Switch from Lupron/abi to Orgovyx/abi?

[jackwfrench]

As I approaching my third 3 month shot of Lupron I wonder if Orgo might push out my time fence to MCRP more than Lupron, but I don't see anything on it. Lupron/abi dropped my PSA and TT very quickly so that is not an advantage, but the side effects are considered to be less - though my side effects seem more from abi than Lupron. Perhaps Libido is better with Orgo as it is about gone. It's $650/month on Orgo vs. free Lupron, but that doesnt bother me too much. Comments welcome!

[Tall_Allen]

It doesn't delay time to CRPC. No difference in libido. "No testosterone" is what both drugs do.

[Murk in reply to Tall_Allen]

Most consider changing when side effects from the Lupron shots are an issue.

[Tall_Allen in reply to Murk]

Which side effects?

[Murk in reply to Tall_Allen]

You asking JackWFrench or me? I say all the side effects that have been clearly documented here and throughout.

[Tall_Allen in reply to Murk]

You wrote: "Most consider changing when side effects from the Lupron shots are an issue."

I asked "which side effects?" I'm wondering which you perceive as an issue exclusive to Lupron shots that are resolved by Orgovyx. The ones JackWFrench mentioned time to CR and libido) are the same for both drugs.

[Murk in reply to Tall_Allen]

Wow yur the Stud here when it comes to PCa but its documented of people complaining and hurting from the Lupron shots, how there given and pain at the injection site. How Lupron effects lingers afterwards on versus Orgovyx. Its all personal and varies but some report more seizures, bone mineral density, diabetes etc...

Its known to be better tolerated in general. Its take days versus months in lowering Testosterone, and faster return to normal testosterone levels after treatment is stopped.

I guess are you defending having Lupron shots versus oral Orgovyx and its side effects are less? If shots were better, and had less side effects, then why can Sumitomo Pharma charge so much? Why do lots of low life USA insurance companies not support or pay for its doctor prescription?

[Tall_Allen in reply to Murk]

Injection site reactions can occur. But compliance issues can effect Orgovyx: missing even a day can be injurious because the half-life is only 24 hours.

There is no report of seizures with Lupron. Bone mineral density and diabetes are the same with any kind of ADT. They are caused by low testosterone, as are the issues you raised in your original post..

"Its known to be better tolerated in general" No, there is no evidence for that. Orgovyx is non-inferior to Lupron, not superior. It does act quicker and end quicker. But since you've been taking Lupron until now, its quick action is irrelevant.

"I guess are you defending having Lupron shots versus oral Orgovyx and its side effects are less? " No, I said nothing of the kind and you are raising a straw man argument.

"If shots were better, and had less side effects, then why can Sumitomo Pharma charge so much? Why do lots of low life USA insurance companies not support or pay for its doctor prescription?" New brand-name drugs always cost more - it has nothing to do with comparative quality - the drug companies are just trying to make as much as they can. Insurance cos. are trying to pay as little as they can.

[Murk in reply to Tall_Allen]

So lets end this and my original comment is true LOL! Most consider changing when side effects from the Lupron shots are an issue. People react differently to different treatments.

BTW, "quick action is relevant" since it does ends quicker.

[Tall_Allen in reply to Murk]

"Comments welcome!"you wrote. Why did you ask for comments if you had already made up your mind? The only things that are "true" in any science, including medicine, is what is proven to be true in clinical trials. Patients who believe things are true based on "Most consider..." are only using anecdotes as evidence, or looking for anecdotal comments that reinforce their pre-existing beliefs. It is about as far from the truth as one could get.

[Murk in reply to Tall_Allen]

Sorry the system here deleted the special characters from my last response wehre I was clarifying my original response.

I also realize that I errored in that my original response was to Tall_Allen, and not Jackwfrench, which was my intention. So if you re-read it makes more sense.

My bad, sorry I caused confusion, but it was a nice yarn fest

[janebob99]

I believe that when you eventually go off of Orgovyz, that your testosterone will recover naturally very quickly. This is in contrast to Lupron, where the T-recovery is much longer. Perhaps ToolBeltZia will comment on this aspect...

Bob

[dhccpa in reply to janebob99]

Read TA's comment. Orgovyx blocks the effects of T, even if your T level stays high.

[Mgtd]

I am sure you are aware that the impact of ADT on us individually determines the impact on T recovery. I can only speak for myself and do not offer you any broad generalizations based on that.

That said here it is. Prior to ADT/Lupron my baseline T was almost 800 at age 78. I am very active - gym and aerobics 6 days a week. Good diet. No alcohol.

25 sessions of radiation and 6 months of ADT. Four months after ending ADT the T was 233. Which is almost at the low end of normal range. PSA is not detectable.

My RO and MO no longer track my T since all my SE are totally gone and I can feel the difference which is the important point.

I personally chose the 6 months ADT rather than a longer course. Time will tell if I made the correct decision but as you can see my T responded quickly.

[jackwfrench in reply to Mgtd]

Yes I wonder if I switched to RT after 6mo whether I’d have a chance at T recovery I might not get staying on Lupron- my MO wants to stay Lupron/abi until failure but PSA steadily <.1 and T <10 so far. But the only radiation guy I could find, Phuoc Tran would want to radiate not only the hip lesion and T10 lesion, but the pelvic area. (I had recurrence two years after RP and reached 2.2 PSA)