Is there anyone here who has defeated their prostate cancer with diet and anti cancer supplements? Cruciferous veggies and fruits plus herbal supplements and oils?
Defeating prostate cancer with diet - Advanced Prostate...
Defeating prostate cancer with diet
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Philipino
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What is your current status - diagnosis? treatments?
I was diagnosed in 2018 with Adenocarcinoma. I had my prostate removed in 2019. PSA was low for while and then started to slowly rise. Early 2019 I had one injection of Leuprolide (Eligard) and after experiencing brutal hot flashes and flushing I started a daily dose of Androcur, which halted the hot flashes and flushing immediately . PSA stayed way low, like 0.01 or 0.02 and then last March or April I was informed that the Androcur was no longer available here in the Philippines, so I finished what I had in May. In Early June my PSA was 0.00 I always test at the same hospital lab) and then in late June I had an appointment with the VA and had my PSA there and it was 0.20 so my urologist had another test done in July and it was 0.29 and had another one inn August and it was 0.41 so in early September the doctor started me on Bicalutmide 50 mg. I took it for three days and had horrible side effects... dizzy, tired, heart palpitations and a feeling of general malaise. So the doc said stop taking it and we'll do a follow up PSA in November. I decided to change my diet and go full bore into it and follow a strict dietary regimen for prostate cancer. I started this morning (also forgot to mention that I had been eating a Filipino diet, lot's of bread, rice, beef, pork (AND FAT) etc, but complimented with veggies and fruit too) and I have been having slight pains in the gut and intestinal area, not always in the same place, which I think maybe was a gas issue. I went full veggie (pinto beans with cabbage, tomato, bell pepper and green beans) and fruit and vegetable smoothies (Soy milk and fresh fruit juice added) today, with Black seed oil, extra virgin olive oil, flax, Turmeric, Barley, Moringa, Beet root powder, Cinnamon, Black pepper mix that i made (I am a retired chef) and my stomach had no pain what so ever. I am waiting for more supplements to arrive in the mail, Saw Palmetto and Digestive enzymes and some more ground flax. I'll do some shopping tomorrow, I need lot's of Cruciferous veggies for this diet. I also ordered DIM ( Diindolylmethane) supplements. I hope this works.
What is your physical condition? Your weight and height? Do you exercise?
65 years old, 175-180 lbs and 5 ft 9 inches tall. I don't have an workout/exercise routine right now but I do walk a lot during the day and am up and down the stairs 15 to twenty times a day. I move a lot and am not sedentary for more than an hour at a time.
I see. What was your Gleason score?
You say you don’t have a workout or exercise routine ‘right now’? What does that mean? Not now but maybe soon?
The walking is good but if you’re not lifting weights at 65 years old you need to….‘right now’. This is regardless of the presence or absence of disease state and/or your diet.
I had a Gleason score of 7 and I just looked and can't find if it was 4 + 3 or 3 + 4. I definitely will start working out tomorrow. I am looking at my universal gym and stationary bike right now. I used to train MMA hard up until this cancer reared it's ugly head. The stress of not knowing is the worst part.
LOL! Everyone who doesn’t work out but knows they should says they used to kick ass and they’re starting tomorrow.
The stress of not knowing is not the worst part, except for that it makes no positive difference whatsoever. The worst part is that you’re 65 and chose to stop working out because you got cancer.
Some may see this view as unsympathetic. I see it as being real and offering help. If we stop working out when things get hard we are throwing away quality of life when we need it most.
I eat all of those things mentioned and more and would not leave treatment up to diet alone. I also exercise a lot and have none of the side effects you mention above. The only supplements I take are D, B12, calcium. I read a book by the founder of the Angiogenesis foundation I fou d interesting for its list of specific vegetables to eat, i.e. specific olive oil by origin, specific fish etc. Diversity is my intention now and a healthy gut biome. This is how I have decided to deal with my disease so only opinion. Good luck with yours but I would stick with some form of ADT if you can find a way if a cure is no longer an option.
Why haven't you had salvage radiation? You can try acupuncture, estrogen patches, Megace or venlafaxine for hot flashes.
I had a radical perineal prostatectomy in 2019 and have managed to keep my PSA below zero. At one point after the surgery my PSA started doubling so I took the Leuprolide with Androcur route. I have never heard of salvage radiation, please tell me more about it and if you have had it and what your experience was. Also the estrogen patches... are there side effects? The Leuprolide did the trick for almost two years but the hot flashes and flushing were brutal, that's why I started the Androcur, it stopped the side effects, but it is no longer available here. I am in the Philippines and I have a urologist from Asian Hospital and have been working strictly with him. At some point I want to also consult with a Oncologist to get a second opinion. So I am taking the dietary route (Veggies, fruits, beans grains, soy and almond milk) right now along supplements like DIM, Melatonin (at night) and I just received a bag of raw apricot seeds. Also taking Black seed oil, extra virgin coconut oil, hemp oil, ground flax seed. My last PSA was 0.41 and I will have another PSA in November. Please stay in touch ok? I value everyone's opinion here, good or bad, I'll listen.👍
You have to talk to a radiation oncologist
I will, if need be after my PSA in November
Post RP, detectable or recurrence threshold is .05ng. You are well beyond that indicating that with the Prostate gone, there is something present causing the PSA rise. You are currently approaching a good threshold for using ultra-sensitive PSMA scanning that would allow for identification of targets for RT as noted. But even absent targets great results have been shown from salvage therapy applied to the Prostate Bed and surrounding lymph nodes. Seeing a Radiation Oncologist or Medical Oncologist "now" is most prudent as TA has noted. Not setting up an appointment post November PSA. Early action is what has shown the best results.
Just thoughts...
Good Luck and Best Regards!
You can't defeat cancer unless a surgeon can successfully cut it all out. But you can put it into remission. I became a vegetarian days after being diagnosed. That was 29 years ago. It has been a battle. I have gone through surgery, radiation, ADT drugs and a mountain of supplements. My advice is use supplements in conjunction with standard medical treatments.
To start with supplements are like ADT drugs, after a while they stop working and you have to move on to another. Don't use more than one at a time. There are some supplements I have used during my many years. Vitamin D3, Green tea and garlic.
If you have any questions, let me know.
I had a radical perineal prostatectomy in 2019 and have managed to keep my PSA below zero. At one point after the surgery my PSA started doubling so I took the Leuprolide with Androcur route. The Leuprolide did the trick for almost two years but the hot flashes and flushing were brutal, that's why I started the Androcur, it stopped the side effects, but it is no longer available here. I am in the Philippines and I have a urologist from Asian Hospital and have been working strictly with him. At some point I want to also consult with a Oncologist to get a second opinion. So I am taking the dietary route (Veggies, fruits, beans grains, soy and almond milk) right now along supplements like DIM, Melatonin (at night) and I just received a bag of raw apricot seeds. Also taking Black seed oil, extra virgin coconut oil, hemp oil, ground flax seed. My last PSA was 0.41 and I will have another PSA in November. Please stay in touch ok? I value everyone's opinion here, good or bad, I'll listen.👍
Please tell me something, You said you have had surgery, radiation, ADT drugs, how long ago was that? And you became a vegetarian 29 years ago. At what point did the cancer go into remission and what is your protocol now? It sounds so promising that you have managed for 29 years since being diagnosed. This gives me hope.
My cancer has been in and out of remission since my surgery. When the surgery failed after 4 years, I had radiation to the prostate bed. When the radiation failed I went on casodex. When the casodex failed I went on a drug trial with zytiga. When zytiga failed I went on Provenge. Then I had a bone met and had salvage radiation. After that I went on another drug trial with xtandi. I was taken off the xtandi trial because of a rising PSA.
Throughout all of this I was taking various supplements, usually one at a time. I have been off all treatments since January. My PSA is elevated but stable.
Magnus,Off all treatments since January? 9 mos? How are you feeling? Has your T come back at all? I know you have broken many longevity records🙏.
Did you see TA’s post on Lynparza w Zytiga working for many, not just BRCA+.
All my best,
Mike
I am still feeling good, T still low, my PSA went up to 79, then dropped back down to 47 for some unknown reason. My research doctor thinks there may be some clinical trials coming up in Spring that are possibilities for me. I think I need to do some research on new supplements in the mean time.
Since I have been on Zytiga I don't think the Lynparza w Zytiga is possible for me.
We throw the book at at! Diet is therapeutic keto type (all organic veggies, berries, good sourced protein and no sugar or carbs for 5 years!). We have tools: infrared sauna, HBOT chamber, PEMF mat, light therapy, emotional therapy, meditation and exercise. High dose IV treatments, Germany or Canada every year for hyperthermia. TONS of supplements specifically targeted to his body and monitor labs every month! Inflammation markers. We still get the annual flare up. It’s BRCA2 & smart and figures us out. Just found out his bones are Worse and adrenal glands have mets on Tuesday.
Do everything! What have you got to loose?
Thank you for this reply, where do you get your protein? Right now I am relying on beans and veggies with protein. Is tofu ok?
beans too high in carbs. We only use Fermented soy products (non-GMO) like Tempeh and Miso. Otherwise good sourced salmon, turkey, chicken. Tried vegetarian but had to add good sourced fish and animal again to get enough. We just stay away from pork and shrimp type products (more toxic then most as bottom feeders). Eggs are controversial so back & forth but always good sourced.
Thank you for this reply, maybe beans once a week? Can you give me an example of one day's meal plan that you use?
after 1pm...smoothie with tons of veggies, olive oil, apple cider vinegar, etc.around 3pm...pili nuts mixed with 100% Santa Barbara organic chocolate chips and matcha green tea
around 5-6pm...salmon, veggies cooked in avocado oil/coconut oil
Lots of liquids, warm lemon water in AM, water with baking soda/salt and water with electrolytes in sauna, plus water with pectasol C 3x day.
Thank you again. I'm in the Philippines, I wish I could get fresh Salmon. I can get freshly caught ocean fish every day, tuna, tanigi, snapper etc. I'll try to incorporate some of what you suggested in to my diet.
My wife's mother went full vegetarian and lived on carrot juice smoothies for a 18 months before she died of breast cancer. Maybe she would have died sooner on a standard western diet.
Im fitter then anyone you know and am primarily vegetarian with a high protein intake (1.5 - 2 grams per kg of body weight) from fish, eggs and whey products.
Im currently undergoing chemo and still surf, kitesurf, lift weights, run etc. I will probably be dead in a 2 or 3 years, but will continue my good diet and exercise about 70 minutes a day. Every day.
So yes, good diet and exercise should be encouraged for all people. Healthy or sick.
Will it defeat your cancer? highly unlikely imo, but of course you should do it, as will I.
🥰Thank you for this reply, I lost both of my parents to cancer, one sibling and have three other siblings who all had cancer, including my brother who is dealing with it now. I will be exercising tomorrow. I'll take my morning news hour and lift light weights and hit the bike for 30 minutes for a starter. God bless you
I went through similar experience but found that lycopenes were the only thing that clearly showed any evidence of control. I am now 9 years from metastasis. Lupron has been my primary means of control. I do a little weight lifting and exercise. I suspect you have a more aggressive type of prostate cancer than I do. The key is low T. Diet has limited effect.
Try fisetin. 1500 mg 3X a day for 2 days every 2 weeks. After a couple of months get a PSA test. Nearly no side effects but my PSA did drop. Yours might too but realize what works for one person does not always work for another.
Where did you get info on trying this? All I can find is using it as a memory enhancer. Thanks.
Nalakratz brought fisetin to my attention so I read a lot of studies.
Started my research. Have found good info but nothing yet about dosing. Any link you have to that would be appreciated. Like you, I have my supplements that are backed by clinical trials, etc particular to prostate Cancer. The sulforophane study in France was great especially since it does dose, and product now avail in US on amazon so we can duplicate study. Modified Citrus Pectin also has specific studies with dosing. I use maintenance dose at 5g day. Melatonin, curcumin and so many other that should help and have data behind them. I use in conjunction with standard care with was RP and a couple years later SRT. 60 days out from that. Thanks for bring the fisetin up.
Fisetin is the strongest "senolytic" to be found. I can't remember thes tudies (google it) but for my body weight of 145 lbs 1500 mg 3X a day seemed appropriate. The kicker is- it worked, my PSA dropped significantly. Hopefully, it will work for you. At higher doses it makes my urine burn, not a lot-but some. Your milage will vary. Use it for a few months and get a PSA. Fisetin is not studied in this application so you must experiment.
Got it, Thanks.
Hey Philipino!
A mix of, a blending of conventional and alternative, is a smart decision. Trusted doctors will do what is immediately necessary. It is up to us to make changes that will give treatments some durability. You have already had and are still having (?) conventional treatment. It is good that you have changed your diet and will be making other changes to your lifestyle. Dr. Ruth Heidrich's story is inspiring. Don't back track on your changes.
I wish you the best,
Currumpaw
Plant-Based Diets Tied to Lower Risk for Aggressive Prostate CancerJody A. Charnow
Men in the highest quintile of overall plant-based food consumption had a significant 19% decreased risk of dying from prostate cancer compared with those in the lowest quintile, a study found.
Greater consumption of a plant-based diet, especially one that consists of a high intake of healthful plant-based foods, may be associated with a reduced risk for aggressive prostate cancer, according to data presented at the AUA2021 Virtual Experience.
In a study of 47,239 men in the prospective Health Professionals Follow-Up Study (1986-2014) cohort, those in the highest quintile of overall plant-based food consumption had a significant 19% decreased risk of dying from prostate cancer and a nonsignificant 22% and 17% decreased risk for advanced and lethal prostate cancer, respectively, compared with those in the lowest quintile, Stacy Loeb, MD, of NYU Langone Health in New York, New York, and colleagues reported.
The authors defined advanced prostate cancer as stage T3b/T4/N1/M1 disease at diagnosis and lethal prostate cancer as metastatic disease or death from prostate cancer.
Among men younger than 65 years, men in the highest quintile of healthful plant-based consumption had a statistically significant reduction by more than one-third in the risk of advanced prostate cancer, lethal prostate cancer, and death from prostate cancer compared with those in the lowest quintile, Dr Loeb’s team reported. The investigators found no association between healthful plant-based diets and prostate cancer among men aged 65 years or older.
“Plant-based diets have many well-documented benefits for health and the environment,” Dr Loeb said in an interview. “Our results show that consuming more plant-based foods is also prostate-healthy. Men at risk for prostate cancer should be counseled to increase consumption of plant-based foods to reduce the risk of aggressive disease.”
Of the 47,239 men in the study, 6655 were diagnosed with prostate cancer, including 515 with an advanced stage at diagnosis, 956 with lethal prostate cancer, and 806 who died from prostate cancer. Dr Loeb’s team calculated overall and healthful plant-based dietary indices from food frequency questionnaires completed by study participants.
Healthful plant-based foods included whole grains, fruits, vegetables, nuts, legumes, vegetable oils, tea, and coffee. Unhealthful plant-based foods included fruit juices, potatoes, refined grains, and sugar-sweetened beverages.
In addition to Dr Loeb, the team of investigators included Benjamin C. Fu, PhD, MPH, Scott R. Bauer, MD, MS, Clair H. Pernar, ScD, MPH, June M. Chan, ScD, Erin L. Van Blarigan, ScD, Edward L. Giovannucci, MD, ScD, Stacey A. Kenfield, ScD, and Lorelei A. Mucci, ScD, MPH.
Reference
Loeb S, Fu BC, Bauer SR, Pernar CH, et al. Association of plant-based dietary patterns with prostate cancer risk. Presented at: AUA2021 Virtual Experience held September 10-13, 2021. Poster MP32-06.
Thank you, I really appreciate this information.
My husband has been a vegan but with whole foods plant baed diet with a lot of mushrooms, moderate amount of tofu tempeh since his diagnosis. His overall health continues to be good and he has an exercise regime over and above walking the pooch. His diagnosis was of aggressive type Gleason 8. He is also using low salt, no sugar and v negligible oils. He enjoys his foods and says that everything tastes better when you get away from masking the flavours with high salt or fat. He can cook well and eats a variety of raw vegetables in his diet too. This is a personal choice - I would not suggest to another person to follow it but if someone wants to see what happens with a change in diet, I am very supportive. There is a lot of research out there on a healthy diet supporting gut microbiome with high fibre and high diversity. What is there to lose? He is on various standard medications to deal with cancer but has low side effects from them. As soon as he went vegan after diagnosis and before the standard treatment started, he experienced relief from pain in his hip mets. So that was enough motivation to keep up with things and he does not think of his diet as a sacrifice of anything. He enjoys what he eats.
Prospective Health Professionals Follow-Up Study...
So a study that looked at and cherry picked data to support a preconceived conclusion. No controls, no actual study, just selected data provided by questionnaires from patients and excluding other data.
For instance, what did the subjects eat? Where they sourced from the same farm(s)? We're the same calories obtained from the same sources. How many meals from each type of food? How long where they consuming said diet? Again, food, is highly subjective when in any way trying to associate Heath benefits to it as there are simply way too many variables. Even so much as how it was stored and prepared prior to consumption.
The wording also appears to lend the conclusion that with the diagnosis, a subsequent change to the diet created a 1/3 less chance at advanced or lethal cancer ... Is pretty irresponsible an assumption without actually providing supporting data! Other than the association of outcomes for those cancer patients noted without, for example, also listing what treatments they had!? Because there's not a chance those numbers used were all patients that had forgone any type of treatment or absent treatment. So the entire conclusion that "diet" alone, or was contributory in creating the outcome is false. Especially if you consider advanced patients who are assured some form of treatment.
But if it's something you want to do, go for it! My opinion is not to discourage, but to highlight the obvious issues with this information that is repeatedly recirculated.
I agree with Tall_Allen a Radiation Oncologist is needed & is your next best move.
I am a diet advocate and believe the diets in the populations of most modern countries have seriously deteriorated & associated with this deterioration is disease. That said, to my knowledge, there is no definite evidence diet will CURE EXISTING Prostate Cancer ..... there is some population evidence which suggests lifelong diet changes might MITIGATE the number of Prostate Cancers in a population but no evidence of a cure and MIGHT enhance treatment.
Additionally, PIN (Prostatic Intraepithelial Neoplasia), a precursor to Prostate Cancer in many cases, is seen as early as the 3rd decade of life (20 to 30 years old) and therefore, when Prostate Cancer has been diagnosed it has likely been a long time developing. ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...
In a Prostate Cancer patient, to expect to REVERSE/CURE these cellular differentiation changes leading to a full blown cancer, which have begun a long time ago, with diet only is likely magical thinking.
The above being said, diet CAN improve/mitigate other conditions/diseases (e.g., arteriosclerosis) and will not hurt, and might improve your prognosis and therefore should be pursued.
I said all the above to say this:
----MOST IMPORTANT -- see a Radiation Oncologist
----NEXT -- make your dietary changes but do not expect them BY THEMSELVES to cure your cancer but to be 1 part of a multi-faceted solution (e.g., others might include, Radiation of the pelvis, additional sleep & meditation to calm yourself).
For for a generally good diet I suggest you might look at:
One can plug a topic into the search bar & find short research based discussions of the value of nutrition relative to the subject.
If one decides to become vegan be sure to have a source of vitamin B12 & Omega 3 fatty acids (EPA & DHA).
Just my thoughts, yours may differ.
Philipino, This is the best response and advice thus far to your questions, take care.
in reply to rscic
I agree, great response.
in reply to rscic
Wonderful!
I agree with you, I have PC gleason 9 in 80% of prostate. This disease has been long time coming like you indicated above. My highest PSA was 14.4 the PSA has dropped to 2.0 after being on Casedox 50 mg for 2 months. Not sure if this medication will reduce the tumors for operation?
I am glad I might be able to contribute
Pay attention to the post by rscic. Your only possible chance for a cure would be salvage radiation treatments to the prostate bed and pelvic lymph nodes. And this supported by a period of ADT to help the radiation kill the cancer cells.No diet, no supplements can do that. They are supportive but not curative. Please don’t delay doing other things. Go consult a RO as soon as possible.
Diet may reduce the risk factors associated with cancer and other diseases and it's always a good idea to eat healthy. But there is big difference between lowing the risk factors and treating disease.
From what I can see, it looks like your best option is salvage radiation and ADT. Looks like you still have a window of opportunity, but the effectiveness of the treatments is best if done earlier.
Yes there are side effects with all treatments, but you have to decide if you want to do the "diet route" (no treatment) or get treatment and deal with the side effects.
There are plenty of people here who will tell you what to hear regarding diet and supplement non-treatments. Just remember: They are not the ones risking their lives if you follow their advice, you are.
Unless one has avoided all other treatments for PC, how can one respond in the affirmative to this question?
Diets and supplements are a slippery slope. I take a BroccoMax every once in a while. I do take Celebrex every day. I walk to the refrigerator a lot. That's about it.
Balut............
Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.
j-o-h-n Thursday 09/23/2021 11:18 PM SAT
If it was at all possible to cure cancer by food, it would be recommended for everyone. Get treatment from the experts i.e. MO.
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