Anyone know of a good natural adrenal support?

[Netty510]

Hi everyone i been posting alot lately not sure if im hyper or my adrenals still trying to dose TS right ..bit i wanted to ask ahead of time just in case i need something i did hc l ling time ago i really dont want to go that path again.and i dont want to stop my meds while doing some support..anybody know of some good adrenal support?i heard if adrenavive but nothing else thanks

[SeasideSusie Remembering]

You'll need to know whether you need to raise cortisol or lower cortisol because they are two completely different types of supplement. So you'll need to do a 24 hour saliva adrenal test first, and the best one tests both cortisol plus DHEA. Regenerus and Genova Diagnostics both offer this test. Don't be tempted to do a test that just measures cortisol alone.

Details on ThyroidUK's main website :

Regenerus - thyroiduk.org.uk/tuk/testin...

Genova - test is END01 and will be found by clicking the link to the pdf at the top of the page - thyroiduk.org.uk/tuk/testin...

I use Regenerus be a use they email you direct when your results are ready, Genova send the results to ThyroidUK who then send them on to you when you have completed the consent form on TUK's website.

[Netty510 in reply to SeasideSusie]

Hello im.in the u.s i have to find one here..i didnt want tomexcept the fact it could be adrenals since i been there b4 and was not pleasant i dont even know if i needed it i just did it thinking im.doin my.self.a.favor..not!

[SeasideSusie Remembering in reply to Netty510]

Regenerus offer an international service regeneruslabs.com/pages/shi...

And Genova Diagnostics has a US base.

[999od]

Hi Netty510

I would strongly recommend Seriphos by Interplexus. It helped me recalibrate my adrenals from totally overactive at night back into the normal range (I did the saliva test before and after to check this). If you google around you will see that some practitioners advise taking it initially every night for one month then a 24-48 hour break and then another month. Having done this first I now just take it when I feel a little overactive. It helps calm my adrenals and aids sleep.

You can buy Seriphos on amazon.

Thanks

[Netty510 in reply to 999od]

Wow so you had to buy more then one saliva test?if so cant be done to expensive..if not how did you test

[999od in reply to Netty510]

It’s not necessary to test. I just did so because I wanted to know if it had any impact. I am not an expert but I know Seriphos is an over the counter mineral supplement so relatively safe to try. Again I would just google it and read what nutritionists etc have said as that’s how I discovered it and it seemed to help me.

[Netty510 in reply to 999od]

Thanks i read a few tht said it was hard to ckem off of you take on a daily basis but still dojng research

[LynneG]

Hi Netty, I have just listened to the interviews on Jay Davidson's just aired Mitochondrial Summit. Amazing info. Go to one of the speakers website - Ari Whitten's, 'Energy Blueprint'

I listened to his interview - so haven't looked through his website but I am sure you will find info there.

A great proponent of Adrenal Fatigue he spoke of his years research on going through every scrap of evidence in every study to quantify the condition and came up with nothing. His statement was that there is no evidence, blaming cortisol for fatigue /fatigue syndromes is like saying blood sugar levels have nothing to do with diabetes.

Excluding the more rare Addisons disease which is in essence autoimmune where the adrenals cannot make/ have difficulty making cortisol because of the immune system damage

Fatigue and Fatigue Syndromes are caused by failing mitochondria.

Mitochondria the power houses of the cell , producing ATP / your energy, have also been recently discovered to be highly sensitive to the environment at cellular level and divert from Energy producing mode(producing ATP) to Dorsal mode (defence mode) Obviously critical as cells need energy to function. Heart , Liver, Eye and Brain have 1,000's of mitochondria per cell as these organs require huge amounts of energy to function and our other cells have only a few less. So if they are in defence mode and not producing much ATP then nothing is going to work well.

With fatigue/ any fatigue syndrome it is now found that the mitochondria can get stuck in defence mode, named, The Cell Danger Response. See also Nicki Gratrix on the Cell Danger Response and the Vagus Nerve. As you are in the USA, Neurologist: Dr Norman Doidge's work on tongue stimulation of the vagus nerve to heal Parkinsons and Fatigue.

So basically it boils down to , it could be a good idea to support mitochondrial health and numbers. Many such ways were dicussed on the summit by clinicians in the US who effectively helped their patients improve their mitochondrial health.

Diet being a biggie, the mitochondria above all else need to feel safe and that resources are plenty, so that there is no state of rationing - nutrients are key, it's what mitochondria use to make ATP. Light another, mitochondria have been found in recent studies to use infra red and near infra red wavelengths to make ATP. You can' look inside' Ari Whitten's book on Red Light Therapy on amazon/or buy it. Thoughts again, need to be positive, mitochondria signal our microbiome organisms , nervous system, genetic cross talk /feedback all perceived how things are, so not necessarily how are actually - so positive thoughts a biggie, mitochondria need to have safety to flourish. Also short term stressors upregulate mitochondrial function, promote apoptosis (cell death/mitochondrial death ) to produce new healthy mitochondria - so benficial exercise, intermittent fasting, heat cold therapy as in saunas/hot cold showers. That's all I can recall

Oh, drinking lots of water/ bile flow. Elimination as keep the toxins passing out of the bowels. Bowel movements per day should really correlate per no of meals. 2 meals, pass 2 good bowel movements per day min. Key is to keep everything flowing including lymph.

The Vagus Nerve running from brain stem to the rest of the body, critical in nervous system messaging also controls motility so a link there. Nothing to do with this summit but Dr Datis Kharrazian is a great proponent of stimulating the Vagus Nerve in constipation by stressing the nerve by gargling, singing really loudly several times per day, to improve motility

See Dr Jay Davidson re supplement - TUDCA. I'm certainly going to take, waiting for order to arrive. I have already owned a red/near infra red light combi for over 12 months. In the US joov make but expensive. Nicki Gratrix on her website links to company 'Red Light Rising' which is US I think.

All things that you can bear in mind that may have an effect . Hope this helps

[Redlester in reply to LynneG]

Hi LynneG

What a brilliant post. I have also read Jay Davidson's Tudca piece - can I ask what brand of Tudca you ordered and how you are getting on with it? I tried it before Christmas and had to go very very low, splitting capsules into doses as low as 40g to get used to them and then had to stop it. I hope to start again soon. I also wasn't sure whether I could take ox bile capsules alongside it which I ordinarily have to take to help with fat digestion as I have a gall stone and sludgey bile. I have also been aware of the Vagus Nerve - I have come across it so many times in my reading, and to date have just done a lot of humming which is supposed to stimulate it, but maybe not as effectively as the loud singing. I will have to look up a lot of the other things that you mention about mitochondria. So much to research so little time!!! It is a full time job trying to be your own doctor!

Redlester

[LynneG in reply to Redlester]

Hi Red Leicester, It certainly seems like a full time job. But then again fascinating if you enjoy learning, and there is always something new to learn as 'Science' keeps breaking new ground. It's just a pity that many/most health practitioners don't keep up with cutting edge knowledge. And those that do have found that their own medical training has not sufficed if they or a loved one have met health challenges and so have had to jump into additional education, qualifications and learn from colleagues specialities to broaden their narrow med school outlook and mindset - thank goodness.

What annoys me is the professionals who poo poo everything and use the terms woo woo. Not sure but I think it was British GP /Cardiology specialist Dr Malcolm Kendrick who espoused the fact that we just have to wait for the health professionals at the top with vested interest in being 'right' and reputations to foster, to die off before we will see change. His 2 books 2007, The Great Cholesterol Con and his later book 2016 Doctoring Data are brilliant and such a joy to read. His sarcastic style keeps you entertained.

There's also the British 'Public Health Collaboration'. A collaboration of British GP's Scientist/researchers, health proffessionals who are demanding change (particularly Govt Dietary Guidelines - which let's face it affect all statutary bodies from maternity practice to school dinners , hospital meals and nursing homes, let alone restaurants etc.) They have held annual conferences in London since 2017. All the videos of the speakers presentations are available to watch on their website. A real group of British professionals to learn from.

The Mitochondrial Summit that was organised by Jay Davidson was only aired for free 2-3 weeks ago and then I had to do a little finding out exercise about TUDCA and so my order only came this Saturday - so not much experience to go on so far to pass on.

I would have liked to have ordered the US brand that they have developed but not practical re shipping and expensive. I found one in the UK with similar ingredients but also £80+ so opted for a British made supplement with no added ingredients other than rice flour which is obviously required for smooth running through machines in filling and bulking and the other ingredient is gelatin which is the capsule shell. Others had magnesium stearate which I stay away from. Only 200mg per capsule so not that economical if want to take higher doses but I thought that I would start low, so it didn't matter. The easy post packet just states Manufactured for tudca.com. And contains 100 capsules - approx £34

I took one capsule with food , early afternoon Saturday. Missed Sunday , took one Monday and none today Tuesday. I will take one tomorrow.

I practice intermittent fasting, have done for years before it became popular, having read Scientist Paul Jaminet's book the Perfect Health Diet. I have Rheumatoid Arthritis and many opinions are that it can be caused by infection /parasite, such as amoeba etc. He was saying back then that the longer you remain without protein (which parasites, bacteria feed on- the more uncomfortable you are making the environment for them) So no food between evening meal and lunch the next day is optimum. Now this has evolved into fasting advice and eating only within an 8 hour period or less. I often don't break my fast until 2pm depending on the events of the day. I am not desperatly hungry or thinking of food and tend to have a cocoa, coconut oil , butter, boiling water hot choc that I blend with a hand blender to make frothy - delicious. Similar to Dave Asprey's Bullet Proof Coffee. Only I have cocoa as has many benefits for heart health, and also a great antioxidant. I stir in a couple of teasps of Gt Lakes Collagen (amino acids) And so take supplements following such as D3 and K2. I have taken the TUDCA following too. But noted Jay Davidson extolling the addition of fulvic and humic acid with their TUDCA, and Collagen. Collagen sorted as already taking so also take 1/4 teasp of Simply Minerals - powder, nothing added, at the same time as the TUDCA. Simply minerals is the full range of minerals found in humic deposits from the Jurassic period forest decomposition. So kind of emulating the TUDCA mix Jay Davidson recommends and I take the collagen already and had in the Simply mineral powder (Dr Nusum on the Mitochondrial summit also recommended highly taking Fulvic/Humic acid minerals) I have a red/near infrared light which I have had for over 12 months - which Ari Whitten (who was interviewed on the mitochondrial summit) has written a book (amazon) about the use of which benefits the mitochondria and so our health. Which I use every day. I also have for a few yrs taken Serrapeptase which is a proteolytic enzyme that if taken away from food is absorbed directly into the blood stream and breaks down fibrinogen/fibrin that is built up around inflamed joints and other areas of inflammation, tissue that shouldn't be there such as internal scar tissue, cysts etc and cleans the gunk out of your blood stream. If you have a fibrinogen blood test ( just the NHS clotting blood test) and your fibrinogen is not in the lowest 3rd of the normal range - you need serrapeptase. High Fibrinogen is so usual in RA and other inflammatory conditions that it could be used as a diagnostic marker. And is a strong marker for heart issues, which inflammation is a strong contributor to. Having Sludgy bile could be a good reason to look into. Dr Ann Louise Gittleman has done so much work on the gall bladder and sludgy bile - really worth a look for you tube videos. Basically at its simplest drink tons of water, keep hydrated. One thing I learned also from the mitochondrial summit which I hadn't known was: if you drink and then pass urine within half hr /short period this is not a sign that you are well hydrated and so peeing. It is imperative that the kidneys flush and so they take priority - so flushing/peeing is a sign that you were dehydrated and the kidneys needed to flush.

To get back to the point. The difference I noticed when taking the TUDCA is that I passed 3 full bowel movements that day /next morning. Normally I would pass one.

On the summit Dr Jay D stated if have 1 meal per day, pass one bowel movement min, if 2 meals : 2 bowel movements and so on. Crucial to keep everything flowing. I definitely put my experience down to the TUDCA but early days

What symptoms did you have that meant you could only take 40g or less and then had to stop?

Hope some of this helps

Just to clarify, I have never taken any meds for RA and had for 24 yrs (aggressive form apparently) And recently with the red light and other supplements , I feel really well, the best I have done for ages x

[Redlester in reply to LynneG]

Hi LynneG

Wow - you covered so much ground I am almost exhausted reading it!! I am impressed with what you are doing - good for you! I started low on the Tudca, breaking down a 250mg cap into about 4 or 5 in early December - my caution was to start low because I seem to be very sensitive to a lot of things and if it was to start "moving stuff" I didn't want my system to become overwhelmed. I also read that although they might sell it in 200-250mg capsules, you don't have to take that high a dose to get the kind of bile thinning effect I would be taking it for. Also, I have sphincter of oddi dysfunction and I didn't want to be in the situation where the sphincter had snapped shut and I was bringing stuff out of the liver into the gallbladder with nowhere for it to go which would be a big risk. My instincts were correct as when I tried to increase the dose I had to suspend it for a couple of days and then re-introduce it again albeit at a lower dose. At that stage I wasn't on any thyroid medication. I am currently on 31.25mcg of T3, so I am hoping that at some point it will start to have a beneficial impact on my liver and I will be able to gradually go higher in the Tudca dosing. I reintroduced it today at about a 40mg dose and might keep it at that for a couple of days and then try to raise it a bit to 60mg. I am hoping it will help my lymphatic system which doesn't seem to be right - I am getting a lot of pain off and on along what I know to be the acupuncture meridians or channels which worries me. I'm not sure that I am using the best brand of Tudca - if it is good quality it is supposed to not smell very nice when you open a capsule - when I open my capsules they smell of nothing, and it's just a white crystalline powder which makes me suspicious. Is yours the one that comes in the black plastic bag costing £34.99???

I know what you mean about wanting to keep everything 'moving' - your body needs its drainage systems to be working properly - I actually resorted over the last couple of weeks to buying shredded wheat [surprisingly effective!!] but also think that the T3 is helping in that respect as well. I think my GB issues stem from 20 years of having unaddressed hypothyroidism - there is a lot of research indicating the link between the 2 and unfortunately my doctors were never interested in properly testing, investigating and treating the hypothyroidism but were all too keen to whip out my GB if I had been prepared to let them. I had asked them to prescribe me UDCA - but they refused, which was why when I saw Jay Davidson's article about TUDCA I obsessed about ordering some and trying it. Wouldn't it be fantastic if via this supp I improve, my digestion improves and I get to keep my GB? and isn't it a shame that I can find out about this and do it and the doctors can't be bothered?

Redlester

[LynneG in reply to Redlester]

Hi, sorry to have gone on so much. It all overwhelms me and sometimes putting it all down , especially when learning of and starting some new supplement (TUDCA) seems to clarify it all in my head.

Let's hope so, that you keep your gallbladder - as you know, so important.

My beautiful dog Lottie ate something in the woods a few years back and we nearly lost her. The vet still can't believe he saved her. She ended up with liver failure affecting gallbladder and pancreas as it would. She was on a drip in intensive care for 4 days. I thought she could have eaten poison put down as some hateful people have been known to do but the vet said absolutely not, there would be different markers. She had eaten something covered in fungal spores, bacteria had exploited and migrated from her bowel to her liver. Her aftercare was many many visits and her liver enzymes were sky high. Vetinary care is so amazing in comparison with ours. Blood sample taken, take her for a walk fo half hour and come back for print out of results. He prescribed her Samelyn. which was milk thistle, SaMe and vit C and E(as preservative) thats all. (not a holistic vet - just your average vet) A week later her liver enzymes were back in Normal range and week after in the low end of the range. She's still on them years later as he feels needs to ensure the drainage pathways working, no inflamation blocking etc. So I don't know if you take milkthistle but from our experience with Lottie it sounds a must. SaMe our body makes, but I am sure we can get synthesized supplements - obviously vets can. I get a lot of my herbs/tinctures from Fushi.co.uk, so stock milkthistle - I love their organic stuff.

I once heard an expert stating that gall stones are not a problem with the gall bladder but the liver. The liver makes bile /the gall baldder just being a storage organ and so the state of the bile is due to the liver not being able to function well and only being able to make sludgy bile. Is the sludgyness what has had an effect on your sphincter? and so the whole nightmare begins. I will see if i can find my video link to Ann Louise Gittlemans interview and will post . Maybe of some help?

UDCA is known to be a protocol to help support the liver isn't it? I wonder why he would he not prescribe! Yes I can see how you would be excited to learn about TUDCA being available. Dr Jay Davidson was so enthusiastic about the benefits of TUDCA for everyone. When you hear someone speak about something and can hear the passion in their voice - you just know.

I remember when deciding on a TUDCA supplement (yes it is that one £34.99 black pouch) I noticed there was one in powder form but not understanding whether this would need to be put in an empty capsule or could just take the powder mixed in water etc. So I shied away from and decided to go with this one as the first time. The other was just pure powder , no additives and so seems the answer for you, worked out cheaper too. I have also remembered that Jay D adds a little NAC to their formula as well as collagen and humic/fulvic minerals.

I can't comment on thyroid meds as basically subclinical - in other words GP's take no notice of symtoms. My TSH rising year on year until started to use the red light. Then fell for the first time ever to 2.8 . The theory and my mindset is the red/nearinfrared light improves mitochondrial health in the thyroid cells which equals better thyroid function and so the brain needs to make less TSH to nudge the thyroid to make more hormone. I would investigate red/nr infrared light to support the mitochondria in your liver, gallbladder, pancreas cells (redlightman.com - UK company) I bought the combi mini (hand held like a hair dryer size £96 I think) fabulous for pointing at specific areas eg thyroid , liver , frontal lobe etc. But my daughter inlaw developed hashimotos and so I gave it her. I then bought the full body panel £720 as every birthday /christmas present for the forseeable future. Stand infront of it for 5 mins or less back and front so 10 mins a day - so easy and relaxing and covering the whole body. However I am going to buy another hand held combi to take on holiday with me as soon as I can afford. I feel it is so beneficial for me and do not want to be without. I have the mindset now after listening to the Mitochondrial Summit experts that it is crucial to support the health and reproduction of mitochondria above all else, so that is the way forward for me x

[Redlester in reply to LynneG]

No LynneG - never apologise for "going on" - so incredibly informative. I learned a lot.

Isn't it a shame that whatever the vet gave your dog isn't available for humans!! I have used MT extensively in the past, but to no avail, and now think that my partic thyroid problem - ISTH [impaired sensitivity to thryoid hormone] which I have had for over 20plus years underlies the liver/GB/SOD problems and that I could take all the remedies in the world until the cows come home [and believe me no one has worked harder at their liver and GB] but until the ISTH is addressed that poor old liver of mine is "closed" [ the best way I can put it" and accumulating all sorts of rubbish, which was what made me realise I could go at the TUDCA but not get anywhere and ultimately at the start of this year I began to self treat with T3, and latterly I felt it was right to go back in with TUDCA when I'd been at the T3 for 3-4 weeks; in time when things are more 'open' I will try other things again, like the MT but i actually think from what JD describes of the TUDCA that if it does its job effectively enough it might be the best option of all - next time I order it I think I will try that brand you are taking - there was a good one made by Nutricost but incredibly expensive and hard to get.

Redlester

[LynneG in reply to Redlester]

healthmeans.com/talk/1104/0

[Redlester in reply to LynneG]

Thanks LynneG

[Lora7again]

How are you feeling now?