Need advice...blood test after reducing NDT an... - Thyroid UK

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Need advice...blood test after reducing NDT and adding levo

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Hi all,

I tried taking 2.375 NDT (2.25+1/8 grain) plus 12.5 Levo. This makes me overdosed and really sick with tremors, detachment feeling, nauseous, hungry all the time, diarrhoea.

My results are:

Ft4 = 50%

Ft3 = 79% (false-low t3 after 24 hrs of dose)

It seems this is a very fine tune operation, since my bloods on 2.6 NDT, no levo, were:

Ft4 = 24%

Ft3 = 80% (false-low r3 after 24 hrs of dose).

This makes me trembling, overactive, but also cold, low moods.

I have decided to take 2.5 NDT + 6.25 Levo, it was a bit better, but still feeling hypo, but no tremors since my t3 dropped from 80% a bit lower. I also still can't sleep, I'm very cold, hypo also.

I see two ways. Adding 12.5 t4 to 2.25 NDT or some t3 to a lowered NDT. What do you think?

I know I should be testing ft3 after hrs, but I really can't split the dose, I feel awful doing it. Loos like I am okay on ft3 around 70-75% after 24 hrs testing, not any higher.

Thanks so much x

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30 Replies

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SlowDragonAdministrator4 years ago

As you have Hashimoto’s are you on strictly gluten free diet

What vitamin supplements are you currently taking

When were vitamin levels last tested

Have you tested cortisol and DHEA

Do you feel better in evening than morning? ....can suggest adrenal issues

Do you split your NDT into 2 or 3 doses per day

It may be NDT is too much T3 for you in relation to Ft4

Many of us find levothyroxine plus T3 is more flexible

• in reply toSlowDragon4 years ago

Hey SD, thank you! All my nutrients are optimal (talked about it in my previous post in case you want to have a look), been supplementing for many years as I did have deficiencies.

Yes, my cortisol is green on three readings, with early afternoon still in yellow (a bit low then, but still in "range"). DHEA midrange, all done by Regenerus.

Feeling better in the morning, then evening tired, then sort of awake around 1-2 am again.

As I said above, I can't split,when I split my dose I feel really hypo, tried it for 2+ years.

Yes, I think you are right, my ft3 could be too much on NDT, I have noticed that any ft3 result around 78-80% ("false-low", tested 24 hrs after dose) gives me overdose symptoms.

Been on synthetics the last 1.5 years, worked up to similar blood results, but with higher ft4, I unfortunately can't take them, I feel NDT makes me more even and is more gentle. Just the balance in it might be off for me.

This is why I don't know if I should add levo and lower NDT a tiny bit more ,or reduce NDT and add t3 as t4 could be messing something up.

adin• in reply to4 years ago

Maybe you should increase your ft4 a bit, add levo and cut from ndt (2 grain+25mcg levo, something like that) at 7 am, and another 5 mcg T3 at 4 pm..

• in reply toadin4 years ago

Thank you Adin, maybe I would first drop NDT to 2.25 from 2.375 and stay with 12.5 levo? I think I need really fine and slow adjustments. Have you tried adding t3 to your NDT before?

adin• in reply to4 years ago

Yeah I tried to add but I did gout, sore joints, anxiety and I gained...I tried with Thai -Thiroyd ndt and Thybon-T3, not the best for me. Maybe you have a better ndt at hand.

• in reply toadin4 years ago

Oh no sorry to hear. I have thybon here and Armour. Anytime I add t4 I feel sort more puffy and heavy...

adin• in reply to4 years ago

So do I. Now i will try with slow rel. t3(retard) and ndt from Germany(Thyreogland) with a prescription. I placed the order and my package must arrive by mail. Armour is good but it is expensive and inaccessible for me. I didn't like the Thai ndt, I was feeling poor and anxious somehow. I don't have many options. Now I'm on Tirosint and Thybon but I gained weight I'm anxious, puffy face, eye problems, etc. On ndt, my ft4 is bellow so I need to add some levo, It's hard to find the balance.

• in reply toadin4 years ago

How low is your ft4 on NDT? Same for me on synthetics, really hypo with puffy face. Yeah I pay 114 euro for Armour a month.... but nothing else works. I tried Thai ndt before, also didn't get on well with it. I am still torn if I should lower NDT and add levo or add t3 and have low ft4.

adin• in reply to4 years ago

On synthetics my ft4 is aprox.16-17 (12-21) and ft3 at 25-30%. On Thai-ndt my ft4 was 11,5 and ft3 was 50-60%. Armour cost me 176eur (1grain/100tabs ) and for 2 grains /100tabs I should pay 313eur, but in the pandemic it's hard to get for me. I wait for the German ndt.

• in reply toadin4 years ago

Did you try increasing synthetics? So your ft4 is under range on NDT, right? Did you try increasing Thai NDT? Just really curious of your experience.I see, everything got quite difficult with covid. Fingers crossed for Thyreogland, seems very close to NDT, 40 mcg and 10 mcg ration t4:t3.

adin• in reply to4 years ago

Yep, my Ift4 is under range on NDT only, I was on 3,5 gr. Thiroyd. Of course, I tried to increase the dose but I had insomnia, anxiety, and hyper symptoms, it didn't work for me. I tried to increase synthetics too but I'm not well. It seems that I cannot exceed the dose of 125 T4 regardless of the form. Only on 125 mcg levothyroxine, ft4 is high 21, but when I take t3, ft4 it decreases.

• in reply toadin4 years ago

We are in a similar boat it seems! Similarly, I can't exceed 112 mcg Levo. I hope we will find the balance soon, it is very tiring to be going so long with these symptoms!

adin• in reply to4 years ago

You are right, my main problem is anxiety, I can't get rid of her. I would not want to take antidepressants.

• in reply toadin4 years ago

Have you ever checked female hormones out of curiosity? I definitely think you need a better balance with meds, like I do. And if ft4 is low your ft3 has to be high enough or bring that low ft4 upwards.

adin• in reply to4 years ago

I'm a man, I checked almost everything, vits, cortisol, testosterone, sex hormones everything looks fine... I will try the German grains and I hope it will be fine...

• in reply toadin4 years ago

Oops sorry, should have asked! Yeah we definitely have the same issue then, everything else for me is fine, please keep me posted on how you're getting on.

adin• in reply to4 years ago

No problem :)) Yes of course, keep in touch.

• in reply toadin4 years ago

:))))

• in reply toadin4 years ago

Btw, have you ever tried taking all your dose in the morning? Or even moving 2.5 from evening to the morning? This has fixed some issues for me personally. Just a thought!

adin• in reply to4 years ago

Yes I tried every combination. The best for me, all doses in the morning.

• in reply toadin4 years ago

Same!

adin• in reply to4 years ago

But also I take a little t3 at noon and in the evening. So, on syntetics I take levo + T3 in the morning +5T3 at 2pm+5T3 T 6PM.

• in reply toadin4 years ago

Oh I see, I am afraid I can't take anything during the day, all in the morning

• in reply toadin4 years ago

Hi Adin, quick mesaage. When you lower NDT to add T4, do you first lower it for a few days and then add t4 or do you do it at the same time?

adin• in reply to4 years ago

I switched at the same time.

• in reply toadin4 years ago

I see thanks! I am having difficulties, I think it could be because my ft3 is high in range 80% after 24 horus of taking it.

adin• in reply to4 years ago

Yes it's a bit too much, maybe the ndt 4:1 doesn't suit you. Therefore try with levo. to make a 5 :1 ratio.

• in reply toadin4 years ago

Yeah, you are right! I need to re-do it and re-think it. The ratio doesn't suit me for sure, on Nature Throid my labwork was ft4 10% ft3 80%, on Armour is ft4 24% ft3 80% without adding any t4. So frustrating! If I could only split levo into 1mcgs lol😄right now wrapped up in blankets, hot water bottle and with hot tea, I am so cold and 23 degrees in the apartment!

adin• in reply to4 years ago

Yes, it's very hard to find a sweet point on ndt only. Maybe if you try different proportions can you find your point. I'll try the other way around, I will decrease the synthetic, and I will add ndt, hope I find the right one too. Interesting your observation, what a big difference it is between ft4 at the two ndt's ? I took Nature-Throid +levo when it was the old formula and it worked for me. I don't recall exactly but then I added 50 levo to about 2 grains. From what I understood, a good ndt would be NP -Thyroid, did you try it?

• in reply toadin4 years ago

You are so right. I was okay before on Nature Throid only, old formula, kept increasing over a couple of years, got up to 4 grains, my both ft3 ft4 were over range, started to get palpitations etc. Went down to 3 grains, was okay for 3 months, I developed tremors, palpitations, fainting spells, lost a lot of weight, anxiety etc. When I tried to lower, was getting better, but also worse, my ft3 ft4 were going down and down and then the formula changed and got low ft4 and with high t3. So I think you are right, levo needs to be added. Armour seems better and more potent. But never tried NP, I have heard NP was over potent. I think I might try adding more and reducing more.I hope you will find that sweet spot again with NDT and T4, the other way around! I really.hope we can both get there Adin, for me it's been 3.5 years, to the point last year I couldn't go to work since I don't sleep anymore