Undiagnosed kids changing from homeschool to public school

[STEM_Dad]

My kids are 8 and 10. They've both been homeschooled by their mom since kindergarten, but she has recently admitted that she can't keep up with homeschooling. We have both agreed to put the kids into public school. (We are recently divorced, and she has custody during the week, while I have weekends and one evening each week.)

TL;DR - I want to get them assessed for ADHD, but I expect their mom to fight me in it. Should I try to insist on the assessment first, or see how the kids do in school first?

* Daughter seems inattentive.

* Son seems impulsive, mildly inattentive, but had definite emotional disregulation issues.

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I have Inattentive ADHD, and I believe both of the kids do, too. My 8 year old daughter has inattentive traits, similar to me at that age. She seems to be mildly affected, but I don't know how it might affect her in a public school setting.

My 10 year old son seems to me too have the Combined presentation, or perhaps Hyperactive-Impulsive, with a few Inattentive traits. For him, the most prominent ADHD trait is actually emotional disregulation, going back to age 6. He's the one in really concerned about.

* She reminds me a bit of myself at that age, and also like our 20 year old son, who grew up to have all the same ADHD traits as me (still undiagnosed, but I've been encouraging him to get assessed).

* He reminds me a lot of our older daughter (my stepdaughter, now 29), who struggled a lot in school starting at age 12. She also had a lot of emotional disregulation, and her hyperactivity was more noticeable, but her mom refused to ever believe she has ADHD. (Guess what, eldest daughter recently said her doctor thinks she has ADHD. She just hasn't arranged for an assessment yet.)

Their mom and I have been divorced a little over a year.

We get along well, but she didn't originally believe my ADHD diagnosis (I got diagnosed at 45, only 2½ years ago), even though she regularly commented on my regular struggles (which turned out to be due to ADHD) for our entire 20 year marriage.

* She is stubborn, and had won every disagreement or argument that we've ever had. She's got to get her way, and will only admit that she was wrong when her plans completely fail.

* She's a "mama bear", and will fight for her kids, but thinks she's always right.

.....

I want to get the kids assessed for ADHD, as they're going into school. I think they will need accomodations. I think our son might even need medication. He's concerned me recently, because when he gets really upset, he starts yelling and wants to hit things, and has said that sometimes he's so mad that he wants to punch people. He bottles up his feelings as his mom's house (she's the strict disciplinarian type of parent), and he unleashes them at mine (I use a gentler, more understanding approach to parenting, which can make me a pushover sometimes).

I'm willing to put up a fight, but I think that I'll need her help with the assessment, to fill out the parent questionnaire. So, I don't think it will help if I try to do this alone.

[Hominid711]

Fascinating post. I love dysfunctional family stuff - when it affects others haha. Not funny I know but getting more matter-of-factly with my own. And less forgiving. Wife sounds like my sister. A right Grizzly! And throws the kids into the argument whenever it suits her and especially where it so doesn't fit 🥴😡🤬🤔🤒🤔🤐😮‍💨🤯I don't get how parents even consider homeschooling their offspring. It's 2023. It's potentially severely limiting a child's freedom and potential. And deprives them of the beauty of potentially really important friendships and how to spot the enemy type skills. Also, for kids escaping home to school can be a lifeline. This is well documented. Evidence can be provided on request. And besides, what puzzles me endlessly, how can a parent possibly think of themself as being equivalent or better(!?!?!) to a studied teacher?? Sorry, but this topic really always does my head in. I find it alternatingly self-centred, narcissistic, antisocial and cruel. As a kid I would probably have run away had my parents done this to me and very likely would have started self-harming. Or behaving to the point where I would have come to serious harm. Run into the street without a care or broken glass or thrown things. The ADHD on its own was hard enough, corporal punishment, although on its way out, was still the order of the day in more traditional schools and families and accidents were pre-programmed. Your son might be reacting, too. At best homeschooling, in my opinion, and if decided by a parent/parents going it alone, is ill-informed, misjudged and at worst it's, frankly, abuse. As mentioned above, evidence of the importance of school exists.

If I was you I'd not necessarily discuss everything with the wife. I would alert the teachers to my thoughts and ask them to feed back to me personally if they can agree. Mention your ADHD, the very strong evidence of genetics after 40y odd of scientific research, your observations of your children's behaviour, that your wife disagrees but that you are concerned and that after all the kids' welfare has to come before all other considerations. That the school must agree with. I can't imagine they wouldn't. As far as it concerns pulling in the same direction as divorced parents it's your wife (by the sound of it) who makes agreements difficult and this not to the advantage of your children, so you don't have to go out of your way to find common ground. Where it's clearly better for your children that you do, then yes, obviously; but not where it just means mollifying the ex-half carnivore. Stand straight for your kids, show the wife some responsible father spine and resist in this particular case. This is about your children. Public school sounds great for them and if teachers know to watch out for signs of ADHD, fights, bullying, etc even better! They might be quite knowledgeable anyway and if you feel they aren't then speak with the head or whoever ist best suited. You can also liaise with your children's doctor. ADHD is a medical condition. They then can communicate with the school nurse etc. or whoever sorts through this in the US. So, several options here but important to preempt surprises/avoid kids' disappointment at all cost in my opinion. Nothing better here for them than an easy start.

Best of luck! I mean it!! And sorry for rambling, preaching, digressing, not making sense or being unreasonably aggressive etc. I have a thing about children and their welfare and especially since I felt we -sibs and I - were trapped in our childhood home. Obvious isn't it? Many times I wanted to run but something held me back making the trap even worse, desperation more futile. Probably the knowledge that they would send me back home again anyway. So I waited and cried, cried, screamed, calmed down and waited.

[STEM_Dad in reply to Hominid711]

Why do people homeschool in this day and age? Here's a few reasons:

I was "lost in the crowd" in public school...I did alright, though.

My ex-wife was failed by the system.

Our older two kids (now both adults) both had lots of issues with teachers, bullies, and other stuff I'd rather not go through again, even though they were attending school in "one of the best school districts in America".

My younger kids moved with their mom to a new part of the country after the divorce. (I followed, to be closer, to make co-parenting much easier.) So, now in a different school district than the one that failed our family so badly (and a lot wiser from the experience), I think it's worth giving public school a try again.

[Onthemove1971]

Thanks for joining the group!It would be best to start with your kids doctor, who can start the process. A diagnosis of ADHD is considered a medical condition and therefore starts with the medical system. If you need examples of what we went through you can ask.

If your children are diagnosed with ADHD ( both attentive and non attentive), you can then bring that documentation to the school and either request an educational plan or start the assement for help. It would be great if you could explain what struggles they have now so they know what to look for.

Hope this helps! It is a process and we are here to help. If you have time, I find the previous questions from the list very helpful. There are outstanding discussions about many topic that could help you.

Again.. welcome.

[STEM_Dad in reply to Onthemove1971]

Thanks for your input. My kids don't have a new doctor yet, but hopefully will soon. I'm navigating a new healthcare system, getting familiar with a new part of the country.

I've got a doctor in the town where I work, and he's still accepting patients, so maybe I can convince my ex-wife to have the kids seen by the same doctor. (That would make family history on my part easier... since his practice already has my records. It would also make billing easier.)

[Imakecutebabies]

If you would like to get your wife on board, perhaps you could ask the school to relate any concerns about ADHD to your wife, as an appeal to authority. This may take time, though, and the process to obtain accommodations will also take time...

That being said, I'm sure that one parent filling out the parent questionnaire would be sufficient. You will need to get a referral from their doctor to a child psychologist to complete the diagnosis.

[STEM_Dad in reply to Imakecutebabies]

I think it depends on the state, the health plan, and the doctor.I live in a state which specifies that an ADHD evaluation can be made by "a licensed clinician, such as a pediatrician, psychologist, or psychiatrist with expertise in ADHD."

The rural area that I live in doesn't seem to have any child psychologists, just a few general psychologists and two overworked psychiatrists. The nearest child psychiatrists are each about 50 miles away, in opposite directions. We live over 90 miles from the nearest city.

[Aloysia]

With both of my kids, the diagnosis process was to have each parent fill out a form about the kid's behavior, the teacher fill out a form about the kid's behavior, and the parents together fill out a health history form. Then since we have Kaiser insurance, they observe the kid one evening at Kaiser in a group setting while asking them to do a puzzle, a worksheet, etc. First find out what the process is with your pediatrician. If it's similar to above, then your ex would be filling out the teacher form as well as a parent form and that is not likely to be accurate given her disavowment of ADHD (as well as her inability to compare your kids to their peers in a classroom setting). You might want to wait until they have been in school for a couple of months before getting the forms filled out. I agree with the other poster who suggested cluing the teachers in on your history of ADHD and your concern that your kids might have it too.

Wishing you the best!

[STEM_Dad in reply to Aloysia]

Great idea about informing the teachers about my history of ADHD, and my concerns about the kids.

I do want them to form their own opinion about my kids, based on their observations and expertise.

After all, I might be experiencing confirmation bias. I have ADHD, and it's almost a certainty that my 20 year old does (because he has all my ADHD traits, just about as prominently as I do).

But I might just be making too much of what I see in the younger kids.

[Hidden]

I’d say now that the kids will be at school I’d give the teachers the chance to observe without preconceived ideas about the kids.

I’d give it a chance without the diagnosis and without even telling the teachers what you suspect. Give it let’s say a term and then see the report cards and see what’s happening with the behaviour etc, how they cope during the break times etc. It may then turn out that the teachers will start reporting stuff back and hinting that it’s ADHD. And then you don’t have to fight with your ex wife. Also it may turn out that once she sees those report cards etc she will realise that the diagnosis may be helpful.

[STEM_Dad in reply to Hidden]

But do you think it's important that I let them know that there's a family history of ADHD? (By which I mean my history.)

I know that early diagnosis and intervention can make a big difference in a person's life.

[Hidden in reply to STEM_Dad]

I’d say yes share with the school that there is a family history of ADHD, don’t disclose too much yet, like that you have it. You could ask the teacher to look out fit this and tell that you can see this in your children, You can point out that ‘inattentive’ type is often overlooked and that you don’t want your daughter to be falling behind with the schoolwork only because she is just sitting there quietly. Also you should explain about the impulsiveness of your son and how you worry how it can affect how he assimilate in the new school environment and with new class mates, how it can impact on him developing friendships etc.

You don’t need a diagnosis for this first step. Then later you can point out to the teachers that your wife is in denial about this and maybe school can get through to her.

Do stuff step by step. See what you think about the teachers and the SEN coordinator. Ask what the school has for kids to help them with executive skills, emotional regulation, friendships etc.

You see it’s easy for me to say. I never do stuff step by step and always disclose too much too quickly without assessing situations 😄 And then all goes to s…

[MaudQ in reply to Hidden]

Seconding this strategy. Our kid switched from a small Montessori school to public school and once there were clear expectations and standards, everything started falling into place. Her first school was smoothing the way without actually helping her. I wonder if you could give the new school a semester or so: focus on helping your kids with the social transition - which will be a lot. You can build your relationship with them by being a sympathetic ear, acknowledging their feelings and modeling acceptance of your own strengths and weaknesses. Maybe also a bit of time where you and your ex-wife can work together on learning the ropes of a new school (homework, after school activities, friends). Just so you’re not in conflict from the start? Then once realities at school start to play out you can take it from there. The school district can do their own assessments. If you trust them, it’s a lot cheaper and easier than finding a private practice (also though we miraculously found a place that took insurance to do our kid’s last assessment). One last thing: I have ADHD myself and honestly, just being open about my struggles and having a sense of humor is huge. It doesn’t fix my kid’s life but I believe that having a parent who isn’t perfect but is trying really helps.

[STEM_Dad in reply to MaudQ]

Yeah, I have ADHD too, but wasn't diagnosed until 2020, when I was 45. It's been hard muddling my way through life and not understanding why everything was such a struggle.

I want better for my kids. That's my main motivation in all this.

But, since my diagnosis, I've been absorbing all the information that I can about ADHD... which is why I see the traits in my kids' behavior, but their mom doesn't. (Honestly, I think she has mild ADHD, too. She has always been impulsive...we met in 8th grade, and back then she seemed pretty hyper, too.)

[Onthemove1971]

It would be a great idea to get the diagnosis done before you start them in public school. While a general education teacher can fill out a survey on classroom behavior. Coming with paperwork with not only their diagnosis, but what things they need in a classroom ( for us this what his child psychiatrist) really sets the stage for getting them services.

When you register them, ask what that schools process is for that school- they may refer you to someone more specialized who know how the services work.

Only specialized professionals are able to write a specific plan ( either a 504 plan or IEP) both can be done with 1 or 2 parents. The important thing is to give the school the information before they start.

Hope this helps.

[NYCmom2]

In New York City (perhaps the state of NY in general) you simply need to write an email to the coordinator of services at the public school stating you’d like your child assessed. They must respond within 10 days and confirm they’re scheduling an assessment.

[Onthemove1971 in reply to NYCmom2]

The assessment period for this school year is up. All assessment will need to wait until 23-24 school year. Just in case this is happening now..

Just an FYI. Everything has an official time line.

[STEM_Dad in reply to Onthemove1971]

Thanks for letting me know that. I should have expected as much. (20 years ago, I was an office aide for the special education department at a charter school, and it was my job to schedule the assessments.)

[Onthemove1971 in reply to STEM_Dad]

Thank you for the time you spent helping the special education community. Yes, specialist need adequate time to assess.

There is a horriable shortage, if you need a job. Good people are hard to find.

Best to you as you travel this journey

[STEM_Dad in reply to Onthemove1971]

I went from that office aide job, to being a full time math tutor (classed as a teaching assistant) at that school. At the time, I thought I'd like to become a math teacher...but my plans didn't work out. (I eventually wound up working in Information Technology.)

I'm thinking about getting certified as an ADHD coach, for a sideline income, but have to figure out how we pay the thousands of dollars for the certification program.

But at the same time, I want to finish my bachelor's degree, and just found out that my employer has a tuition assistance program... So I'm likely to focus on that first.

[Onthemove1971 in reply to STEM_Dad]

Since I work as a Specialist in the school system, I know how hard it is to work on getting the desired degree while having a life. I am thankful I was able to earn the necessary credentials.

I also know how amazing it feels to provide special instruction to generations of kids.

I have also traveled the journey of having a child with ADHD who has been educated in the public school.

Please reach out if you feel you need any help, getting advice from someone who has traveled this path helps a lot.

I am so thankful to be with a group of amazing supportive care providers. Many times when I struggled, I knew this group was there to support me.

Best to you!

[LAJ12345]

she might be scared they will be put on drugs?

Why not try Multinutrient and dietary changes first? My son is 20 and has been taking these for 6 months now and they have really helped, and my friends son has been taking them since he was 7 and is now 17 and he can’t function without them.

Watch some of these videos. This stuff has years of clinical trials and is well worth a trial.

hardynutritionals.com/video...

Also remove as many foods as you can that have additives in them like artificial flavourings and colours. If you wife is worried about drugs she might more keen on natural interventions.

read through this post

healthunlocked.com/adhd-par...

[LAJ12345]

if you have a spare 40 minutes this podcast is well worth a listen.

youtube.com/watch?v=s1t5UrQ...(Not working as expected?)

“Why ADHD Is Not A Psychiatric Disorder Or Brain Disease” by Dr Mark Hyman.