soya help

[mandy72]

just how bad is soya

was just going to order some yummy sausages ect online and have just noticed they contain soya

ive never avoided it but never eaten it on purpose

on a good note its all gluten free and made fresh to order

[greygoose]

Soya is very bad. It blocks your thyroid hormone from getting into the cells, thereby making you more hypo.

[mandy72 in reply to greygoose]

its not possible to feel any more hypo than i allready feel

[greygoose in reply to mandy72]

Don't you believe it! Unfermented soya has many other disadvantages, too. For example, it can stop you absorbing protein. It can even cause cancer.

[Hidden in reply to mandy72]

I agree with greygoose , I know you say it's not possible to feel more hypo than you already feel..but think about what you just said. Maybe you feel so bad because you've had Soy products in your diet? xxx

[vixvixvix in reply to greygoose]

Oh no! Greygoose, so no tofu? What about soy sauce and stuff like that- it's fermented so ok right?

[greygoose in reply to vixvixvix]

Tofu is not fermented. So, no tofu.

Soy sauce is supposed to be fermented, but isn't always. So you need to use one you are certain has been fermented.

Only fermented soy is ok, but in small quantities.

[vixvixvix in reply to greygoose]

Please tell me there's a get out clause for being asian! I can't imagine life without tofu, tofu derivatives and the occasional soy milk (the freshly made stuff not the disgusting "pretend" stuff in the supermarkets). At least I can have soy sauce. I should be thankful for small mercies.

[vixvixvix in reply to vixvixvix]

And also thank you for replying. You're such a fountain of knowledge!

[greygoose in reply to vixvixvix]

No, there is no get out clause for being Asian. In Japan and China, soya is fermented. They do not eat unfermented soya in any form - and they certainly don't drink soy milk! Not all tofu is not fermented, so is not all good.

But, there are plenty of forms of fermented soya :

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_...

There seems to be forms of tofu in the list. Is that what you're referring to? If it's fermented, it's ok.

But, be careful with soy sauce. It should be fermented, but often isn't. Make sure before you use it.

[JellyQ]

Oh no only just seen this! Ive been a vegetarian for 30 years, I eat soya mince etc...all soya products are bad? Soya milk too? Is Quorn ok?

[Treepie in reply to JellyQ]

Quorn is primarily made from fungus and egg albumin is used to bind it but in trying to get a meat like taste manufacturers may add other things.Soy has been used so you need to check the label or go to the maker.

[JellyQ in reply to Treepie]

Ive just doubled checked & Quorn is soya free...phew!! Thank you for replying. This forum is so informative.

[Treepie in reply to JellyQ]

Wikipedia will give a full view and it refers to some US products having soya .Whether similar products are available here I do not know.

[JellyQ in reply to Treepie]

Yes I will check all Quorn products now, thank you.

[Hidden in reply to Treepie]

Sorry about this Treepie... my funny sense of humour kicking in again... but you said 'check the label or go to the maker'... the last comment 'go to the maker' could be The Maker. So if they don't check the label Heaven's calling x

[Treepie in reply to Hidden]

Best to check then!

[greygoose in reply to JellyQ]

All unfermented soy is bad. Soya milk is most certainly very bad. If you find a video where quorn is being made, I don't think you'd want to eat it anymore!

[JellyQ in reply to greygoose]

Im running out of things to eat....gluten free, diary free, vegetarian..now soya free! Thank you for the info.

[greygoose in reply to JellyQ]

It is a problem. Do you eat eggs? Pulses? There are many, many vegetables, and plenty of fruit. It just means a lot of hard work preparing.

[JellyQ in reply to greygoose]

Yes I eat all veg, all fruit, pulses, eggs, nuts...after being strict vegetarian for most of my life im now considering eating fish...although there is the high levels of mercury to worry about! I would never eat meat though.

[greygoose in reply to JellyQ]

Try eating small fish. Less mercury in small fish, they say.

[greygoose in reply to greygoose]

Jelly, if you've been consuming unfermented soya for 30 years, there's a possibility that it's the cause of your hypo - if you aren't Hashi's, of course. So, if you stop the unfermented soya, things could go back to normal for you.

[JellyQ in reply to greygoose]

Hi, really sorry only just noticed your last comment. My thyroid problems are recent. I have a multi nodular goiter & ive got a biopsy in a couple of days. I have loads of hypo symptoms although ive been told my thyroid function is normal. So at this point I have no idea whats wrong or why or how. Ive stopped eating all soya products since we chatted & ive been drinking hazelnut milk in my tea/coffee.

[greygoose in reply to JellyQ]

Your thyroid problems don't start the day you're diagnosed - nor the day you notice the goitre, come to that. These things take a lot of time. But the time you notice the first symptoms, it's probably been brewing for years! Everything happens very slowly with thyroid. And, there is no way of knowing just how recent it is!

[JellyQ in reply to greygoose]

Yes, it was only brought to my attention 4 months ago when I noticed a lump in my neck. Previous to that I had been suffering from fatigue. I am only just learning all about the thyroid & the various disorders. Ive put myself forward to do the 5k Big Fun Run next month to raise money for Thyroid Uk.

[greygoose in reply to JellyQ]

It probably took a long, long time for that lump to become noticeable.

[JellyQ in reply to greygoose]

Yes most probably as after ultrasound im told have have numerous lumps, some cysts, some solid & some calcification. Ive been really worried since, wondering what that means for me as in how it would impact my health & what would happen next etc. Ive waited months for a biopsy, which is tomorrow! Im very worried as to what the results will be. Its triggered a lot of anxiety & tears.

[greygoose in reply to JellyQ]

I can imagine, yes. But, at least they're now doing something about it.

[JellyQ in reply to greygoose]

Thank you greygoose the support & advice on here I very much appreciate. I will keep you updated.

[greygoose in reply to JellyQ]

OK. Good luck!

[mandy72]

so seems as long as we live on meat fruit and veg all is good

[JellyQ in reply to mandy72]

Fruit & veg yes...meat no.

[greygoose in reply to JellyQ]

Actually meat yes. It's a myth that eating meat is bad for the health. Bad for the animals' health, granted. But human beings are omnivores, designed to eat both meat and veg. And a variety of other things. So, meat is good - providing we leave the fat on. We're also designed to eat high levels of fat.

[JellyQ in reply to greygoose]

We eat far far too much meat, which is by no means natural...and not good meat either. If you eat organic, free range, top quality cuts from well reared animals maybe once or twice a week then there is benefit. Most people eat factory farmed meat which is pumped with antibiotics etc & is proved to cause cancer. There are no health benefits in processed meat either.

[greygoose in reply to JellyQ]

Totally agree with you there. But, from there to eating no meat at all, is a huge leap, and is not natural, either.

[JellyQ in reply to greygoose]

Just eat fish if its too much of a leap and look on the Vegetarian Society website. All of the vitamins & minerals needed for health can be gathered without meat...but like you said earlier it may take more preparation initially. Ive found being vegetarian really easy. Its the new diet of gluten & diary & soya free which is really hard.

[greygoose in reply to JellyQ]

I would find gluten-free and dairy-free very difficult, too. I did manage it for three months, but it made no difference, so I gave it up. But soya-free would be no problem at all. Even when I didn't eat meat - and I only eat it about once a week, now - I didn't eat soya. For one thing, I find it totally disgusting! lol

[Elven in reply to JellyQ]

I've been vegetarian for 48 years and I agree with you. Meat on the plate means vicious cruelty to animals. It's as simple as that. We have no right to put them through hell in slaughterhouses. We have no right to take their lives.

[JellyQ in reply to Elven]

HI Elven, I agree but it is very much personal choice.

[Elven in reply to JellyQ]

Yes indeed. I don't lecture friends! I just feel that, if meat eaters were shown what really happens in slaughterhouses, in all its terrifying gory truth, they would stop eating meat immediately. When meat products are served up clean, neat and innocent in polystyrene trays topped with clingfilm the ghastly process and suffering involved are safely sanitised.

One of my sons eats meat - his choice. The other is vegetarian.

[mandy72]

wish i didnt ask now

[JellyQ in reply to mandy72]

Hi Mandy its necessary to question & to discuss about our food, its impact on our own health & our environment. Its all good. Its also a personal choice.

[Hidden in reply to mandy72]

Lol xxx

[helvella Administrator]

On a different tack to the other responders, in general the only reason I know to use soy in sausages is to make them cheaper.

Some quantity of a starch substance (whether wheat rusk or something else) can help to make the sausages cook well and retain shape, etc. Not aware of anything positive from soy flour.

[mandy72 in reply to helvella]

i wouldnt say these were cheap sausages £3.40 for 6, made fresh to order

im going to contact them tomorrow and ask how much is in them as really tempted to get some and from talking to others they are really good

[JellyQ]

My vegan friend has just sent me this link, since ive now become fearful of soya, it gives a totally different view....

freefromharm.org/health-nut...

[helvella Administrator in reply to JellyQ]

Your article happily discounts any impact of soy on thyroid.

Not what is reported here:

thyroidmanager.org/chapter/...

[JellyQ in reply to helvella]

Thats a very long & informative link. Ive just quickly read through it but couldnt find any mention of soy. Can you point me to which section please?

[helvella Administrator in reply to JellyQ]

9.8.3 SITUATIONS REQUIRING DOSE ADJUSTMENT

Table 9-13 lists a number of circumstances in which dosage requirements of levothyroxine may change in compliant patients.

Nonspecific absorption of L-T4 by dietary fibers decreases the bioavailability of T4 and necessitates a higher dose of L-T4 in patients with high intake of dietary fiber (whole-wheat bread, granola, bran) (1). A similar phenomenon may operate with the use of soy protein supplement (2).

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Table 9-13. Conditions requiring adjustment of the replacement dose of thyroxine for hypothyroidism.

Increased dose requirement 1. decreased intestinal absorption of T4 – dietary fiber or soy protein supplements 1 ,2,3

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Taking a high-dose phytoestrogen dietary supplementation (30 g soy protein with 16 mg phytoestrogens, representative of a vegetarian diet) for 8 weeks increases 3-fold the risk in subjects with subclinical hypothyroidism to develop overt hypothyroidism (20).

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The site mentions soy in other articles as well.