Failed the pip: Well guys I didn't get pip, I didn't... - NRAS

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Failed the pip

Carolsos profile image
53 Replies

Well guys I didn't get pip, I didn't think I would. Because I have had no time of work and I stand up all shift, apparently my limbs are ok so my mobility is good. The letter said I was not fatigued during the whole assessment. It was a telephone assessment, I am not going to be fatigued. So I didn't get any points even though I said I use a stick when am walking. And because I can plan and follow a route I don't qualify either. I can budget and because I don't have aids to help me I must be alright! Well to tell you the truth I didn't think I would get anywhere with this. I am not going to challenge this but I will do another one in a few years time and by that time I probably will be worse. Just thought to let you know. Hope everyone is keeping ok on this freeing cold day. Pleased it's the weekend and 2 days off now.

53 Replies
Ajay575 profile image
Ajay575

Sorry to hear It is stressfull id maybe contact welfarights through council

Not good when you hear this

The planning journey etc and budgeting are mainly for mental health

Zero points not good but does indicate flawed report

Not sure ifyou use aids lots with ra get points for that as well

Your mobility is straightforward with or without a stick

Upto 20 metres

Or upto 50 metres

Physical

Youll know yourself with distance to appeal or not

Lots only apply for mobility and care later

The planning journey is mobility ( mental health )

Sorry to hear

MadBunny profile image
MadBunny

I'm so sorry to hear it wasnt successful and that it was a stressful experience for you How on earth can you be fatigued in a phone call for goodness sake🙄. I'd better stop there or I'll end up having a rant lol. Take care xx

Carolsos profile image
Carolsos in reply to MadBunny

My thoughts too, I don't think I know anybody being fatigued during a phone call!!!

Dragonfly2020 profile image
Dragonfly2020 in reply to Carolsos

I was mentally fatigued during my telephone PIP & from involuntary becoming overwhelmed & upset & burst into tears 😭 when asked if I had suicidal thoughts! I hadn’t & said this & explained that bluntness of the question was too much. I failed PIP got some points but not enough. The report was so wrong in many ways it was astonishing. I said I had suffered long term depression & had suicidal thoughts & was being supported by GP & Family care network. Honestly none of that is even the slightest bit true. Because I have a car zero points because of the physicality / cognitive ability needed to drive ! I made it clear that yes I have a car but I can’t drive spontaneously whenever I want. I’m in bed for whole days sleeping & in pain, not getting dressed washed & unable to get downstairs. To much pain/fatigue to think about going out in the car. I appealed & included a formal complaint about the suicidal mistake & others in the first report but I still got rejected at MAR and they never even acknowledged or heard my complaint. It’s just a horrible broken /not fit for purpose system. I was off work & had been for 7months when I put my intitial PIP app in. I was 2 weeks off my employment being terminated. I got back to working but with a GP fit note saying I am fit to work if I work from home. Work are unhappy about this ‘because others would like to still work from home” and it’s hard for them when I’m allowed to still work from home” honestly, work as bad & have no clue about reasonable adjustments! Hey ho ! It’s the season to be jolly! 🎄🎄🌲

Neonkittie17 profile image
Neonkittie17 in reply to Dragonfly2020

I am sorry you had a horrible report of assumptions about you and your health that weren’t true and I would have done exactly the same as you and written and said that’s not true. No one wants that on their records. Did you let your GP have a copy of your reply to PIP?

Dragonfly2020 profile image
Dragonfly2020 in reply to Neonkittie17

Thank you Neon Kitty, I didn’t even think to advise my GP I was applying for PIP because, I was off work I’ll at the time & had all on the get the PIP form completed (I had to ask for an time extension ) . On reflection I should have & asked for GP endorsement but it’s all so exhausting /overwhelming isn’t it ? I just didn’t have the energy or mindset to get an appeal in after the failed MAR.

Pippy25 profile image
Pippy25

I am so sorry, sad and cross to hear this Carol.

You have gone through and are going through so much and this no doubt must feel like a kick in the teeth.

I realise you have lots going on but as Ajay said perhaps contact Welfare Rights if you have the energy and see if they can help.

Take a deep breath and think things out as it is stressful but also how will this help you not only today but in the future. Meanwhile sending you some heartfelt wishes, Love Pip xx

julie1908 profile image
julie1908

Oh no! So sorry.. so did you not score anything for the daily living component section? X

Carolsos profile image
Carolsos in reply to julie1908

I got zero on everything!!

Mmrr profile image
Mmrr

So sorry to hear this 😥

Fruitandnutcase profile image
Fruitandnutcase

I’m really sorry to hear that you’ve not got your PIP. It’s very tough that decisions as important as that can be made by telephone.

I dont know much about it (obviously) but I just don’t understand the ‘not fatigued by a phone call’ decision and you ‘being able to budget and plan’. I can do all that but I still use plug pulls on sockets and a grip thing for jars and there are things I have to leave for my other half to do because I don’t have the strength to do it myself.

Maybe you need to look into aids that are available and that would make life easier for you - then if your next assessment is by phone, half way through it tell the interviewer that sorry they’ll have to call back you’re too exhausted to continue!

Carolsos profile image
Carolsos in reply to Fruitandnutcase

Good point there

springcross profile image
springcross

I'm sorry to hear this Carol, on top of everything else you're going through. I don't know anything about PIP assessments, but it does sound absolutely ridiculous for someone to say you weren't fatigued during the assessment when you're talking on the phone and it sounds like a cutting corners assessment to me!

Neonkittie17 profile image
Neonkittie17

Did you get any letters of support from your GP or consultant to submit with the form? You’ve been very honest with them about your work and what you do, but it doesn’t mean it doesn’t hurt like mad to do it and it exhausts you/you feel shattered afterwards. I realise now is not a good time to try challenge anything, but have a think again when you feel more up to it. Sorry to hear this. Also, how can anyone properly tell you’re not fatigued when it’s a phone call?? They make a lot of incorrect assumptions. 😑

CripLady profile image
CripLady

Sorry to hear this. You have enough on at the moment, but in another year or two join Benefits and Work and use their guides to help you.

With a fluctuating condition they are legally obliged to adhere to a ‘majority of days’ criteria. And whether or not you can complete things safely and repeatedly.

Rest time/ pain or flares after exertion etc should be taken into account. Include relevant RA letters and get a copy of your GP notes and highlight all relevant info.

Evidence is needed, and ‘lived experience’ examples.

Put this away for the foreseeable future. It’s far too much for you at the moment xxx

Carolsos profile image
Carolsos in reply to CripLady

Thank you all for your support and kind thoughts. As I said I will tackle this again in a few years maybe. Take care everyone

Greenginger12 profile image
Greenginger12 in reply to Carolsos

Sorry to hear about your pip experience, like yourself i to was turn down, i have mh and other health relates issues got only 4 points pip assessment needs an overhaul, better trained staff, it the goverment way of trying to save money. Rant over. Good luck and stay safe.

SBlu profile image
SBlu in reply to Carolsos

This is great advice from 'CripLady'. It costs about £20 to sign up to the benefitsandwork.co.uk website but it provides extensive and invaluable advice about applying for PIP - lots of it specifically aimed at those of us with RD (or similar).

I'm sorry you weren't successful but the PIP application is designed to create failure - not least because the companies conducting the assessments are rewarded financially for each claim they turn down.

Although you must feel very disheartened at the moment - if you do feel up to it - I would recommend you apply for a mandatory reconsideration but only after you have a good look at the benefits and work website and/or get some advice from the CAB. It could be worth it in the long term.

Best of luck.

Kee10 profile image
Kee10

Sorry to hear this 😔How long After your assessment did you receive your decision?

Carolsos profile image
Carolsos in reply to Kee10

3 weeks

Boo01 profile image
Boo01

hey, I did my pip call a while ago and got 0 for everything. I then went to Citizens Advice and the lady was amazing. She told me exactly how to word the mandatory reconsideration. I wish I’d gone there before sending in the PIP initially as it was mind blowing my different to what I wrote.

If you could get an appointment, do try. It really changed how I look at the application.

Also, one thing she said which I was amazed by, if you’ve been ill for a long time (which most of us have) you have adjusted your life slowly each time and you need to peel back and go back to all the small things you do which healthy people don’t need to.

Best of luck xxx

Carolsos profile image
Carolsos in reply to Boo01

Thank you for the tip.

Boo01 profile image
Boo01

Sorry, I saw you want to wait a bit. So definitely when you’re ready to reapply in a few years, get Citizens Advice to help. They were amazing

Firion profile image
Firion

I suggest you ask for mandatory reconsideration and go to CAB or similar to get help with it. CAB has pretty good results but will also tell you if it is not worth trying

Lizard28 profile image
Lizard28

I’m so sorry for you, I’d appeal. My hubby been on PIP for many years, he is 68 now and not getting any better, it’s been very difficult to see a doctor, he even got a physio consult on the phone only to be told she can’t help him, go back to your doctor. It’s been hopeless for him. They took his advanced mobilty off him just before he turned 65, he was not in a good place to appeal. He got a another assessment over the phone a few months ago, honestly they have now taken £100 off him because he didn’t sound nervous over the phone and a few other things they have stated wrongly. This time he is going to appeal, he can’t walk far and is the worse he has ever been. They can still take things off you over 65 but I don’t think you will get them back. It’s a very unfair system.

Firion profile image
Firion in reply to Lizard28

You can't make a new claim for PIP if you are over pension age (66), you then claim Attendance Allowance, but if you are already getting PIP it continues, and if your needs change or they get it wrong you should get the right amount, but again, get support from CAB or other organisation, they will take the stress out of the process and it does make a difference.

Lizard28 profile image
Lizard28 in reply to Firion

Yes we are definitely going to appeal, we should have done it when they took him off advanced mobility just before the age limit came into place. We have nothing to lose trying to appeal. How can they say what they say with a telephone appointment, it’s just ridiculous. I just wish we could have recorded it as what she put in her report was not correct. So stressful, it really is.

Firion profile image
Firion in reply to Lizard28

Believe me, I know how stressful, but believe me it does make it easier to get the right help. You are supposed to ask for a mandatory reconsideration within a month, but they will accept it up to 13 months, if still not happy you can appeal. Good luck!

Lizard28 profile image
Lizard28 in reply to Firion

Thank you x

Maureengibson profile image
Maureengibson

I am so sorry, it’s ridiculous the assumptions made over a phone call. I have so many people tell me to apply, as I struggle with all my day to day activities. I had a severe stroke 4.5yr ago due to an adrenal crisis. My body does not produce cortisol, the stress hormone. I was advised to avoid stress as it triggers low symptoms which can progress to being life threatening. So my stroke specialist and endocrinologist who manages my adrenal insufficiency advise me to avoid stressful situations, hence the hesitancy in applying.I have dreadful memory issues from the stroke, which even my GP is unaware of, because I always take notes in advance for appointments whether F2F or phone appointments, so they think my memory is excellent when I tell them I seen a specialist in 2016 and what they said 😂😂. I have ankylosing spondylitis and there’s a gentleman who works for the charity who writes support letters for pip and blue badge applications. Perhaps the rheumatology charity offer something similar. As someone else mentioned citizens advice are very good at wording your responses to qualify for points. Take care and reapply when you have the strength. 🤗

Neonkittie17 profile image
Neonkittie17 in reply to Maureengibson

Yes you should apply Maureen, most definitely. Carol is making her poor knees and joints worse struggling with a job most fully fit people would find hard. Just because she has immense willpower, courage and determination shouldn’t make her or anyone else in a similar situation hammer themselves with doing such a hard job. I hope you will apply Maureen and hope Carol will too again when times are less difficult for her. x

Tourk profile image
Tourk

Sorry to hear you went through such a terrible ordeal and came out with nothing. Unfortunately pip is rigged against people getting the help they so desperately need.After handing out billions to party donors, friends and family to buy ppe that that no one needed only to end up dumped in fields across the country. To treat people so disgracefully is a double insult.

A friend of mine who has advanced MS has just been turned down again and has been told he cannot really for several years. He can move his arms so Apparently that means he can look after himself! He got one point out of the possible 7 . Putting him 1 point away from the higher rate. It's disgusting if they treated a dog so poorly people would be up in arms about it. But people with disabilities who cares

Unfortunately it comes under the heading of welcome to tory Britain. The land of high prices high taxes, low wages and no morrels.

I know saying this doesn't help you, but we should not just be angry at how people are being treated we should be outraged. On the bright side people are starting to stand against their tyranny we are see Strikes up-and-down the country, desperate people are taking action. Not that Labour are much better but at least its a step in the right direction.

Rant over.

keep your spirits up don't let them get to you. There are good people in this country that care about you.

Evie3 profile image
Evie3

Being an OAP now, i am still on DLA but back then, they wrote to my Dr and RA consultant for their comments. Suppose dont do that now. By the way….I cannot use aids at all because of my grip., so that shouldnt be a question! Take care

KittyJ profile image
KittyJ in reply to Evie3

Aids don’t all need grip, it covers a multitude of items like a shower stool, automatic can opener etc.

Evie3 profile image
Evie3 in reply to KittyJ

true and I can tick that box 👵🏻

Carolsos profile image
Carolsos in reply to KittyJ

I think it didn't help that I still work as a chef, but I am limited in what I can do, cannot lift anything heavy or unscrew things. I can manage the tin opener because it's attached to the table so you press down hard to open the tins. I also have no where to sit but I do go outside if I need to sit down. Because I am on my feet all the time the letter said I have strong limbs! Unbelievable even though I said once am home have to rest with my legs up as my knees are swollen!! These people have no idea! but I am better than some others which is good because I don't have to rely on the pip money!! I have 5 years until I retire and I will apply before that. I will continue going for walks even with my walking stick if I need it.

lucymead profile image
lucymead

So sorry to hear this but RA is not on the list of acceptable diseases by the DWP for any allowances. We have to have to other things going on that are on the list. The others on this site are right the system is flawed . My late husband was ill most days with undiagnosed cancer for 3years. we only got help when he had two months to live. The council wellfare rights agent got us backpay for 3years plus help in our home so I could nurse him easily. Do Not Give up. Contact Wellfare Rights at your local council.

madme1 profile image
madme1

Carol you need to contact Welfare Rights, they can help support your claim. The DWP are acting on the fact that they know you won't fight for it. You have a right to at least a mandatory reconsideration.

Bagpuss2021 profile image
Bagpuss2021

I had the same sort of reply

strongmouse profile image
strongmouse

The assessment for PIP is based on your day to day ability to do things against a set criteria, whether you work or not.

It is important to know what that criteria is so that you can see how you fit into it. Otherwise it is like playing a game of chess without knowing the rules!

Many people are tunred down at first application and then are awarded PIP. There are two components 'care' and 'mobility'.

I used the information provided by 'Work and Benefits' website. There is a fee for joining, but I found it incredibly helpful. I was turned down for first for IB, when I wasn't well enough to work, and also for DLA (which is now PIP), both times I appealed and was granted the benefit, so don't give up.

You need to be aware of the criteria for scoring points and the language they use. Sorry to hear that you have been turned down, but you can appeal. First asking for a mandatory appeal , highlighting how you qualify, and then by going to a Tribunal.

Scope have some useful information - scope.org.uk/advice-and-sup...

smilelines profile image
smilelines

I wonder how much training the person had that was speaking with you on the phone. I remember really feeling vulnerable with all of the insensitive questions that they asked. I wondered if I was even speaking with a trained professional rather than a clerk with limited training. I am in Canada and this was for insurance not PIP. These processes are really hard and once you have tome to get over this horrible experience I hope you try again.

CripLady profile image
CripLady in reply to smilelines

In Britain they are done by private companies who get paid bonuses to fail people…🤬

smilelines profile image
smilelines in reply to CripLady

And I bet they are not trained very well because honestly these people do a lot of emotional damage because we are in such a vulnerable position. It would be interesting to know if they are even nurses.

CripLady profile image
CripLady in reply to smilelines

A few are, but the term ‘health professional’ is used which covers ambulance workers, occupational health etc who don’t necessarily have any medical training. It’s dangerous because their word overrides GPs and Consultants which is complete madness. The system has caused loads of suicides, but no investigative reports are undertaken or published. Campaigners have been asking for years.

smilelines profile image
smilelines in reply to CripLady

I am not surprised by the suicides. At all. 😢

CripLady profile image
CripLady in reply to smilelines

It’s really appalling.

Helen-NRAS profile image
Helen-NRAS

Good morning. If you would like support, information or just someone to talk to, our NRAS helpline is open every weekday from 9.30am to 4.30pm nras.org.uk/helpline/ 0800 298 7650. Or have a look at our website nras.org.uk.

Micro profile image
Micro

I just wrote you a long reply but have lost it !Short version is Citizens Advice were brilliant though this is prob fifteen years ago.

They reduced my meandering long winded replies to brief sentences. I was rejected initially but when I said I wanted to appeal I got a letter almost by return post saying I had been successful.

Something odd there as if my forms had landed on another person's desk when I asked to appeal.

Also, while you're getting back to having another try collect as much evidence as you can to send with it....doc letters, tests, anything you can dig up. Tell your doc you're going to do it and pin him down long enough to explain how hard things are for you in detail. Will j luck he may find you letters himself to back you up.

I know how emotionally draining it is a to fill in the forms, horrid, and harder if you are someone who does your best not to moan and keeps a stiff upper lip...

But tell him her how bad things are.

Get and keep copies of all correspondence too. The nurse who came to my home to assess me completely ignored what had been written before. Having her report in writing helped me point out the mismatch (it was blatantly wrong)and helped my info to be accepted.Just do it in small steps but DO get some help. I believed I was intelligent enough to do the form alone but it was a whole different ball game ith help from Citizens Advice (who came to me home. This lady was wonderful.

Good luck ! (We shouldn't really need luck !)

I always have to say this again, but you must remember that primarily this is NOT a job interview, so you do not perform up, you must treat the interview as if it is your worse day not best or anything in between, they will judge one day (good) x 365 and say you are good all year round. I would advise that your speak to an advisor at Choices and Rights Disability Coalition, Jude Lodge Tiverton House, Tiverton Road, Bransholme, Hull, HU7 4QS Tel: (01482) 878778.

Remember the DWP may be tasked with providing benefit and support but they actually end up doing the opposite, doing their utmost in saving money and passing the buck to local authorities. They certainly won't volunteer any help or advice, you have a better chance of getting blood out of a stone.

It is always better to have someone else on your side, no matter how good we may be at dealing with bureaucracy, I made the same mistake, as the DWP have to listen when you have 3rd party support.

Good luck next time time, the PIP is supposed to be there to help you continue to work not end up out of work.

KittyJ profile image
KittyJ in reply to Stephenlangtonriley

PIP isn’t there to help you continue to work though.

in reply to KittyJ

Agreed. It’s intended to cover the additional costs that directly arise out of being disabled, regardless of your employment status, or general ability to work.

Stephenlangtonriley profile image
Stephenlangtonriley in reply to KittyJ

Yes it is intended to help you with extra costs of being disabled and that does mean also to continue to work if you can, not to make you unemployed and living off PIP which helps but doesn't go far.

KittyJ profile image
KittyJ in reply to Stephenlangtonriley

there is other support to help you stay in work but it’s not what PIP is for. Nowhere does it mention work. If you use it for that then that’s up to you but you don’t need to.

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