What are your experiences with memory issues?

[mmcaulay]

I recently had a very bad experience during a job interview that resulted from a bit of a misunderstanding and a couple of my ADHD symptoms. I find that while I can remember the "gist" of things, I can't access the details of my memories off the top of my head.

I've worked as a programmer for 30 years now, and what I've found is that while in the context of the work, I can access those memories in depth. On the rare occasions I can't, I easily remember enough to find something online to refresh my memory in minutes.

I had informed the recruiter about some of these issues and had noted that if I was going to have a technical interview, I'd need an accommodation that didn't rely on the kind of memory access I don't really have. Unfortunately, due to a bit of a disconnect between the recruiter and the interviewer, the second half of the interview was exactly the kind I'd said I'd be unable to pass. It was made worse due to performance anxiety, and my brain completely locked up.

I'm still working with them to sort out the mess it's left in terms of impressions it's left with some of the staff, but my reason for bringing it up here was to ask if people had found similar memory "access," issues. Especially related to details in demand.

Of course, what's truly crazy is that one does not need to have one's memory operate in the way the interview tests for to do the job. I've had a fairly solid career and have found my own ways of working. I'm actually generally known for being quite quick at my work, in part due to my parallel thinking and the intuitive understanding it often provides me.

So, I'd really love to hear your experiences with memory and difficulties accessing it under various conditions. I guess I'm curious how common this is, and maybe someone has had some accommodations provided that might help me out with this.

Thanks for any feedback you have!

[STEM_Dad]

Memory recall issues are fairly common with ADHD. I have such issues that I experience frequently, and it was much worse for me before I started on ADHD medication.

Similar to you, I remember enough about something to be able to look it up quite quickly. But unless it is a process which I have done dozens of times, I cannot relate it verbatim.

I work in information technology, service desk support. I have found my strengths to be customer service and systems thinking. I can visualize how users, teams, systems, software, networks, and data all interrelate. However, I tend to have a poor memory for specific details. I'm a Big Picture thinker.

(I can remember much of my own life in great narrative detail, but I cannot remember conversations with any great accuracy.)

In one job that I help for several years, I was part of a hiring team for a computer help desk. One leader for the hiring team some of those years purposefully added questions that would have completely stumped me when I interviewed for my job there. I knew the terms used in the questions and I knew the gist of what they meant, but I wouldn't have been able to answer them inaccurate detail.

I explained this one time to that manager, and I told him that for entry level technicians we were unlikely to find anyone who could answer then completely. He then confided in me that those questions were a pressure test, to see how the candidates think on their feet, because that is what we have to do daily in that kind of work. He wasn't looking for accuracy, he was testing how they face a challenge and how they go about their thought process when they did.

Have you watched the movie Captain America: The First Avenger? If so, do you remember how Steve Rogers was selected to become Captain America? He was the only soldier among the candidates who threw himself on top of a grenade to save his fellow soldiers. (It was a dummy grenade, for training purposes, but Steve and his fellow soldiers didn't know that.) That's an extreme example of a candidate selection pressure test, but very memorable.

[mmcaulay in reply to STEM_Dad]

Thanks for sharing! In terms of pressure tests, I think this can be a bit dangerous because there are different kinds of pressure, and making sure it's the kind the person is actually going to be facing versus a proxy can cause candidates to fail out despite being able to handle the pressures of the actual job.

I freeze up when I have to program in front of people. But that isn't a part of my job, but it is a part of the technical interview. The kind of pressure in the job is tight deadlines, presentations to clients, interteam conflicts, etc. I do very well in all of those. But when someone is watching me fumble my way through trying to remember the exact syntax, my brain totally locks up.

I also make sure that if I'm doing pair programming, I'm not the one typing. I can provide insights etc. on the fly, no problem, but I can't be the one who has to type exactly what's right. This and the memory issue have created a significant problem in landing this job. There are some other issues at play that have nothing to do with me, but honestly, especially because I'd been clear about my limitations, it's the worst interview experience I've had in my entire life. I sounded like I didn't understand anything about programming because I'd totally locked up after failing to remember the exact syntax and definition for a particular bit of functionality in C#. I don't blame them, but it's been hard to put it behind me, as I wait for them to figure out if they are going to hire me or not. As I said, there is another issue currently blocking that, but it obviously hasn't been the most comfortable month. :\

[G7BK]

Sorry to hear you went through that especially after a 30 year career. That can't have been easy.

I run a design firm, and I believe there is a personality type (not always but mainly) for diffrent roles, i.e. designers have very scattered thinking and are usually diagnosed with dyslexia, but thats there job they are perfectly suited, the copywriters often talk too much, again, their job and good at words, the art directors are innapropriate, again pushing the boundaries is their job like a comedian would, and developers are not always but often very inteligent and very deep thinkers that dont want to have small talk but talk about large subjects in great detail when they have the time, at the right time.

What i'm getting at is, maybe that company wasnt for you anyway, ive had many interviews where in retrospect ive realised it was them not me! The best was 'are you ok doing a computer test' after seeing my portfolio of rebrands for well known international clients with references from well known agencies.

As for memory, THE ONLY thing that works for me is exercise, i would never have an important meeting with a client or an interview if i hadnt been running or working out either the night before or ideally the morning of the interview. my brain would just be too sluggish to recall important information with or without meds, plus i would be too nervous, i'd probably also meditate these days and stay away from all carbs that make me sluggish, drink water without wetting myself! and maybe drop an espresso, basically hack myself to the absolute limit, then i would have a script of affirmations like 'i belong here, i have done this and much much more many times, it is them that will bennefit from me' its my work that matters, I will never play the victim, I am good enough becuase…'

For me my memory suffers from biology, but also not facing up to my natural nerves and addressing them directly, aka whatever I resist, persists', and all that.

You may do all of the above, but maybe there is something there. But like my first point, if i was hiring you, I wouldnt in a million years put a developer on the spot light because your not a showman, your a deeply focussed inteligent individual and thats why i would be hiring you, would look at your code, then get one of my developers to look at your code, then i would be interested to see how you got on with the developers and the digital account manager and give you a trial, who cares if you can code on a stage-like situation, whats next x-factor, ridiculous.

Bill Gates has adhd, and after a 30 year career im sure any business would be more than happy to have someone like you on their team.

Also I may be ranting now but, do they expect you to rember the whole of github too? Forget about them mate, the whole worlds a mess becuase of this kind of stuff. illogical nonsense.

I wish you luck in meeting the right people/right role.

G

[LuisBarcelona]

Sorry about that! A big hug and let's go for your next interview!! Good luck! This was not your job and as you have shown in 30 years of profession, of course you can do it.

In my case, anxiety is my last name and it happens to me very frequently when things don't work out, anxious symptoms begin to appear (heat in my body and sweating )and of course among them the mind blockage, but I think that many people before a job interview experience anxiety and mind blockage.

Exercising before if I'm very active or doing meditation, guided relaxation, connecting with my people help me a lot. And prepare it with the script that I would like to say and what I shouldn't. In my case I would not explain my difficulties in advance, without they know all my virtues, like a date ;))

Regarding my memory issues, I try to solve my evocation difficulties with a good systemic preparation of the content, retaining an outline "big picture and sense of connection "and with the support of slides or lists, but I have some many difficulties as well. I don't know if you can use these tools in your job.

Good analytical thinking, interpersonal skills, empathy and communication are my strengt points and help me. I like when we focus on our strengthens.

[N8-The-SK8]

This is definitely a post that hits pretty close to home for me. My working memory is awful, the channels are always changing and I don't have the remote. I've come to understand that a lot of my social-anxiety is rooted in that fact. I can't tell you how many times I've gotten flustered just by somebody asking me what I did today...... A lot of the time, impromptu conversational engagement of any kind from other people makes me feel like I'm in a pop quiz with my pants down in front of the class because I don't have the answer "queued up".

I'm trying to get better at learning to breathe/ slow down and it's definitely taking work but it feels good to at least try.

For what it's worth, you are far from alone here my friend

[mmcaulay in reply to N8-The-SK8]

I really appreciate this.

In terms of people asking how your day is, etc. I've actually developed a horrible masking behavior where I'm constantly mentally interrupting what I'm doing to inventory the day. I've always felt that terror of being caught without an answer. Thanks 4th grade teacher! I'm sort of kidding, as I know it's not just down to a few incidents from back then, but it's been incredibly hard to back away from this. I'm lucky that I'm fairly productive, as this level of interruption would have definitely tanked my career. My mind wants to dive deep into what I'm working on, like most of us.

I started working on getting rid of this behavior about a year and a half ago. I'm learning to make peace with the fact I might not have a salient answer at the drop of a hat, and that's ok. Things like this are why I want to see awareness raised in the workplace. It's so much part of work culture to drop by someone's desk and ask what they've been working on today. At least in most firms with large development teams there is an awareness that it's not good to interrupt programmers while they work, but it would be great if it didn't cause issues if you just said, "not sure, focused right now."

Thanks for speaking up and commiserating.