Is Simvastatin more effective than th... - Advanced Prostate...

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Is Simvastatin more effective than the other statins, against PCa?

GeorgeGlass profile image
32 Replies

Patrick O'Shea and others interesting in the effects of statins on prostate cancer suppression, do you find anything about this study that reinforces the use of Simvastatin over other statins, or is it insignificant because it's not a study on men?

I didn't try to translate the amount/dosage in this study, and how it would compare to a man, so I can't tell if it's relevant in that regard or not.

After switching from Crestor to Pitivastain, and then recently to Simvastain, I've had general muscle and joint aching, which is really irritating and demoralizing. I wish the industry would do some tests on combining more than one statin, in order to get a wider defense against different types of PCa cells. I'm thinking about going back to Crestor, but with a low dose of 5mg, combined with 5 or 10mg of Zetia. I did the research this week, and it looks like a good option for those who are getting muscle and joint aches.

Here is the study that I referenced above: mdpi.com/2227-9059/11/1/29

and here is an clip from that study report:

"Simvastatin demonstrated the strongest growth inhibitory effect of all three statins, followed by atorvastatin and rosuvastatin, which in fact did not express any significant inhibition on the investigated cell lines (Figure 1A). At a concentration of 1 µM, simvastatin accomplished a >50% reduction of cell growth representing the IC50, whereas atorvastatin reached the IC50 mark at a concentration of 3 µM in the same cell lines. Responsiveness to the three statins also strongly differed among the cell lines. Simvastatin and atorvastatin had the strongest growth-inhibitory effect in androgen-insensitive PC-3 cells, followed by LNCaP cells, which mimic hormone-sensitive PCa. The two castration-resistant cell lines, LNCaPabl and 22Rv1, on the other hand, were clearly less sensitive to statin treatment. Representative images of each cell line after treatment with the most effective dose of 5 µM are shown in Figure 1B.

Corresponding with the effect obtained on cell viability, simvastatin significantly induced apoptosis in LNCaP and PC-3 cells and to a much lesser extend in LNCaPabl and 22Rv1 cells (Figure 1C). Atorvastatin, by contrast, only induced apoptosis in PC-3 cells whereas rosuvastatin did not induce apoptosis in any of the cell lines (Figure 1A,B).

In combination with 5 µM of the anti-androgen enzalutamide, there was a weak increase in growth inhibition of androgen-sensitive LNCaP cells compared to statins alone, particularly at lower concentrations between 2 and 4 µM (Figure 1A), whereas there was no apparent additive effect of statins and enzalutamide in PC-3 cells. In castration-resistant LNCaPabl cells, enzalutamide combined with atorvastatin resulted in the most prominent growth inhibition. Notably, simvastatin and also rosuvastatin were able to increase the effect of enzalutamide in 22Rv1 cells. These data suggest that statins may in fact be able to enhance the tumor growth inhibitory effect of enzalutamide, however, depending on the type of statin and the tumor cell line.

3.2. Differential Effects of Statins on the Expression of HMGCR

One of the possible explanations for the differential effects of statins observed in PCa cells is the transcriptional upregulation of enzymes of the mevalonate pathway by sterol regulatory element binding protein 2 (SREBP2), a feedback mechanism that is activated by statin treatment. Previous studies have demonstrated that AR-negative PC-3 cells lack SREBP2 expression and are therefore highly responsive to statins [26]. Therefore, we next investigated changes in HMGCR expression after treatment of our 4 PCa cell lines with the three different statins through qPCR. As depicted in Figure 2A, simvastatin treatment induced an upregulation of HMGCR in AR-positive LNCaP, LNCaPabl and 22Rv1 cells but not in AR-negative PC-3 cells, confirming previously published results [26]. Similarly, HMGCS1 was significantly upregulated by simvastatin in LNCaP, LNCaPabl and 22Rv1 cells but did not affect the expression in PC-3 cells (Figure 2B). Treatment with atorvastatin and rosuvastatin, by contrast, increased the expression of HMGCR and HMGCS1 in all 4 cell lines, including PC-3 cells, indicating that a lack of response to the different statins cannot solely be explained by the SREBP2 mediated feedback mechanism.

3.3. Long-Term Effects of Simvastatin

Since simvastatin exhibited the strongest anti-proliferative effect on PCa cells in our short-term experiments, we used this statin to study the effects of long-term treatment on PCa cell growth. For that reason, LNCaP, LNCaPabl and PC-3 cells were cultivated in a medium containing simvastatin over a period of 6 months."

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GeorgeGlass
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6357axbz profile image
6357axbz

👍

cesanon profile image
cesanon

Dr. Myers pretty much always prescribed statins to his prostate cancer patients for prostate cancer purposes. Basically off label even when it was on label.

He quite specifically prescribed Rosuvastatin for that purpose. I never went deep to ask him his reasoning.

Seasid profile image
Seasid in reply to cesanon

Crestor is the most effective statin. I had 0 side effects at the highest dose of 40mg per day. My oncologist said that I can stay on it and it doesn't matter which one I am using, I stopped as I wanted my cholesterol higher as it is used for vitamin D synthesis in your skin using UVB rays and my vitamin D levels are low and I am osteoporotic. My previous MO said that statins are not a proven treatment for cancer. My current MO things that statins benefiting. I stopped maybe untill April and I will see than to restart it or not. I feel fine without statins now. I was also without any side effects with 40mg per day of Crestor.

Gl448 profile image
Gl448 in reply to Seasid

You feel fine without statins?

What does that mean? The Mayo Clinic says there are no symptoms to high cholesterol.

What do you think you felt that was from high cholesterol?

6357axbz profile image
6357axbz in reply to Gl448

good question

GeorgeGlass profile image
GeorgeGlass in reply to Seasid

I’m actually thinking about switching back to Crestor, but 5mg plus 10 mg zetia, instead of 20 mg of Crestor. With the 2mg pitavastatin for three months, and the simvastatin for three weeks, I’m not getting as much oxygen during exercise, as i did with 20mg of Crestor. The plaque in my arteries are probably not flattening out as much on the weaker statins.

Now that i started nubeqa, they say that 20mg of Crestor could be risky because it builds in the system to much higher levels. This, I’ll start at 5 mg plus zetia. I can go higher on the Crestor, as necessary, as time goes forward.

Do you take a 2d line AR drug? Abi, enzo, daro etc?

Seasid profile image
Seasid in reply to GeorgeGlass

Not yet.

I just had a radiation of my prostate and my PSA dropped from 1.5 to 0.48 3 months after radiation.

I will rather wait with Enza in order to minimise the appearance of the neuroendocrine version of the cancer.

I hope that my PSA stays low.

Seasid profile image
Seasid in reply to GeorgeGlass

I used crestor for more than 5 years. That should be enough hopefully for me to avoid plague. My doctor wanted to put me on stations long long time ago but I resisted. I don't believe that I really need it. My life expectancy is probably about 4 years now.

Do what your doctor suggest I will rather enjoy a benefits of cholesterol. My family members had even 8 without stations. If we would not have oral therapy I would suggest to try grapefruit. One of my friend said that his cholesterol was 8 and after eating grapefruit his cholesterol dropped.

Seasid profile image
Seasid in reply to GeorgeGlass

But grapefruit's reputation for interfering with some medications is well-deserved.

It particularly affects certain anti-cholesterol statin drugs, as well as some medicines used to treat high blood pressure, irregular heartbeats and even allergies. Grapefruit and grapefruit juice can cause too much or too little of a drug to stay in the body. Too much drug increases the risk of side effects; too little means the drug may not work as well.

Seasid profile image
Seasid in reply to Seasid

heart.org/en/news/2020/01/1...

Soumen79 profile image
Soumen79

There is PEACE 4 trial led by dr Karim Fizazi, result expected by 2024

GeorgeGlass profile image
GeorgeGlass in reply to Soumen79

What’s that trial studying?

Soumen79 profile image
Soumen79 in reply to GeorgeGlass

Trial of Acetylsalicylic Acid and Atorvastatin in Patients With Castrate-resistant Prostate Cancer (PEACE-4)clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show...

6357axbz profile image
6357axbz

👍

Gl448 profile image
Gl448

Isn’t the main side effect of not controlling your cancer extreme bone pain, followed by organ failure, hospice, and an untimely death?

Sounds a lot worse than a bit of fatigue from ADT… But that’s just me.

Seasid profile image
Seasid in reply to Gl448

Low dose oral chemotherapy would control my cancer during my ADT Holliday.

Gl448 profile image
Gl448 in reply to Seasid

So it’s not really pharmaceuticals poisoning your system that you’re worried about, because unlike every other medication you’ve mentioned the whole point of chemo is to poison you, low dose or not.

Interesting

Seasid profile image
Seasid in reply to Gl448

It would give me relief from side effects of the ADT.

Seasid profile image
Seasid in reply to Gl448

You are correct.

EdBacon profile image
EdBacon in reply to Gl448

You said "Isn’t the main side effect of not controlling your cancer extreme bone pain, followed by organ failure, hospice, and an untimely death?"

Yeah, but that's better than poisoning yourself with medications. Nobody should be doing that. Once you start using poison as a medication, you are really defeating the purpose.

Gl448 profile image
Gl448 in reply to EdBacon

Good point.

Aren’t “natural” substances like red rice yeast (a form of statin) poisonous then. They affect the same pathways.

Better stick to sprouts and stay out of the health supplements store too.

Brought it back on topic there

GeorgeGlass profile image
GeorgeGlass

How are you measuring your life expectancy for the cancer? What about cardiac risk? From stress test results?

GeorgeGlass profile image
GeorgeGlass

my duke stress test score said that my result was very good, with a very low 5 year risk. But I’ve been dicking around with different statins because I’m starting nubeqa, and i needed to switch off Crestor. However, I am going back to Crestor at 5mg + zetia. The lower intensity statins( pitavastatin and simvastatin )seemed to reduce my breathing during exercise and I started to have some achy muscles and joints, on them.

GeorgeGlass profile image
GeorgeGlass

what caused the bone mass increase; the alp reduction; and the lower blood glucose or a1c reduction?

Lrv44221 profile image
Lrv44221

oh G1448 I’m so sorry for your loss of your son. Loosing a child is the worst pain there is no comment about statins just want to say I’m sorry for your loss

Gl448 profile image
Gl448 in reply to Lrv44221

Sweet of you to say. 

He’s been dead 13 years now; nothing can be done about that.

But perhaps you could help lots of dying men here if you’d open up and share more details about these two posts. There are some intriguing things mentioned in them:

healthunlocked.com/advanced...

healthunlocked.com/advanced...

EdBacon profile image
EdBacon in reply to Lrv44221

We'd all love to hear the secret to your amazing success story with cancer. Being given only 6 months to live and then going 18 years is nothing short of miraculous. How can we learn more about how you did this?

GeorgeGlass profile image
GeorgeGlass

isn’t 59 alp above normal? Why is it higher than normal levels?

Justfor_ profile image
Justfor_ in reply to GeorgeGlass

No. It is closer to the min normal. I mainly use two labs with different max normals: One at 130 the other at 150. The former dimensions it as IU/l, i.e. International Units per liter, the latter as U/L. I don't know if the "I" of the former is superfluous or it does make a difference. In order to have a comparative metric I use the percentage to each max. Like Russ my ALP has been trending down post RP. Latest one was 34% of max (51 U/L, normal range 40-150). The one before 35.4% (46 IU/l, normal range 40-130).

GeorgeGlass profile image
GeorgeGlass

thanks russ, i looked at those five years ago, but i find that they make me think that i only have limited years to live. Bruce Lipton proves that type of thinking will cause a self fulfilling prophecy. I’m working on improving my mental programming to convince my mind that i will live for many years, instead of only a few years. It’s been proven to work, if sone effectively. If someone thinks that only doctor treatments work, then they can shorten their life span. The brain controls allot of the way that genes are activated, including cancer cells.

Soumen79 profile image
Soumen79 in reply to GeorgeGlass

Hi GeorgeGlass,

If you go through my profile you will find that I am a very young fighter but my disease was quite heavy at dx, although first battle won with success, I know the sword is hanging.

I am well into cleaner food, exercise and meditation but I cant initiate myself into this mind training pathway, will you please help me in starting with this?

With regards

Soumen chandra

GeorgeGlass profile image
GeorgeGlass

i looked yesterday. My alp is 66. I was thinking that you were talking about ast and alt scores, which were in the twenties last month. Hopefully they will stay low, while on nubeqa.

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