THC/Marijuana: Why/how does it work for PD?

[1LittleWillow]

I live in the US in a no-marijuana state but only 5 minutes from a recreational-legal state. I usually go to my sister's house (in the legal state) at bedtime, grab an edible, then head home to sleep (it takes about an hour to kick in).

Without THC, I barely sleep at all. It takes 4-5 hours to fall asleep, and then I sleep for only a few hours before waking again. With THC, I sleep like a baby for 8 hours and wake up (without an alarm clock) feeling fine.

I can't do THC during the day because if I take a dose that's large enough to calm my PD symptoms, it makes me sleepy and VERY nauseous. When I take it at night, I can get up to go to the bathroom if I need to, but I have to go straight back to bed. If I try to walk around at all, I get dizzy and vomit.

I've noticed that my tremor, rigidity, bradykinesia and mild dystonia on my left side (mostly left arm/hand) are GONE during the night when I take an edible. I can move my left hand easily and fluidly--even better than when I take Sinemet. Of course, it doesn't do me any good as I can't get up and do anything lol.

I'm thinking about levodopa and FUS-PTT, and wondering where THC fits into the picture. I'm hoping that my state legalizes medical marijuana soon (we're working on it), so I'll be able to experiment with it a lot more.

[chartist]

In my experience Sativa does not make me sleepy during the day. Indica is my choice for sleep at night. I use high THC content with low CBD content for sleep. A bit less THC is fine for me during the day.

Art

[1LittleWillow in reply to chartist]

Art, do you smoke, vape, take edibles, use oils/tinctures? I've tried vaping sativa oils a few times at my nephew's house, but it seems like it's always too much (improves symptoms but makes me too high to function) or too little (makes me feel relaxed but doesn't help PD symptoms). I've tried edibles a few times during the day with the same result. I so wish medical MJ was legal in my state so that I could have more opportunities to experiment.

[chartist in reply to 1LittleWillow]

Yes, I have tried smoking bud, vaping, different types of edibles, tinctures, ointments and topical oils. Without THC as an indica variety, I do not find benefit for sleep. Sativa tends to make me laugh easily, get an increase in creativity and definitely does not help with sleep at all for me. Vaping and smoking bud is the fastest onset of action followed by tincture under the tongue which to me is still not close in speed to smoking and vaping in terms of onset of action. I find vaping much easier, simpler with less odor than bud, smoother than bud, but because it is so easy to use, I generally will use bud over vaping because it is not quite as easy. I found when vaping, it was so easy that I would use it too often, which I don't want to do. So for me, bud is the happy medium.

Edibles to me are not reliable for sleep because of the variable onset of action, but the gummies are almost addictive to me because of the gummy candy, not the THC/CBD content. I've taken edibles that kicked in so much later (5 hours later) that I had forgotten I had even taken it by the time I started to feel it. So edibles are not useful for me because of the variable delay of onset. I think the amount of food in your stomach at the time of ingestion can significantly delay the onset.

On a related note, there is a remote possibility that Biden may legalize or decriminalize MM, so with that thought in mind, it might be a good idea on your part to take notes on what you test at your nephews and how it works for you exactly so if the MM laws change, you will have the best idea of how each version works for you and what is best for you. Tinctures can be useful, but there are very many options of ratios of THC to CBD and there are a couple of other forms other than CBD and THC that I have not tried yet, but I believe one is purported to be useful for sleep and one is said to be useful for pain if I remember correctly.

Art

[1LittleWillow in reply to chartist]

Art, that reminded me of what my nephew told me when I was trying to remember the difference between indica and sativa. Indica = In da couch. 😂

[chartist in reply to 1LittleWillow]

Lol!

Sounds like your nephew has experience!😜😜😜

Art

[Alock2020 in reply to chartist]

Art -

I've been using Sativa varieties, and have found that all of the ones I've used have caused insomnia.

I've never tried any of the Indica varieties. Are there any that you'd recommend for increasing the amount of sleep, and do you know of whether they degrade or enhance the quality of sleep (e.g. REM, etc.)?

-Alex

[Hidden in reply to Alock2020]

please pardon me for butting in...

Dr. Matthew Walker, youtu.be/bEbtf7uS6P8?t=8582(Not working as expected?)

spoiler: The link is set to the timestamp where he is speaking about alcohol causing fragmented sleep, and goes on to say that it is one of the best chemicals for suppressing REM sleep alongside marijuana (specifically THC though -- he provides more info about CBD).

[chartist in reply to Alock2020]

Yes, sativa tends to wake me up and puts my mind to work. I find indica is what puts me to sleep. I use high THC content/low CBD content for the purpose of sleep. I usually just ask the person at the dispensary what their current best product is for sleep as it changes like the weather. I have not looked into how it affects REM sleep, but I have for the past few months not been using it for sleep as melatonin has again started acting as a good sleep inducer for me and I am not sure why that is. I would rather use melatonin for sleep anyway, at least when it works for that purpose because I want to avail myself of all the potential health benefits of melatonin of which there are very many including Covid-19! I am now starting my 12th month of melatonin at 106 mg+/night.

Art

[Hidden in reply to chartist]

"melatonin has again started acting as a good sleep inducer for me and I am not sure why that is"

Is it by any chance a different brand or batch of the same brand? I'm just getting started with melatonin and purchased several brands with an assortment of delivery methods. I had really good results with liquid and lozenge, and then swapped out 2x 2.5 lozenge with 5mg capsule of a different brand. It was like I hadn't taken anything. I went back to the lozenge and had excellent results again.

I've had a similar thing happen with brand name loratadine. Since we have multiple family members that use it, I was able to determine that it stopped working only when using the newly opened bottle. I've switched to generic and haven't had that problem again.

[chartist in reply to Alock2020]

Yes, it appears that marijuana can shorten REM sleep. So I guess it is good that I stopped using it for sleep. On the other hand, melatonin is noted for extending REM sleep. Unfortunately, melatonin does not always promote sleep in everyone or in some people it may leave them too drowsy the next day.

Art

[MissRita]

It never worked for me. Just made me much more tremory. Made me WAY to high lol

[Missy0202]

I have completed a 6 week trial. I won’t know definitely what I was on for months until the trial is over, but have had lengthy discussions with the manufacturers (cannimed through Aurora) and matched my experience with one of the 3 different strains of oils I could have been on. They deemed I was 99,9% sure I was on 20:1 (cbd:thc) it is an oil that I take in a syringe. I titrated up from .1 ml to .8ml where I had to stop. The negative side effects (anxiety, dizziness, confusion, slowness etc) were scary and debilitating at that dose. I went down and stayed at .6 ml for the rest of the trial. The thc is a mix of indica and sativa. I started to see benefits both in sleep and pain and rigidity at .5ml. I have been off the oil for a week (still part of the trial) and although it took a few days the pain, rigidity and insomnia has retuned. It is 3:20 am as I write this. Up and at it since 1:30 am. I have purchased a new bottle of oil and Intend on making it part of my daily routine starting tomorrow 😃

[kevowpd in reply to Missy0202]

Does the product make you 'high' at all or is there insufficient THC for that?

[Missy0202 in reply to kevowpd]

I have never experienced a high from thc before but at .7 and .8 I definitely felt odd and Anxious. I would say there was enough thc in that dose to produce those unwanted effects. Some people may react differently and enjoy the feeling but for me it was dreadful. It lasted hours but then slowly wore off. For me at.6 I feel none of those effects.

[rescuema]

A good article explaining the available options and how they affect people differently.

leafly.com/news/cannabis-10...

[Hidden]

I use it every day as I have for the past 15 years and it helps me tremendously I just use edibles and an occasional vape but always indica. Don’t know how I would’ve gotten through this without it. Luckily I live in a legal state.

[Grasss1973 in reply to Hidden]

Would appreciate the dose , or the name of the edible that you use. One of the factors that has discouraged me from trying , is the variety of choices. Also wondering if you take c/l dopa and if you take it during the night ? Can you get around in the morning without having taken c/l dopa during the night? Thank you

[Hidden in reply to Grasss1973]

I only take a 5 mg edible, usually two to three times a day. I used to take much higher doses back when I first started trying it but the dose I take now seems to do the trick. I also use a 20 to 1 CBD oil, containing 20 mg of CBD and 1 mg of THC Per dropper which I take twice a day. I take my last dose of Sinemet around two or three in the afternoon and don’t take another dose until 630 the next morning. I also use a melatonin and L-theanine gummy at bedtime which the tends to make me more calmer in the morning. There is also a daytime stress and anxiety relief gummy that I take once a day made by Olly that contains GABA and L-theanine and lemon balm, no thc that seems to bring a calm to my body also. The thc edible I use is called Kanha Nano, which is a nano molecular product resulting in the effects working in your body within 15 minutes as opposed to most edibles that take a few hours. Wishing you well.

[Grasss1973 in reply to Hidden]

The time interval between doses of c/l dopa approximately 12 hours is impressive ! If the supplemental CBD and THC are helping to stretch that interval out, then all the better ! Thanks for the info.

[SilentEchoes]

Try full spectrum CBD. 4 Corners in Durango sells a high potency organic product. I shattered my ankle 3 weeks ago and was able to replace the opioid pain pills with CBD and slept through the night. Not even 50mg melatonin could achieve this length of sleep.

Zero harm in trying it.

SE

[Tayogi]

I find the most effective way to get symptom relief is dabbing, I’ve talked to another person that finds it to be the most helpful too. I usually dab live resins, I do sativas during the day and hit a bong at night about an hour before bed with indica, I dance for 45 mins an then hit the hay relaxed and happy 😁. I like live resins the most because it’s one of the least processed extracts and it preserves the terpines and cannabinoids the most.

[1LittleWillow in reply to Tayogi]

I would love to experiment with it more to see if I could find something that would help during the day, but until they make it legal in my state, it isn't really an option. I'm hoping that will happen soon.

[Tayogi]

maybe your nephew can get it for you!