzy drinks, plastics, alcohol - it all causes an impact and certainly this will too. There are even articles on it. So that's the only thing holding me back from potentially doing another.

Never heard of white coat syndrome! Will have to google.

It sounds weird but in some strange way I will miss the process and the focus, now I am just back to single life and dating....I quite like the focus in some way, it's comforting.

[StarsAllAround]

Follice size relates to mature eggs, ie if a folice is less than 16mm it is likely that any egg in it will be immature and discarded. Unfortunately quality is something they can't test or check for.