Briefly has anybody swopped over with success please? my feeling is I’ve given levo a long shot with small success that even when at top of range the t3 remained down there, gut feeling to try more natural now, Dr P s words
As hrt is already heaving me out of a horrid long standing hole its truly amazing, unsure of the best route though and considering a Prof appointment in a few weeks - any thoughts appreciated as latest bloods TSH 3.5 but T4 lowest ever in range when usually at top end
Can somebody explain pls why I was given levo when my own t4 level was good? Sorry if simplistic
🌸best wishes all
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Yes, there are members medicating Metavive, but not myself.
I have answered your post so it goes onto todays 'daily feed' and hopefully be noticed by those members.
If you are worried about changing meds my suggestion would be to supplement the glandular alongside Levo in an effort to get conversion enzymes working better. You mention Dr P and this was his protocol although used Nutri Thyroid which isn’t now available unfortunately.
How much you reduce Levo and how much Metavive you introduce would be dependant upon where FT4 levels are atm.
Dr P didn’t mention Nutri one - I saw him just literally b4 he retired. He told me where to get Metavive
It’s a maize as im now on hrt which I want to shout from hilltops after years of loosing life quality & the far reaching affects
I recognise my thyroid meds are going to be wonky with the hrt for a bit
The problem seems to be getting a plan in place ( as im darn tired of paying for panels I can’t really stretch to but health comes first, right)
and unfortunately Iv not got good gp backup as they don’t see why I should check they don’t sit on same page at all as often the case. I’m quite envious now of those that get the help
If I pay to go with a professor I’d better wait till I know hrt has settled for a few weeks
It could be worthwhile if he sorts me out via gp prescription
Do nhs still prescribe ndt if via a prof🤔. Or is it not accessible at all do you know
Maybe il bite bullet and swop to metavive as I was subclinical and I believe levo doesn’t cut it for me and that refuctions of ostregens pushed me into hypo slowly
…Il intro it with my levo and see where I get to over next weeks
One step at a time ,
Then see if I need further help after blood panel etc
Thanks a lot
Always good to talk x. ( even to yourself on paper 😂)
I have used Metavive in the past and I am about to start again because the price of Armour NDT which I currently use is going through the roof. How you make it work for you is very individual. I will phase it in slowly as I phase out the Armour. I currently take T3 with Armour and anticipate continuing to do so with Metavive.
Hi JeppyI started slowly with metavive I by reducing Levo by 25mcg and replacing it with 1 metavive I so I was on 75mcg Levo and 1 metavive I. I continued like this for several months & even added in some T3 but this made me hypo so about a year after initiating metavive I cut out all Levo and I was on around 9 metavive I which was way too much (for me) as I had hair loss & high pulse & unable to sleep.
Over the next year I reduced metavive I and got to the point where my T3 was quite high (at v top of range) but my T4 was not at top end of range. So I reduced metavive I and replaced it with metavive III. I’m currently taking 4 metavive III only as I had a bad attack of asthma last week as I think I went a bit hyper so completely cut out the 1 metavive I that was taking in addition to the 4 metavive III.
Hope this helps. It’s taken me a couple of years to get to this point and I’m not sure I’m optimal tbh especially since cutting out the metavive I a week ago but will be getting my bloods done soon so it will be interesting to see if my symptoms correlate with how I’ve been feeling over the last few days (a tad tired) so may need to go back up to add in the metavive I.
Met l and ll are porcine. Met ll is double the dose of Met l
Met lll and lV are bovine. Met lV is double the dose of Met lll
Porcine glandulars are said to be closest in composition to the human thyroid gland
I take a combination of both and am currently in the process of raising the bovine because my last test showed that my FT4 was below range. I knew something was amiss because the weight was creeping up again
I don’t think it’s wise to stop a current med and introduce Metavive, particularly if already hypo. If hypo, personally, I would introduce 0.5 - 1 capsule, wait and listen to my body. If after 10 days, or more even, all feels ok, I’d increase the Metavive by a further 0.5 of a capsule and wait some more. Again, at least another 10 days
The way I would do it would be to keep doing the same to the point where I felt ever so slightly over-medicated - for me that means headaches, tremors, sweats. I would then really gradually reduce the other thyroid replacement that I’m taking
I would do it almost imperceptibly slowly over a good period of time, always listening intently to my body for signs that I’m reaching my optimal dose
Of course whilst decreasing the previous hormone replacement, levels will fall and more Metavive will probably be required but not necessarily and here’s where trialling low and slow comes into its own; changes in symptoms won’t be missed and can be acted upon. Bear in mind that anyway, Metavive is gentle and subtle (unless you take too much at once or it happens to disagree with you) and it’s quite easy to presume that nothing’s happening. Rest assured there will be changes to blood composition, they just haven’t been noticed/felt yet
Having said that, even when labs show that an individual has good levels of FT4 and FT3 it doesn’t always equate to feeling well. Mostly it does but some people have a condition, whose name escapes me, whereby T3 can’t get into the cells
You may also be one of the unlucky ones where the nucleotides in Metavive cause problems. They did for me, or so I thought, so I stopped taking it but I’ve recently re-introduced it and I’m fine. I think the problem for me (classic) was I became impatient and took too much too soon after having a period of four weeks without taking it, as per endo’s instructions but that’s another story!
As is so often said on here - and it happens to be true - no one method fits all but if you go carefully, keep calm and be patient, whichever hormone replacement you decide on, you’re more likely to have success and by the way, perseverance is crucial. Chopping and changing too quickly is just confusing for mind and body and will ultimately delay progress
The above is in no way an instruction on what you should do, it’s just the way I would go about it having learnt that rushing things doesn’t usually work
Hi JeppyI was on 100 levo, ft3 very low, ft4 low and I felt bad. My funcional doc changed me over to metavive - straight swap...i went very hypo despite increasing dose several times. I think the change over should have been very gradual. In the end went back to levo 75 and 1 x metavive 1 which is 40mg porcine (reduced from 1x metavive 11 which is 80mg and was giving me palpitations). My ft3 is up 74% through range and ft4 is 67% through range. I am waiting till next test to see how I feel and see if I stay where I am or reduce levo / increase metavive. I would recommend doing a gradual intro of metavive...
Yes it all seems a bit random as to what is actually in the various metavives. I tried bovine versiond first which i think really sent me badly hypo - <edited by Admin>. The porcine def works better as an equivalent ie i was on 100 levo, now on 75 + 40 metavive and I feel much better...at the moment!!!
Hi JeppyI was under the care of a naturopath so not going it alone! I’m not that brave!
Metavive II is double the dose of metavive I.
I think the idea was to get my T4 up a bit more towards top end of range hence gradually reduced met I and increased met III. Incidentally my TSH was 0.01 or undetectable.
When my T3 gets near top of range (>6 can’t recall units) then I do notice hair loss so the ideal for me is around 5 or 5.5 which is what I’m trying to achieve.
Of course I’d be happy to share how I get on. But if you haven’t heard from me do get in touch in a couple of weeks!
About 4 years ago my TSH was around 1-2 and T4 high end of range but T3 was always around 4. Metavive & lots of other supplements like vit D, C, magnesium, selenium and zinc & iodine really helped me.
Great to hear as similar numbersI hope levo hasn’t snookered much own t4🤔 I take the supps. Not iodine I thought that had to be tested first🤔 sorry if wrong. Medichecks stopped testing it too
No not that scientific I’m afraid. Just a patch test on wrist his belief is that most of us are deficient. I read a book call Iodine Crisis which helped me understand it better.
I think for thyroid health and good conversion of T4 to T3 : B complex , selenium and zinc are important. Also I’ve learned many are deficient in magnesium and Vit D so I carry on with these.
Now I’m thinking that levo May have stopped by usual good T4 as latest result is at the lowest my t4 has ever been But having started HRT it’s not reliable yet
Hello Jeopy,I'm one of those Happy Bunnies who successfully switched from Levothyroxine that was destroying my health and my life to NDT. Initially taking ERFA and later METAVIVE as Erfa was becoming hard to come by and way more expensive. I would not risk doing this alone and so consulted a homeopathic, medically qualified doctor and would suggest you do the same. The endocrine system is highly sensitive and can easily go out of whack so does need sympathetic monitoring Metavive is produced in the UK. It is an individual choice to take either porcine or bovine NDT. I take the porcine as I don't eat red meat and pig flesh is closest to human. I'd prefer not to have that either but am grateful that it has helped me to function more like a normal human being than being a shockingly overweight apology for one. And yes, the weight just came off all by itself. A normally healthy person will not be overweight. Avoid levo and also soya products. The latter not good for thyroid types either. All good wishes to you Thyrigia
PS. Blood test results using NDT willbe very different to those on synthetic lebighyrixine. For example TSH will be much, much lower. This means that you really need someone used to NDT to interpret your blood test results. Thyrigia
I've been on 75mcg levothyoxine and began adding Metavive to try and kick-start a version of T3. It was a case of self-medicating and keeping precise notes on a day by day basis. After three months I did the full panel of thyroid tests - and here - new comments by Dr Sarah Myhill is perhaps the most up to date and relevant for all who are hypothyroid.
I took myself off the Metavive after reading that the adrenals must be stabilised before going on to Metavive. Now I'm Adrenavive II, starting at three a day and now I'm working up to six a day, spaced increases every two to three weeks. Stability is key and it's hard self-dosing but I gradually am beginning to see small things: thicker hair, stronger nails, better sleep. energy levels are still dire though.
It’s fine Jeppy, I was asking Santolina because s/he said:
I took myself off the Metavive after reading that the adrenals must be stabilised before going on to Metavive. Now I'm Adrenavive II, starting at three a day and now I'm working up to six a day, spaced increases every two to three weeks.
Understand. I took Adrenavive for a good while I tried Nutri too but felt Adrenavive helped. I reached a point having read something along the way that made me Unsure if to continueHard to assess them
I recognised the symptoms of long term adrenal stress. Like sequencing related to IT issues, the body is the same: you have to get all your ducks in a row -as far as possible - for the connections to work. These days, environmental issues have hijacked our endocrine systems and so the process is combined with clean eating and litres of water per day. My go-to-doc is Sarah Myhill who has a website re adrenal/thyroid issues. Here she talks about 'the gut' as well, how connected brain/gut/thyroid/adrenals are. She also has a new analysis of the absurdity of the how our docs get thyroid analysis wrong. FROM all that, I'll have a blood test in two months - the full panel. Then I'll move to combining levothyroxine with Metavive for 6/8 weeks and then another blood test based on Myhill's analysis. Yes, it's self-diagnosing, but carefully done in lieu of docs who've messed all of us around for decades. PLUS, I'm quite certain that levo generics are NOT consistent amongst manufacturers which also makes accurate readings a nightmare.
It's not easy - this site has been going for years as have several others. We're all saying the same thing. 'Stop the Thyroid Madness' is also the best link for absolute good advice.
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