After 23 years of RA and then Sjogrens, and a good deal of trying to ignore it and Doctor's advice, many years of trying to find the right eating plan and then returning to old habits. I have come to realise that for me, a plant based, clean way of eating is what helps my body cope with RA, along with exercise and lots of movement and of course, some medication.
There are many Doctors, who now support a clean and healthy diet along with exercise as a part of the approach to treating RA.
When I go 'off piste' and eat dairy or sugar (I never eat meat or fish), my body feels dreadful within hours, oh and anything with white flour hurts. The feeling Yuk, starts in my stomach and kidneys and within a few hours, I feel tired and then the stiffness gets worse. This is for one little treat!
I know there are many, many people on this site and elsewhere who denounce changes to diet, they have tried and it has not worked for them. So it appears, that a healthy lifestyle which includes a clean eating plan is not the answer for everyone. To be honest it is not THE answer for me, but I do strongly believe that my body is better able to cope with RA because I don't burden it with rubbish that provides little nutrition and feeds inflammation.
I would suggest that trying an anti-inflammatory diet, is a fairly long term commitment rather like the medications we take, give it a chance to work. It takes time to cleanse your body and for it to become accustomed to a new eating plan. Once your body has settled down, you can experiment to find out what makes you feel worse, but I would suggest one thing at a time and only 1 small portion.
Sorry if this offends anyone. I totally accept that people will disagree with my point of view, also that many have tried diets and they don't work for them.
We are individuals, our RA is unique to us, we all must do what feels right for us.
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Brushwork
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Absence of evidence, is not evidence of absence. Michaela Peterson has had RA since age 3. After eating nothing but meat and broccoli, she went into remission. For a significant proportion of people food matters.
I never claimed it was evidence based, had I done that, I would have included references.
Some foods, if you’d care to research this, are widely accepted to feed inflammation. This is why I used the term, maybe I should have said natural, and unprocessed.
I clearly said that I take medication and that a good, clean diet and exercise helps rather than cures RA, and actually most ailments.
I was simply sharing my own thoughts and experience, if this is not acceptable then please tell me what this forum is for.
I agree Brushwork as you are saying really is anything is worth a try and if it works it’s great but everyone is individual, but it’s a well know fact that sugar & processed foods are inflammatory but that’s also known in lots of other diseases,
Absolutely whaleroad, medication is the main treatment for all forms of RA. Diet helps, but not a cure, sugar is a nightmare for me, never was before I had methotrexate, it seems to have done something to the mucosa of my mouth that 18 months after stopping it, still has not corrected.
A clean diet to me is one that I prepare myself from scratch, not factory processed.
Many 'heath' food are exactly the opposite of what they advertise, either full of sugars, fats or or preservatives and best avoided.
I eat dairy, love it, drink a pint of semi skimmed milk per day, use eggs from the local farm, love cheese etc
It’s such an individual disease anyway and if it wasn’t we would all be on the same medication getting the same results. So if this works for you or helps manage it then who are we to disagree. I’m delighted you have found something that helps. I’m a fresh foodie but eat meat occasionally it is not the answer for me wish it was.
Yes. I'm not a food fad person at all, I believe all dietary foods to bring problems with them. A good 'clean' diet and healthy living is the best way forward. Unless you live in ...say ...the Amazin rain forest, no diet is 'natural' or best. But the western diet for many people, has become so poor in recent decades almost anything is an improvement.
Yes, without getting too political, I have been fighting inequality all of my life.
But much of what we eat is learned and modern life styles are not set up for someone, usually the woman, to be at home preparing home cooked meals ( we expect women to work like they don't have children and mother like they don't work) The skills to create healthy cheap meals also seem to have been lost.
I am not criticising, I too have thrown a supermarket pizza and a tomatoe on the table for 'dinner' to my children.
But when I taught child health to childcare workers, I set them a (on paper) project, with a budget of the same finance for the mid morning snacks, as they costed crisps, sweets, chocolate, sugary diluting 'orange juice ' for the week for 40 nursery children. Rather than the crisps etc they had to buy healthy food, based on what they had learned about food groups, for the week.
The healthy food came in around the same price, a class average of pennies cheaper in fact. One young woman created an amazing array of snacks from her cultural background with money left over which caused a 'racist' uproar in the class, I'll, leave to you to imagine what was said and how I had to deal with it.
The issue is cheap, healthy eating takes time to plan, buy and prepare the food, not easy to resolve.
What a very good summary of the impossible demands made on working mothers. I'm sure working fathers don't get blamed if their children don't have a healthy meal lovingly cooked from scratch every day.
Hello Brushwork, yes I do disagree but your post is so respectful of others views, I am happy to say if it works for you, keep doing it!
My main problem is with restrictive diets and people making money by promoting them to desperate patients. I am a lifelong veggie... so not too bad on the diet front but not willing to give up cheese! xx
Of course we should all eat what we Like, what we feel suits us & doesn’t have any nasty side effects?
Processed foods, lots of carbs & sugar is probably not a good idea....but the odd naughty must be allowed .....?
Looking back over the really unpalatable food people force themselves to eat in the hope it will improve RA, doesn’t seem to have been very successful...most people come back after a few months saying it didn’t have any beneficial affect & they will now just eat sensibly ....but of course what that is ...is your own choice.
I'll run up a flag for "the odd naughty". We live in Greater Manchester and our son was due to come from London to see us on the very day that our lockdown was tightened, so he couldn't. We've had all our usual activities snatched away - meetings, choirs, concerts, theatre, even rambles in groups for a while. We've stuck as closely as we can to our pre-covid healthy eating, but today, on the one nice day we're getting between Storm Ellen and Storm Francis, we strolled strolled a mile or so to a little restaurant with a garden area, sat outside and enjoyed a dessert - which we rarely have at home - and a coffee. An indulgence, yes, but I feel happier than I've been for days and that's worth a lot!
You did right Bacharia. There is nothing to be gained from sanctimoniously abstaining from everything you enjoy.....& one dessert & a coffee isn’t going to hurt anyone.
I am so sorry you missed out on seeing your son...especially when you are probably seeing those around you behaving like idiots all the time.
All I can say is dig deep...look after yourself.....& hopefully we will be given some understandable information from the Numpties we call a government, as to how they foresee we should all be behaving this time next week.......or even tomorrow would be good! 🤔🤔🤔
🥺it would have to be a mini one for me in the past I’ve been known to polish off a large all on my own😂😂😂 in those days weight wasn’t an issue... hollow legs ... didn’t appreciate it then
😏😁... sending you a virtual roast ... with yorkshire pud gravy and stuffing ... followed by plum crumble 💖 sadly it is all in my head rather than sitting in front of me.
I think it’s the word “diet” that carries so much baggage with it. Pre-RA when I was fat I hated this word, and now I hate it for other reasons. Which is stupid as diet just means what you eat...
Anyway, I’m convinced that eating a lot of fruit, veg and fish and trying to limit fats and sugars has been good for my health (and weight). That, along with exercise, sleep and so on has reduced my risk factors for all sorts of things. I doubt it has done anything for my RA as I still need the same drugs to control it, and have never managed to taper off them. But I feel pretty healthy, and can live quite normally most of the time. So I reckon its worth it.
Yes we must do what suits us and can I ask following your post last month are you still taking medications ? I'm afraid I totally disagree with your post and believe it is unhelpful to imply that a diet can be 'clean'. All food is a source of energy and to be frank unless you grow it yourself you won't know what chemicals are used to grow your veggies. My FIL always moaned about the high cost of petrochemicals used in modern farming. I'm married into a farming family and know a bit about soil depletion and as for no white flour well I'm Celiac not eaten any wheat flour for years I've still got RA which is treated by medications. No one should feel that they are in any way to blame for the level of pain and inflammation they have because of what they eat. We grow our own as lucky to have a garden we have to feed our soil to get a good crop, luckily friends have horses. Fact is so much food is wasted as a large supermarket last year painted a crop of purple sprouting yellow as rain had tinged a few leaves paler. If we all had gardens big enough to grow our own it would be lovely but most don't so I think its all things in moderation and chocolate is most definitely a vegetable. So I eat no particular diet just the meat, cheese, cream, gin and crisp variety which also includes the odd vegetable, GF bread and make up for the lack of cake by eating fudge and fruit pastilles. I wish you well but its not clean eating that is important to me but a well balanced diet that includes all food groups. PS I'd urge you to get a Celiac test if you're getting any symptoms after eating flour as it might not be the RA but Celiac disease which is also inflammatory in the gut and gives me stomach ache and mouth ulcers as well as awful bowels.
Unprocessed food ? what is that as I'd call it home made. I wish you well. I simply think its misleading organic well then you'd know about the exorbitant fees of the Soil Association. I have a few lambs grazing till mid Sept on marshland that has remained unchanged since the monks of Christchurch produced lamb for the London market in the 13/14 th century. Its the reason why our church is so huge it was then as now rich fresh water pasture BUT my friend who run over 3000 sheep and lambs won't pay the Soil Association for accreditation. I really do think is misleading and I'm sure you really do believe that food influences inflammation but its merely an opinion its not fact, so people must be aware and not feel in any way responsible if following your very restrictive diet does not do anything. I'd also point out that you have not answered my question as per your similar post last month when you appear ro say you take medication. Still the mind is a powerful tool and it's very possible if you think its working then it does much like Placebo trials of new' medications. However I still thin k you're describing a Celiac reaction to gluten and it would be a very good idea to get checked out.
I think you are very defensive of your industry, as you should be.
I do take meds, if you read this post, I actually say so. I do not even remotely suggest that diet can cure RA or stop it’s progression. However, there are many Scientific studies that have shown or indicated that some foods are highly inflammatory. If you’re interested enough you can research this. Science is never definitive, it changes all the time as new discoveries are made.
I have expressed my opinions, I even apologised in advance for any offence they may cause. But, I believe I have a right to air my thoughts, experiences and views, and I will say again - I only know that this works for me....
I think you are also a bit aggressive and whilst entitled to your views this post does not say you take medications either which is why I looked back as remembered your previous post. As that post did refer to medications. We are all entitled to an opinion and if you don't like people( me included ) questioning you, then perhaps its because we do eat normally and exercise and are not overweight however its not a miracle ' clean' diet or even the Paddison one but its one which includes all food groups and is based on good old fashioned common sense. But it's easy for me in the country with a garden. My worry is so many live in towns with small gardens so growing your own is very difficult and if that person has a family its nigh on impossible especially if working. So in conclusion your really putting a case for eating a regime that is not realistic for a great many people and to boot for those with little money and damaged hands nigh on impossible so its M&S or Waitrose, Tesco or Sainsbury's for shopping or starve. So please be realistic. thats all I shall say. Finally the growth of corn and soya crops is destroying the rain forest and elsewhere, so where does your responsibility stop for damaging the environment in your vegetarian regime. Is one person healthy eating destroying another's home ?
Try reading my first paragraph. It ends with ... “and some medication”.
Where did growing soya crops come into it?I may be veggie, but I have never indicated that I eat soya, or any other meat substitute! I think you are jumping to a lot of conclusions.
Also, I have never suggested that anybody follow my way of eating! Just that what I do works for me.
Please feel free to pass by all of posts in future.
Sounds very familiar to me no doubt you can respond, "some medications" can be paracetamol or anything else really including steroids MTX or LEF or AZA (I take AZA and Etanercept) so please do advise what medications as clearly some would seem to indicate that your RA is mostly controlled by medications. And I'd repeat you should get medical advice if eating flour causes you issues not everything is down to RA you are assuming that it is, but my long experience of RA tells me that it is a confusing disease and not just about visible swelling etc. and it affected my lungs at one stage too. My fear is you may do as you wish but by trying to influence others you make them feel guilty for eating foods you consider to be inflammatory. If that was the case why does RA appear in the fossil records as no processed food then. This is a complex issue and clearly you're not able to see that your informing people can be seen as influencing. Sad to say yes I shall not respond further because you are not prepared to enter into a reasonable debate merely to repeat some of your remarks and ignore others questions. I wish you the best of luck whatever you choose to do, and my remarks about soya and corn do not refer to replacing meat your assumption but because my DIL is vegan and soya, corn and tofu is used a lot in her plant based regime. So again best of luck.
All, I can and will say is thank goodness for that!
I’ve never come across an attempt to debate that resembles anything you have written! Not even at Uni.
Your accusations of my intentions to inform, advise or even make suggestions are unfounded. My comments are, very deliberately couched to ensure that they are seen as simply my observations.
I feel no obligation to answer personal questions.
I absolutely do not need your advice, on this or any matter.
At no point in your post did I feel you were doing anything other letting us know your experience . You forewarned everyone that this was your observation and as you said some may find it controversial . I am disappointed at some people’s reaction to your post.
Well good for you, just odd that in past posts you've asked about several drugs so thought you'd like to share what works for you. I notice since Sept 2019 it didn't seem to be a problem and my posts have been kind and asked questions not been inflammatory or abusive. I've simply tried to be objective and truthful. If you don't like my comments please refer to the NRAS as clearly despite your asking for help in the past your diet is your own affair but I'm entitled to ask questions and put an alternative point of view across. Put simply why post if you don't want people to answer even if you don't like the comments. So thank goodness for free speech and a free and frank discussion. On here in the past we've had a lot of discussion about diet and it seems strange that you don't want to respond yet in the past have asked about medications. Still never mind I do agree about expercise and just done 2 km in 15 minutes on the cross trainer now off for lunch.
I’m not sure whether to be flattered or concerned that you’ve looked up my past posts.
Either way... I’m not sure what your issue with me is. Is it my vegetarianism ? I may choose to not eat animal products, but I cook locally sourced organic meat for my family. I take care to avoid imposing my ideals on others.
Glad we agree on something though I’m not sure what expercise is? Personally, I prefer a good walk in the fresh air. I do about 8km every morning with my dogs. Yes, I am aware that I’m lucky to be in a position to do this.
Please don't flatter yourself your perceived thoughts of my interest in your posts are entirely unfounded I merely wondered why you had such little knowledge of RA medications despite having a diagnosis it appeared of some 23 years.
PS I like a walk but not dogs at all. And my spelling error was due to posting quickly as was in the garden and it had begun to rain. I'd also add seems a bit petty and trivial to me.
Hi! I had my RA under control thru diet for about 1.5years. Foods I eliminated were meat, dairy, poultry, pork. Basically allowed myself only seafood and eggs as far as animal proteins go.
It was working. I'm pretty sure had I gone completely vegan, I would've been even better.
But sadly, a few months ago it all flared up to the point of where now I am on Prednisone and Humira...and I STILL can't eat those items (dammit! I was hoping that being on a biologic would allow me to eat foods I love again). I've been racking my brain trying to figure out what could've triggered it! The sad thing is I'll never know as RA has a mind of its own and can do whatever it wants at any point, and I'm at it's mercy.
But I can say, I am one of those who was completely off meds due to diet-at least for some time. (Sigh)
Oh well done... and it’s clearly not a cure to eat healthy, but it does, I believe, support the body and it’s systems. You are what you eat, as they say...
As you say, a diet change might not help everyone’s RA. That doesn’t mean you shouldn’t try and reduce your sugar / processed food intake. It’s well documented that these things have a negative impact on your health regardless of whether your joints hurt or not.
I have been B12 deficient for years and had been receiving injections, my GP changed me to tablets when lockdown started. He now wants me to eat B12 rich foods for 4 months, I do mostly anyway. Meat, oily fish, dairy. So I will be interested to see the result. I will have an antibody test to see if I convert these foods. In the past my ferritin levels would drop on a regular basis. I also eat plenty of veg, fruit and find sugar and gluten doesn’t really agree with me, but I still have now and again, as I enjoy them. X
Hi Gigi. Do you know why you are B12 deficient if you don't mind me asking? The reason I ask is that my husband has B12 injections for the his B12 deficiency and his GP has also changed him over to tablets which he is annoyed about because the reason he is B12 deficient is because he takes omeprazole for reflux and apparently omeprazole interferes with the a absorption of B12 from the food you eat. So prescribing tablets can't resolve B12 deficiency in patients who take omeprazole. But the GP doesn't accept that which actually goes against the NICE guidelines. My husband eats B12 rich foods as part of a healthy diet but is still B12 deficient.
I had a blood test many year ago which showed I had low B12 level, this was after years of me having to constantly go on iron tablet and the problems that go with them. I was also prescribed folic acid. This treatment seemed to really help until last year after a viral infection my ferritin level went down again. It was decided I would have iron tabs for 4 months, plus B12 injections every 2 months instead of every 3 months. My B12 were fine and my ferritin went back to acceptable levels. Then I was changed as I said to tablets, I wasn’t happy and even more surprised when my GP wants me to stop treatment, till I have the antibody test. I have Hashimoto’s also, plus I am on Lansoprazole. I don’t actually like milk, so make kefir and I do have a couple of cappuccinos a day, I normally drink herbal or fruit teas without milk, I will have to eat more cheese and eggs than I do now, I love fish and do eat meat. I cook meals from scratch also. Im not too sure, I don’t have that much energy now. X
He/She is looking for the intrinsic factor and I also have B12 injections. Its a blood test then a camera down the tummy to look at the lining of the stomach.. Mine carried on over lockdown as I have Pernicious Anaemia.
Thanks M-l for your advices, as far as I am aware I don’t have Pernicious Anaemia. He didn’t mention the camera, have had this in the past due to a HH. Goodness you have a lot to put up with, you seem to manage well. My back and shoulder problems are my main concern, so any more fatigue will be hard to deal with. X
It's nowhere as bad as it seems, just a load of bad genetics. I had the blood test as it was suspected I had PE due to feeling so tired and the GP had not done a test so many years ago the RA consultant said let's do all the odd stuff and after the blood test they do a definitive test and its a camera. It was then they said on top of being Celiac you can't get B12 from food (its mainly from I kept eating meat) and I'm not vegetarian. And its affected your stomach lining so then off to see a nutritionist. I did and in those days GF bread was awful now its ok but expensive, the NHS supplies some bread and flour if needed but I tried it once and it was vile. Before B12 diagnosis I remember my toenails were weird soft of dark and blueish and my finger nails soft and hair was coarse and skin rough. It was truly exhausting. I kept falling over and dropping stuff and got breathless easily. So I then had a loading dose weekly for I think a month then it went to every 3 months. I was offered the tablets too and was happy to give them a go but had another blood test and the GP rang and called me in for restoring the injections. So off to the car park and lucky in the arm not bum ! xxlol
PS I have Hashimoto's too but well controlled now for over 30 years and I do not take Omeprazole as it caused my kidney injury its Cimitidine for me.
I’m pleased, given your history they have recognised problems over the years and been able to treat you. I hope you remain well and optimistic. All the very best x
I didn’t start eating them until I was in my 30’s. Crazy to have not had them until then. I have a whole load growing in my garden for digging up in Jan onwards. 😁
Actually I've not been rude to you at all. Nor have I made assumptions, so do not continue to be abusive. What nerve ? is it that I don't like dogs. Do not threaten me and I'm not suffering at all. Get over yourself. My diet is just fine I have no idea why you feel you can make such dreadful remarks. So stop!
I don't care who you are, nor what you know, as this is about standing up to a bully. I have referred to NRAS so its up to them as I said I've not been rude or offensive nor have I made any assumptions. I simply don't agree and asked you about medications as they have a direct impact for most people on their RA for good or ill. If yours are working now then how does a diet stop them working.?
The thing about ‘clean eating’ is that most of us know we aren’t getting much nutritional value from a big old slice of chocolate fudge cake with whipped cream but we eat it because it tastes sooooooo good. 😁 As humans, we derive a lot of pleasure from food and it forms a big part of socialising.
There’s not a medic in the world (hopefully!) who wouldn’t acknowledge the importance of a healthy, balanced diet with all of the correct nutrients. We can not deny that everyone should eat as healthily as possible.
I like to have a balance in life. Genuinely well done to anyone who is able to be very disciplined. That’s not the way I am but I do try my best!
So true my Nephrologist referred me to the Renal Nutritionalist and its standard for kidney failure patients. He said all things are ok at the moment just you must avoid pretend salt its much worse than proper salt. Don't eat food high in potassium like grapes, bananas, baked beans and drink at least 3 pints of water every day. That on top of gluten free makes me a bit limited but its not really a problem and my cholesterol is 3.4 so must be doing something right. I always plan tomorrows tea and at least covid has made me think more about food and how lucky we were getting a priority slot for supermarket goods and having a butcher that delivered. And growing our own was not just fun it helped a lot. As I've not eaten chocky fudge cake for nearly 10 years have the next slice on me with clotted cream as well. lol
A good reply, Whaleroad, though some pithy slogans are well worth quoting. May I offer: Correlation is not causation and The plural of anecdote is not data.
That said, I can't blame anyone for clutching at straws in relation to this horrible disease and if they recommend things that seem strange to us, we can surely all use our brains, look at the evidence and weigh up the pros and cons.
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