Does urinary frequency/urgency diminish after cessation of ADT?

[SongofFred]

I’m on the last month of a one year course of Orgovyx/Nubeqa for 4+3, 4.7PSA (now .006), Decipher .88. Brachyboost with pelvic SBRT 8/23 at UCLA

My bladder volume at baseline was 500-600 ml (even hit 700 once). But over the months it has steadily decreased to currently 200-300ml. 350 if I really torture myself.

Im seeing online there may be a correlation to ADT.

Has anyone’s frequency/urgency diminished after finishing ADT?

Bonus question: I also lost 1 1/2” on erection. Looks like I may be SOL on that one, but anyone have any length restoration after ADT?

Thanks

[Tall_Allen]

Where did you read that?

[SongofFred in reply to Tall_Allen]

Not first-level evidence, hence my wording “may be”. Unfortunately, the subject seems to be under-studied.

This is only a population-based study:

ar.iiarjournals.org/content...

“Our study indicated that androgen ablation treatment is associated with an increased risk of OAB and that an increase in treatment duration increases cumulative risk of OAB.”

also, “the prominent delay in the development of OAB after the start of ADT, possibly also indicates slowly developing structural changes in the lower urinary tract…”

This one on SpringerLink also apparently associates length of ADT with increased OAB symptoms: (I can’t read it so I can only go by summary)

link.springer.com/article/1...

Since there seems to be little study on it, I’m wondering what members’ personal experiences were with OAB after cessation of ADT.

[Tall_Allen in reply to SongofFred]

Thanks! I'd never even seen it suggested before, and never heard it from patients.

[cancerfox]

I don't claim to be an expert on this, but brachytherapy and RT are known to have the potential to cause increased urinary frequency, so it may not be the ADT causing your situation. I know they have had that effect on me. 🦊

[SongofFred in reply to cancerfox]

Thank you. How long ago was your Brachy? Can I ask if your frequency keeps getting steadily worse? Has it plateaued? Or has it started getting better?

After 9 months, mine just keeps getting worse and I’m hoping there’s something to the ADT aspect since that’s the only variable that will soon change. (But even if it was partly caused by ADT, the damage may have already been done).

[cancerfox in reply to SongofFred]

I had IMRT in April-May 2021, then LDBrachy shortly thereafter, so the radioactivity from the LDBrachy probably was pretty much dissipated by around March 2022. My overactive bladder and unfavorable change in bowel movements have persisted about the same since then, so over two years ago and counting with little change. 🦊

[SongofFred in reply to cancerfox]

Ugh. Sorry to hear that. Did you have ADT? How long?

[cancerfox in reply to SongofFred]

I had 13 months of ADT (Eligard) concurrent with the radiation treatments, starting about 2 months before the first IMRT sessions. 🦊

[PT49]

I was on lupron for 6 months after SBRT. The first 3 months didn't notice much change in urinary habits. Then months 4, 5, 6, and first month and a half post lupron I would be urinating 2-3 times a night (approx. 2-300 ml). Now , 4+ months post lupron, I am sleeping through the night. Urine volume has increased and urgency has significantly decreased.

[SongofFred in reply to PT49]

Thank you. That’s great. I’m hoping at least part of that is due to your T recovery.

[Yokohama2023]

Hi, I had LD brachytherapy first and 15 EBRT sessions after. I was on Lupron and casodex for a total of 9 months. Gleason 7 . Im only 3 months since stooping ADT so still waiting like you. Yeah I noticed a strong sense of urgency to pee maybe 9-10 times a day with a small amount of volume coming out. I mean wicked strong feeling, over a week or 2 I started to hold it and the feeling would go away. I’d wake up 2-3 times at night not a huge change. Now this feeling only happens a few times a day so definitely going away sometimes only once. Some nights I only wake up once to pee. There is a definite improvement though not sure if this is radiation or hormone related as my seeds are still active for up to a year, though a lot weaker. In about 6 weeks I’ll get my testosterone checked and see if there is a correlation with any improvement and post something. Lack of usage has dimished my enormous manhood to a normal size. ..joke. A little bit smaller wasn’t aware this type of treatment would have an impact have read about prostatectomy. Also wondering with T recovery if this will be normal but will have to wait half a year I presume.

[SongofFred]

Great. You’re heading in the right direction and that’s a relief to hear. I hope someday they can figure out ADT’s contribution (if any) to urgency/frequency. I know the change in cellular structure is already known which can cause significant shortening and ED. Hope you heal up all the way.

[Yokohama2023 in reply to SongofFred]

Thanks, good, luck to you I’d assume things will get better for you once you stop the ADT. I really started to notice big improvements at the 3 month mark ! Keep in mind the last shot will impact you for 30 days. Not sure of your age but I’m 57. I assume big variances depending on age. One thing that’s really helped is exercise, walking, lifting weights .. any and all of the above. I’m into sauna, cold dunk, and onsens .. and of course getting at least 20-30 mins of outdoor sun wish you the best.