My thyroxine has been reduced to 75 from 100 because my T4 is still a little high, but I have been taking vitamin D is this a good idea?

[3fl00d]

If I have an under active thyroid and have been told that my T4 is still a little high so my thyroxine has been reduced again to 75 a day from 100 and I’ve been taking vitamin D daily due too a recent broken wrist. Should I be taking this vitamin ? So as I have never really understood what an under active thyroid is could some help with some key does and don’ts please

[fuchsia-pink]

Do you have any recent blood tests to share (including ranges, as these vary from lab to lab)?

In general you are likely to need some vit D supplementing especially in the winter/ spring/ autumn - but you need a blood result to know how deficient or not you are x

[3fl00d in reply to fuchsia-pink]

Hi my result is 27.5 pmol/L normal range 12-22

[SeasideSusie Remembering]

3fl00d

To understand how the thyroid works and all about hypothyroidism, a good place to start is ThyroidUK's main website (this is their forum).

thyroiduk.org/tuk/about_the...

The page linked to is explaining the endocrine system (of which the thyroid is part), then work your way down the purple menu on the left hand side.

have been told that my T4 is still a little high so my thyroxine has been reduced again to 75 a day from 100

To be able to comment on whether 75mcg is the right dose for you, we would need to see your test results, including the reference ranges. You can ask the receptionist at your GP surgery to give you a print out of the results. In the UK we are legally entitled to our results free of charge and without explanation, so you could ring up and request a print out of your results and say you will pick them up in a couple of days. Don't accept hand written or verbal results as mistakes can be made.

When you have the results, please post them (including the reference ranges) and it would be useful if you told us how you felt on the dose at the time of the test (which you say was 100mcg) and how you feel now on the lower dose of 75mcg.

I’ve been taking vitamin D daily due too a recent broken wrist. Should I be taking this vitamin ?

Why, in particular, are you taking Vit D because you broke your wrist? Did your GP prescribe it? Did you test your Vit D level before starting the supplement?

Do you take tablets, softgels, capsules, oral spray? Some are better absorbed than others.

D3 needs fat to be absorbed so should be taken with some dietary fat.

D3 should be taken 4 hours away from thyroid meds.

You may very well need D3 but it's essential to know your level to start with. Vit D is a fat soluble vitamin so any excess gets stored in the body and can lead to toxicity. So we test our level and base our dose on the result. Taking too little will not help at all, taking too much can lead to toxicity.

Also, D3 has important cofactors (companion supplements) that are also needed. D3 aids absorption of calcium from food and Vit K2-MK7 directs the calcium to bones and teeth where it is needed and away from arteries and soft tissues where it can be deposited and cause problems such as hardening of the arteries, kidney stones, etc.

D3 and K2 are fat soluble so should be taken with the fattiest meal of the day, D3 four hours away from thyroid meds if taking D3 as tablets/capsules/softgels, no necessity if using an oral spray.

Magnesium helps D3 to work. We need Magnesium so that the body utilises D3, it's required to convert Vit D into it's active form. So it's important we ensure we take magnesium when supplementing with D3.

Magnesium comes in different forms, check to see which would suit you best and as it's calming it's best taken in the evening, four hours away from thyroid meds if taking magnesium as tablets/capsules, no necessity if using topical forms of magnesium.

naturalnews.com/046401_magn...

drjockers.com/best-magnesiu...

afibbers.org/magnesium.html

As for some Do's and Don'ts

When doing thyroid tests, we advise:

* Book the first appointment of the morning, or with private tests at home no later than 9am. This is because TSH is highest early morning and lowers throughout the day. If we are looking for a diagnosis of hypothyroidism, or looking for an increase in dose or to avoid a reduction then we need TSH to be as high as possible.

* Fast overnight - have your evening meal/supper as normal the night before but delay breakfast on the day of the test and drink water only until after the blood draw. Eating may lower TSH, coffee affects TSH so it's possible that other caffeine containing drinks may also affect TSH.

* When taking thyroid hormone replacement, last dose of Levo should be 24 hours before blood draw, if taking NDT or T3 then last dose should be 8-12 hours before blood draw. Adjust timing the day before if necessary. This avoids measuring hormone levels at their peak after ingestion of hormone replacement. Take your thyroid meds after the blood draw. Taking your dose too close to the blood draw will give false high results, leaving any longer gap will give false low results.

* If you take Biotin or a B Complex containing Biotin (B7), leave this off for 7 days before any blood test. This is because if Biotin is used in the testing procedure it can give false results (most labs use Biotin in the assay).

These are patient to patient tips which we don't discuss with doctors or phlebotomists.

For a full picture, the tests needed are:

TSH

FT4

FT3

Thyroid antibodies

and because optimal nutrient levels are needed for thyroid hormone to work, we also need to test:

Vit D

B12

Folate

Ferritin

Also, take your Levo on an empty stomach, one hour before or two hours after food, with a glass of water only, no tea, coffee, milk, etc, and water only for an hour either side, as absorption will be affected. Take any other medication and supplements 2 hours away from Levo, some need 4 hours.

Feel free to ask any questions and members will be happy to help.

[3fl00d in reply to SeasideSusie]

Wow lots to take in. Ok so I wasn’t advised to take vitamin d because of my broken wrist but thought it may help, also because government advised to because we’re not going out so much.

I take Calcium 1000mg magnesium 500mg with vitamin d3 400 I.U(tablet) from Holland and Barrett and I take one at the end of the day and I take my Levo first thing in the morning an hour before my first cuppa. So that’s wrong I not meant to have tea or coffee 3 hours after taking it?

No test was done to look at my levels of vitamin D and my last blood test was taken at 11am 5 hours after I had taken my levo.

Date 27/3/19 full blood check

This was taken after I came out of hospital passing gaul stones

Haemoglobin estimation

145 g/L

115 - 165 g/L

Normal

Total white cell count

3.98 10*9/L

4 - 11 10*9/L

Abnormal

Platelet count

220 10*9/L

150 - 450 10*9/L

Normal

Red blood cell (RBC) count

4.59 10*12/L

3.8 - 5.8 10*12/L

Normal

Haematocrit

0.41 L/L

0.37 - 0.47 L/L

Normal

Mean corpuscular volume (MCV)

89 fL

76 - 98 fL

Normal

Mean corpusc. haemoglobin(MCH)

31.6 pg

27 - 32 pg

Normal

Mean corpusc. Hb. conc. (MCHC)

354 g/L

300 - 360 g/L

Normal

Neutrophil count

2.06 10*9/L

2 - 7 10*9/L

Normal

Lymphocyte count

1.4 10*9/L

1 - 4 10*9/L

Normal

Monocyte count

0.35 10*9/L

0.2 - 0.8 10*9/L

Normal

Eosinophil count

0.15 10*9/L

0 - 0.4 10*9/L

Normal

Basophil count

0.02 10*9/L

0 - 0.1 10*9/L

Normal

Thyroid level blood test

Serum TSH level

0.12 mu/L

0.27 - 4.2

Abnormal

28 Apr 2020

Serum TSH level

0.05 mu/L

0.27 - 4.2

Abnormal

29 Jan 2020

Serum TSH level

1.53 mU/L

0.27 - 4.2 mU/L

Normal

2 Jan 2019

Serum TSH level

2.82 mU/L

0.27 - 4.2 mU/L

Normal

11 Jul 2018

Serum TSH level

0.91 mU/L

0.27 - 4.2 mU/L

Normal

5 Apr 2017

Serum TSH level

0.32 mU/L

0.27 - 4.2 mU/L

Normal

27 Apr 2016

Serum TSH level

1.55 mU/L

0.27 - 4.2 mU/L

Normal

10 Feb 2016

Serum TSH level

0.18 mU/L

0.27 - 4.2 mU/L

Abnormal

25 Nov 2015

Serum TSH level

2.32 mU/L

0.27 - 4.2 mU/L

Normal

21 Oct 2015

Serum TSH level

2.32 mU/L

0.27 - 4.2 mU/L

Normal

[SeasideSusie Remembering in reply to 3fl00d]

3fl00d

Ok so I wasn’t advised to take vitamin d because of my broken wrist but thought it may help, also because government advised to because we’re not going out so much.

Yes, it can be a good idea, especially in the winter, and of course it's being mentioned a lot with this virus as well. But it's still a good idea to check level first so that we can dose at the correct amount.

If I were you I'd either ask your GP to test (many wont) or I'd do a private test with an NHS lab which offers this test to the general public:

vitamindtest.org.uk/

Post the result on the forum for recommendation of how much D3 to take.

The aim is to reach the level recommended by the Vit D Council - 125nmol/L and the Vit D Society - 100-150nmol/L, when this level is reached we then find our maintenance dose to maintain that level.

**

I take Calcium 1000mg magnesium 500mg with vitamin d3 400 I.U(tablet) from Holland and Barrett and I take one at the end of the day

Was calcium tested and found to be deficient? If not then we don't supplement with calcium.

400iu D3 wont raise the level of a sunburnt flea, so if your level is low then this is nowhere near enough to be of any help, it's not even a maintenance dose for someone with a good level already, another reason to test your level

By the way, H&B own brand are a poor choice of supplement. Tablets are the least absorbable form of D3 and are full of nasty, unnessary excipients. There are many excellent brands which we can suggest.

**

Total white cell count: 3.98 10*9/L (4 - 11 10*9/L)

Low white cell count can be temporary, caused by a viral infection.

Other test results are within range.

**

As for your thyroid results, is it TSH only that has been tested all along? No FT4 or FT3?

21 Oct 2015

TSH:2.32 (0.27 - 4.2)

Is that when you were first diagnosed?

TSH: 0.12 (0.27 - 4.2)

FT4: 27.5 (12-22)

Are these your latest results?

my last blood test was taken at 11am 5 hours after I had taken my levo.

By taking your Levo before the test you have a false high FT4 result and your GP has reduced your Levo due to this over range result.

What the guidelines stipulate is that thyroid tests are repeated 6-8 weeks after a dose change. So you should ensure that test is done at the right time and make sure that you follow the advice above on how to do thyroid tests to give the most accurate results.

How long have you been on the lower dose of Levo and how do you feel?

[3fl00d in reply to SeasideSusie]

Ok. So I need to ask for which blood test? But it needs to check calcium and vitamin d levels as well as TSH, T3 and T4.

So which supplements do you feel I would be better taking?

Yes these are my results and the last test result was as it says was a T4 test and the rest were TSH tests. No that wasn’t my first test result that was:

Serum free T4 level

27.5 pmol/L

12 - 22

Abnormal

28 Apr 2020

Serum free T4 level

25.8 pmol/L

12 - 22

Abnormal

29 Jan 2020

Serum free T4 level

30.7 pmol/L

12 - 22 pmol/L

Abnormal

25 Nov 2015

Serum free T4 level

8.1 pmol/L

12 - 22 pmol/L

Abnormal

23 Aug 2013

Serum free T4 level

14.4 pmol/L

10.8 - 19.3 pmol/L

Normal

19 Oct 2005

This is my first TSH test

SERUM TSH level

1.1 mU/L

0.5 - 4.2 mU/L

Normal

19 Oct 2005

[SeasideSusie Remembering in reply to 3fl00d]

3fl00d

Ok. So I need to ask for which blood test? But it needs to check calcium and vitamin d levels as well as TSH, T3 and T4.

I listed them above in my first reply to you. If your GP wont do them then you can do a private test with one of our recommended labs. Calcium is not included in these test bundles and not currently available from the private labs as it can't be done as a fingerprick test. If you want to test calcium you'd need to ask your GP.

The most popular tests here, which cover all but calcium, are (but only fingerprick version or "arrange your own phlebotomy" version are available, no home phlebotomy or clinic phlebotomy is available at the moment) :

Medichecks Thyroid Check ULTRAVIT medichecks.com/thyroid-func...

You can use code SPRING25 for 25% off today, after that you can use THYROIDUK for a 10% discount on any test not on special offer

or

Blue Horizon Thyroid PREMIUM GOLD bluehorizonbloodtests.co.uk... (previously known as Thyroid Check Plus Eleven)

Both tests include the full thyroid and vitamin panel. They are basically the same test but with the following small differences:

For the fingerprick test:

Blue Horizon requires 1 x microtainer of blood (0.8ml), Medichecks requires 2 x microtainers (total 1.6ml)

Blue Horizon includes Total T4 (can be useful but not essential). Medichecks doesn't include this test.

B12 - Blue Horizon does Total B12 which measures bound and unbound (active) B12 but doesn't give a separate result for each. Medichecks does Active B12.

Total B12 shows the total B12 in the blood. Active B12 shows what's available to be taken up by the cells. You can have a reasonable level of Total B12 but a poor level of Active B12. (Personally, I would go for the Active B12 test.)

Blue Horizon include magnesium but this is an unreliable test so don't let this sway your decision, it also tests cortisol but that's a random cortisol test and to make any sense of it you'd need to do it fasting before 9am I believe.

If you want tips on how to do a fingerprick test, please ask and I will post what works well for me.

**

So which supplements do you feel I would be better taking?

Impossible to say without seeing results of your vitamin tests.

**

This is my first TSH test

19 Oct 2005

TSH: 1.1 (0.5 - 4.2) Normal

Unless there were other tests done, eg FT4, then it would be impossible to get a diagnosis of hypothyroidism and a prescription of Levothyroxine on that result. For a diagnosis of Primary Hypothyrodism TSH has to be over 10 or a below range FT4. For a diagnosis of Hashimoto's (autoimmune) Hypothyroidism TSH has to be over range with raised thyroid antibodies.

**

It would be extremely helpful, when posting results, instead of doing a copy/paste job (which I assume you've done) which loses all the formatting, if you could simplify it to make it easier to read and post them like this (examples only) and put the dose of Levo you were taking at the time of the test:

Date: Month / year - taking xxx mcg Levo

TSH: 2.5 (0.2-4.2)

FT4: 17 (12-22)

This makes it easy to read at a glance and is very much easier on the eye for us thyroid patients who have a variety of problems.