80 ice cold baths - UPDATE

[Tuccatoo]

Two months ago I started and tomorrow I will grit my teeth for the last time. I have managed one a day, occasionally two but not often 😳. They have become considerably colder as the weather gets frostier and so does my water tank in the attic!!

I've made it, even though halfway I felt I couldn't go on. Nevertheless, anyone who suffers from severe RLS will try anything, right?

Theory is, submerged for 1-2 minutes including your head (nose out to breathe!), It shocks the Hypothalamus into producing dopamine and helps the neuro transmitters as well as the auto immune system.

Result? - (Since augmentation, codeine phosphate is my only relief). Possibly it's psychosomatic but I do feel better. It wakes me up to start the day with a feeling of wellbeing and achievement after a bad night. I don't know if its my imagination but I feel my night attacks are not so severe. My mental state isn't so desperate (I'm sure you know that feeling of "I can't go on and maybe I will end it.) I feel at peace and able to cope, which is a big turn around. (I do have lots of friends praying for me too!)

Now I'm stopping and I will let you know if there is any lasting effect.

X

[Lapsedrunner]

Respect!! That’s badass !!

[V1974]

Wow you're brave! I've been trying cold showers in the hope that it might increase my dopamine levels for a few months now. The cold water supply is definitely getting colder!

[Accipiter]

Respect, you crazy.

I have often thought about ice baths for my lower leg, which is my only area, but thanks to you I don’t need to do that as it would have minimal impact.

I don’t buy into the dopamine theory, an argument not worth engaging in, but physically the trigger points seem to be more receptive when active, than when there are no symptoms. Ice blocks during symptoms definitely stop them if the trigger points are not too deep, but unfortunately not as receptive when awake as you have demonstrated.

There are numerous studies on the benefits of cold therapy, of which I’m sure you have experienced.

Well done for experimenting.

[Hidden]

Well done, what a marathon!

I'm glad you've benefitted from it.

[Hidden]

Thank you so much for your post.

iirc the cold resets the Vagus nerve - something that has been discussed in other threads. I have wondered about the cold water and now God damn it I have reason to try the cold water, damn you.

How cold was the water and did you work your way down to cold or just dive straight in so to speak?

[Crazyleggs in reply to Hidden]

Instead of ice cold water, try chewing gum. It redirects or confuses the vargus nerve and gives pretty fast relief from RLS albeit temporary. I buy Extra brand - spearmint. You can also chew ice chips but not good for your teeth.

Crazzykk leggs

[Shumbah in reply to Crazyleggs]

I wonder if chewing gum also works for pain

Curious 🙂

[Hidden in reply to Crazyleggs]

I must try that, thanks. Singing does too but it can be a bit annoying for people if you start screaming "Scaramouche, Scaramouche, will you do the Fandango?" at 3 am.

[Tuccatoo in reply to Hidden]

Raffs you don't have to do it at 3am!!! Try in the morning when you get up or in the evening and then dive into a warm bed with hot bottles or electric blanket!! I'm sure a shower works too, if you can bear it. I found it hurt my head less if I went into a bath and thoroughly immersed my brain. Every one to their own taste.

[Hidden in reply to Tuccatoo]

I was on about singing as away of stimulating the vagus nerve and reducing RLS

[Tuccatoo in reply to Hidden]

Hi Raffs. I didn't put any ice in the water. Straight cold water from the tank, which has been getting pretty freezing lately as I live in England! A full bath so I could plunge everything under. Firstly, I walked up and down three times in the bath, then went on my knees for 5-10 seconds. Sitting down for 5 seconds before going back and under. I sing very loudly or count on my fingers, as it seemed to help take your mind off the whole thing 😱!! I had a timer and gave myself 2 minutes initially but was then told that 1 minute was enough, so most days I did one and a half minutes. I have to say that I wrote and asked Dr.B if he had heard of this and he was very skeptical. But as I said before, I will try anything once.

One thing I have notices is that during this past 2 months of cold baths I have noted 3 miracle nights when I have not had restless leg movement. This is an amazing improvement as it used to be 3 nights a year. ? Placebo effect - who knows?

[Hidden in reply to Tuccatoo]

Thanks for the info.

Would a shower work too or does it have to be a bath?

I imagine a shower would be more bearable as you could dance around under it to distract a bit,

[DicCarlson]

The cold water therapy is tapping into the Vagus Nerve - the longest of the cranial nerves. It starts in the brain, where it sends signals to the cells there. It then wanders through the body, from the brain through the neck and throat to the heart, lungs and other organs. You can accomplish this quite readily with a cold basin of water. Dip your face into the water and hold it there for a few seconds. This also activates the mammalian diving reflex - lowering heart rates. More ways to activate the Vagus Nerve include, humming, singing, deep breathing, etc. More here... victoriaalbina.com/vagusnerve/

[Tuccatoo in reply to DicCarlson]

Thanks for that, I think research is discovering so much more lately, and we are understanding so much more too. Well, looking at the sight I have done 3 things right. Cold water, singing loudly and praying!

[Smiler53]

Well done you 🥶🥶🥶 keeping everything crossed for you.

[Sara_2611]

very good luck very brave -theres no ay would I bite any bullet & submerge any part of my body in cold water fair play to you

[Tuccatoo]

Thank you Guitar Bear. Very wise words. Something not to be attempted unless you are very healthy and only suffer from RLS.

[involuntarydancer]

HI Tuccatoo,

First of all total respect for that experiment. Did you have the cold baths in the morning? Would there be any argument for having them in the evening to induce dopamine release in preparation for the RLS dominated night ahead?

Also did you find any improvement to your immune system generally? My brother has been trying out something similar on the basis of some evidence he has unearthed of the benefits of cold water immersion for cancer sufferers.

[Tuccatoo in reply to involuntarydancer]

Hi there. I tried both evening and morning baths and occasionally both on the same day, to get it over and done with more quickly! I can't say which would be best. Morning woke me up, invigorated and ready for the day. Evening I jumped into a warm cosy bed. Without medical research, I suspect it's a case of "do whatever you can cope with!" Sounds easy, but it wasn't 😳. I dreaded it on cold mornings

Regarding the immune system, again it is hard to say. Most winters I go down with anything that is going, especially looking after grandchildren. But I have to say that this winter I have had nothing so far, which is a plus. I have read 3 articles lately that say those who have cold baths or showers are far less likely to take time off work due to illness. I also read a medical article that said that dopamine levels increase with cold water therapy.

As I said before, mentally I feel I can cope with RLS on a different level and don't feel so low. As for long term, I will log my nights to see if there is an improvement over a period of time. Will definitely let people know if it is a positive result.

[silvia10]

Sounds like the wim hof method. Do you do the breathing as well? That might help too. On you tube there are videos about it.

[Skylark1968]

Please could you tell me how you got into the cold waters... Do it fast or do it slow...

[Tuccatoo in reply to Skylark1968]

The cold bath experience was three years ago. It took a lot of will power. Starting walking up and down the bath then kneeling for short period followed by sitting and eventually plunging under (singing out loud!)

It did help me mentally but it isn't a cure for RLS. Please be sure you are able and healthy before you try this.

Three years later I am in a different place thanks to Professor Walker in London (a specialist in RLS) I came off all drugs, again something not to be done lightly, very carefully reducing very slowly as you will get really bad reactions. As I was only getting about 3 hours sleep a night his advice was to increase this with a certain sleeping pill and see what happens. I took them initially for 2 weeks (no alcohol must be taken together) and now am able to take them every other day or even just 3 times a week. I am a new person haven't been so good in 30 years. Plus the support of two lovely praying friends!!

This is only my experience so PLEASE see a known specialist for RLS and don't try anything on your own.

Wishing you all the best in your situation.

[Skylark1968 in reply to Tuccatoo]

Thank you for you kindness to reply to me. I've already had RLS for more than 10 years now and has only be getting worse. I have had seen many specialist here in NZ... But the meds they would give only lasted for about a year until either augmentation would start again or they decided I have to be a quinoa pig and try another bla bla bla bla... But what they don't realise is that all new meds come with so many side effects , and this has landed me in ED already too many times. It's now so bad that I am as well only getting about 3 to 4 hours sleep .. I'm at the end of my rope, and the health system here is in a state of crises... I'll be lucky to even be seen by another specialist within 7months... Gps are now having to solve most emergency cases like mine, and most have absolutely no clue what to do , only prescribing drugs that are not even for anything related to this horendous RLS. It's crazy .. and totally appalling.... But .... I thank you for your reply , and wish you all the best.

[Tuccatoo in reply to Skylark1968]

All of us who suffer from this DO understand your dilemma and have experienced similar situations. I have gained such wisdom from this site especially from those with great knowledge like Joolsg to mention but one.

I don't think I am allowed to state the medication and advice that Professor Walker gave to me on this site but you could perhaps go privately and ask for a video call? Just a thought as it has changed my life.

[Rlssurvivor]

If the symptoms come back, I strongly recommend cupping. It is the only thing that helps , as I write this at 2am while ending a cupping session to get back to sleep. I had been pain free for two weeks now and went to bed only to wake up with the pain coming back . When I put the cups on my outer and inner thigh for about 10 minutes it alleviates the pain enough for me to sleep the rest of the night. Do 200 squats or taking a bath may give me relief for an hour or so.