Results are in

[Underactiveclare]

Good afternoon. I've just got my results back from Randox. Can anyone give me any idea what this means?

Thank you in advance!

[SeasideSusie Remembering]

Underactiveclare

I understand from looking at your profile that you are diagnosed with an underactive thyroid. Presumably you are on Levo?

The above results are showing elevated TPO andTg antibodies which confirm that the cause of your hypothyroid is autoimmune, known to patients as Hashimoto's and to doctors as autoimmune thyroid disease.

Hashi's is where the immune system attacks and gradually destroys the thyroid.

I haven't read through your previous posts so I don't know whether you knew that you have Hashi's. Here is some information about Hashi's (in case you don't already have it).

Fluctuations in symptoms and test results are common with Hashi's.

Most doctors dismiss antibodies as being of no importance and know little or nothing about Hashi's and how it affects the patient, test results and symptoms. It would be best to read, learn, understand and help yourself where Hashi's is concerned.

Some members have found that adopting a strict gluten free diet can help, although there is no guarantee.

Gluten contains gliadin (a protein) which is thought to trigger autoimmune attacks so eliminating gluten can help reduce these attacks.

You don't need to be gluten sensitive or have Coeliac disease for a gluten free diet to help.

Gluten/thyroid connection: chriskresser.com/the-gluten...

stopthethyroidmadness.com/h...

stopthethyroidmadness.com/h...

hypothyroidmom.com/hashimot...

thyroiduk.org.uk/tuk/about_...

Supplementing with selenium l-selenomethionine 200mcg daily is said to help reduce the antibodies, as can keeping TSH suppressed.

Hashi's and gut absorption problems tend to go hand in hand and can very often result in low nutrient levels or deficiencies. It's essential to test Vit D, B12, Folate and Ferritin and address any problems.

The aim of a treated hypo patient on Levo only, generally, is for TSH to be 1 or below with FT4 and FT3 in the upper part of their reference ranges.

Assuming that you followed our advised protocol for testing, ie no later than 9am with nothing to eat or drink except water before the test, last dose of Levo 24 hours before test and leaving off biotin, B Complex or any supplement containing biotin for 3-7 days before test, then your TSH is just about OK but wouldn't hurt to be lower, your FT4 is 48.45% through range with FT3 is 50.81% through range. FT4 and FT3 are well balanced but there is room for them to be higher in range so you could increase your Levo, initially by 12.5mcg daily to see what that does, maybe a little more if necessary.

[Underactiveclare in reply to SeasideSusie]

Thank you so much for this seaside Susie. I didn’t know that I have Hashimotos. I have been experiencing tiredness, brain fog, very shaky hands and body, temperature fluctuations and night sweats. I went to gp who tested tsh and told me I am fine. I’ve started taking vitamin d and b12 drops. I’m not noticing a lot of difference. Been taking vitamin d for a couple of months and b12 for a couple of weeks. I’m 40 and really want to have energy and lose weight. I still can’t believe I had to get a private test done to find out.

[SeasideSusie Remembering in reply to Underactiveclare]

Have you got recent results for Vit D, B12, Folate and Ferritin?

[Underactiveclare in reply to SeasideSusie]

these are my blood results for all recent tests.

Results

[SeasideSusie Remembering in reply to Underactiveclare]

How much Vit D are you taking? Do you also take Vit K2-MK7 and magnesium, these are important cofactors when taking D3.

Did you check for B12 deficiency before starting your B12? Signs/symptoms listed here:

b12deficiency.info/signs-an...

b12d.org/submit/document?id=46

Some people with a B12 in the 300s have been found to need B12 injections.

When taking B12 we also need a B Complex to keep all the B vitamins balanced. Are you taking a B Complex?

Ferritin results can be misleading. Ferritin rises with inflammation so it's always useful to test CRP (an inflammation marker) at the same time. If CRP shows inflammation then ferritin could be falsely raised due to inflammation. Hashi's can cause inflammation.

[Underactiveclare in reply to SeasideSusie]

I don’t take anything other than the vitaminD (photo), b12 drops and fish oil. Other medication is fluoxetine(I don’t think I should’ve been upped on this-think it was an easy answer to my symptoms), cerazette and loratadine.

I got the B12 injections a couple of years back but they were happy with my levels so stopped them. I asked for them again recently and they said I didn’t need them.

I can’t believe that I cannot just go to my gp and have them fix it. It’s very disappointing.

Thank you so much for your support. I would be lost without this group.

Vitamin D box

[SeasideSusie Remembering in reply to Underactiveclare]

So, do you take one of those tablets daily, ie 1,000iu D3?

Unfortunately I've nothing good to say about Vitabiotics. They do a lot of advertising but it doesn't mean to say they're good. Looking at their ingredient list I'd personally run a mile

Bulking Agents: Microcrystalline Cellulose & Pregelatinised Starch, Vitamin D3 (Cholecalciferol), Polyvinylpolypyrrolidone, Tablet Coating (Hydroxypropylmethylcellulose, Isomalt, Medium Chain Trigylcerides, Colour [Calcium Carbonate]), Anti-Caking Agents: Purified Talc, Magnesium Stearate & Silicon Dioxide, Hydroxypropylcellulose, Polyvinylpyrrolidone.

Who needs all that when you can buy clean supplements containing just D3 and extra virgin olive oil for absorption?

D3 is fat soluble so needs fat to be absorbed. Tablets are the least absorbable form of D3. Do you take yours with some form of fat, ie with a fatty meal, or cheese, or full fat yogurt, etc?

Do you take your D3 4 hours away from your Levo?

Your Vit D level in February was 39nmol/L, that is dire.

You might want to check out a recent post that I wrote about Vit D and supplementing:

healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...

and you can check out the link to how to work out the dose you would have needed to increase that level to the recommended level.

39nmol/L = 15.6ng/ml

On the Vit D Council's website

web.archive.org/web/2019070...

you would scroll down to the 2nd table

My level is between 10-20 ng/ml

The Vit D Council, the Vit D Society and Grassroots Health all recommend a level of 100-150nmol/L (40-60ng/ml), with a recent blog post on Grassroots Health mentioning a study which recommends over 125nmol/L (50ng/ml).

So now you look at how much is needed to reach 50ng/ml and you'll see that they suggest 4,900iu per day. The nearest to buy would be 5,000iu.

You could retest your Vit D now and work out how much you currently need, or you could switch to 5,000iu daily and retest in 3 months.

Once you've reached the recommended level (at least 125nmol/L) then a maintenance dose will be needed to keep it there, which may be 2000iu daily, maybe more or less, maybe less in summer than winter, it's trial and error so it's recommended to retest once or twice a year to keep within the recommended range. This can be done with a private fingerprick blood spot test with an NHS lab which offers this test to the general public:

vitamindtest.org.uk/

Doctors don't know, because they're not taught much about nutrients, but there are important cofactors needed when taking D3. You will have to buy these yourself.

D3 aids absorption of calcium from food and Vit K2-MK7 directs the calcium to bones and teeth where it is needed and away from arteries and soft tissues where it can be deposited and cause problems such as hardening of the arteries, kidney stones, etc. 90-100mcg K2-MK7 is enough for up to 10,000iu D3.

D3 and K2 are fat soluble so should be taken with the fattiest meal of the day, D3 four hours away from thyroid meds if taking D3 as tablets/capsules/softgels, no necessity if using an oral spray.

For D3 I like Doctor's Best D3 softgels, they are an oil based very small softgel which contains just two ingredients - D3 and extra virgin olive oil, a good quality, nice clean supplement which is budget friendly (check out Dolphin Fitness and BigVits for best prices). Some people like BetterYou oral spray but this contains a lot of excipients and works out more expensive.

For Vit K2-MK7 my suggestions are Vitabay, Vegavero or Vitamaze brands which all contain the correct form of K2-MK7 - the "All Trans" form rather than the "Cis" form. The All Trans form is the bioactive form, a bit like methylfolate is the bioactive form of folic acid.

Vitabay and Vegavero are either tablets or capsules.

Vitabay does do an oil based liquid.

Vitamaze is an oil based liquid.

With the oil based liquids the are xx amount of K2-MK7 per drop so you just take the appropriate amount of drops.

They are all imported German brands, you can find them on Amazon although they do go out of stock from time to time. I get what I can when I need to restock. If the tablet or capsule form is only in 200mcg dose at the time I take those on alternate days.

Another "all trans" one worth considering if the others aren't availaable:

amazon.co.uk/Vitality-Biore...?

Another important cofactor is Magnesium which helps the body convert D3 into it's usable form.

There are many types of magnesium so we have to check to see which one is most suitable for our own needs:

naturalnews.com/046401_magn...

explore.globalhealing.com/t...

and ignore the fact that this is a supplement company, the information is relevant:

swansonvitamins.com/blog/ar...

Magnesium should be taken 4 hours away from thyroid meds and as it tends to be calming it's best taken in the evening. Vit D should also be taken 4 hours away from thyroid meds. Vit K2-MK7 should be taken 2 hours away from thyroid meds. Don't take D3 and K2 at the same time unless both are oil based supplements, they both are fat soluble vitamins which require their own fat to be absorbed otherwise they will compete for the fat.

Don't start all supplements at once. Start with one, give it a week or two and if no adverse reaction then add the next one. Again, wait a week or two and if no adverse reaction add the next one. Continue like this. If you do have any adverse reaction then you will know what caused it.

I got the B12 injections a couple of years back but they were happy with my levels so stopped them.

As for B12, that should never have happened. Usually when you're started on B12 injections they're for life and you don't retest when on injections because the result will always be high after an injection and taper off when the next one is due. Do you know Pernicious Anaemia was the cause of your B12 deficiency, if so you definitely don't stop the injections, you can't absorb B12 from food.

Did you check those links for signs/symptoms of B12 deficiency? Do you have any? If so you should stop the B12 and discuss those symptoms with your GP and ask for testing for B12 deficiency and Pernicious Anaemia.

When you take B12 we should also take a B Complex as mentioned above, maybe Thorne Basic B or one of these liposomal B Complex from Amazon which quite a few of us here use:

amazon.co.uk/Liposomal-Vita...?

amazon.co.uk/Yipmai-Liposom...?

Do you take your fluoxetine well away from your Levo?

[Underactiveclare in reply to SeasideSusie]

yeah I take one everyday. I’m avoiding dairy as much as possible as I think I have intolerance. I take thyroxine and then everything else together an hour later. I just went with that brand as they seemed to have higher dose.

I asked my dr for b12 and pernicious anemia and she said no as it was ok last time. I have regular restless legs, constant tremors and a list of other b12 deficiency symptoms.

[SeasideSusie Remembering in reply to Underactiveclare]

So take your list of B12 symptoms, see another doctor and explain that your B12 injections were taken away and you believe you need to be back on them. You can get further help from the PA forum here on HealthUnlocked:

healthunlocked.com/pasoc

1,000iu D3 isn't a high dose, it's purely a maintenance dose for those who have a decent level already. There are much higher doses available. Check out the links I gave you.

As for your Levo, you should take it on an empty stomach, one hour before or two hours after food. All supplements and other medication should be at least 2 hours away from Levo and some need 4 hours or taken at the other end of the day (Vit D, magnesium, iron, calcium, PPIs, HRT, anti depressants).

Fat soluble vitamins (A, D, E, K) require fat for absorption so Vit D and Vit K2-MK7 shouldn't be taken together as they will compete for the fat, so unless they come with their own fat in the supplement (eg oil based softgel or linseed flour in a capsule) then they should be taken at different times of the day.

[Underactiveclare in reply to SeasideSusie]

I will have a look at pa page thank you. I don’t hold out much hope as I’ve seen 3 gps in the past few months and none of them have helped.

It’s very frustrating.

Thank you also for the info on when to take tablets. I will space them out a bit more.

[Underactiveclare in reply to SeasideSusie]

maybe a stupid question but can I take 5 of my current vitamin d tablets instead of one until they run out and then I’ll use the better ones moving forward.

[SeasideSusie Remembering in reply to Underactiveclare]

Yes, that will be fine, but remember to take them with some dietary fat

[humanbean]

I notice that your results sheet refers to the reference ranges as "optimal". This isn't true. Being anywhere in range isn't the same as being optimal.

TSH range of 0.35 - 5.5.

You would feel hugely different with a TSH of 0.35 compared to a TSH of 5.5.

We often suggest on this forum that people are likely to feel at their best with a TSH of 1.5 or less. Some people need 1.0 or less. Some people only feel well with a TSH which is under range but still measurable.

I don't know if you've ever seen this thread :

healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...

Bear in mind that the graph shows results from healthy women with healthy thyroids. The results from people who are hypothyroid or hyperthyroid or who are healthy men with healthy thyroid may be a bit different.

[Underactiveclare in reply to humanbean]

Wow those statistics are insane. Why does the medical profession just not seem bothered.

I noticed also asthma treatments were mentioned. I’m so breathless and take inhaler every morning.

Also swallowing isn’t as easy as it once was but unsure if that’s related.

I’m very much on my high horse this evening. It’s so unfair that so many people are left to suffer/sort their own health out.

Once again, I’m extremely grateful for all the support on this forum.