Fatty Liver - Surprise to know this!!

[Amy_Lee]

Being diagnosed of fatty liver to me is something very unbelievable as I am just perfect for my weight. Unfortunately, taking the RA medicine may be the cause of the fatty liver.

The specialist said that my whole liver is covered by oil but it is still within the normal size, therefore it is reversible. I will check with my rheumy when I see her 3 weeks later.

Going online to search for information to tackle this issue since I cannot do away with DMARDs and I am glad to find this and would like to share with you here.

***Chia seeds are great for helping to keep blood sugar levels stable as well as binding to cholesterol and helping to usher it out of the body.******

youngandraw.com/anti-inflam...

[Tintoy43_]

Gosh I'm praying for you!! You were the first to respond to me a few weeks ago when I was diagnosed w RD. I hope you find answers which I can't even begin to give but I can pray!!!

[Amy_Lee in reply to Tintoy43_]

It is kind of difficult to accept because I am in the right weight all these while. Anyhow, I cannot ignore DMARDs which put me back into my normal life, therefore I need to cut down fat and carbohydrate foods. I will Google more to ensure I am in the right track before it is too late to reverse the situation.

[Tintoy43_ in reply to Amy_Lee]

I will be praying for you. You have been doing so well! Please keep us informed on this situation!!! Take care

Have a. great holiday!!!🌲

[Amy_Lee in reply to Tintoy43_]

I will be seeing my rheumy on Monday and I have a list of questions for her to answer. Surely I will update and share as I believe there may be other RA patients take similar DMARDs like me hence may be risk having similar problem.

[Simba1992]

Hello Amy_Lee,

So sorry to hear about your liver situation. Yes mtx is hard on the liver and fatty liver seems to be an unfortunate side effect. But as your doctor said in your case it can be reversed probably by stopping mtx. There are nontoxic ways to help your liver get into shape. Here is a study where high protein diet did the trick. Evidently drinking coffee and taking K2 vitamine, has a very good effect.

[Simba1992 in reply to Simba1992]

Sorry forgot the link.

raypeatforum.com/community/...

[Simba1992 in reply to Simba1992]

Another study discussing the connection between mtx and fatty liver.

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...

[Amy_Lee in reply to Simba1992]

Simba,

Thank you so much for the information and all the links. That will safe me a lot of time to go round the world to look for good information. In fact, all information are welcome and I will surely go through it.

Yes, since my liver size is still normal, hence it is at the early stage, therefore it is reversible. I will do try to ensure I am back to normal again. I read that coffee is of good help too. I have started to drink a cup a day now.

[Simba1992 in reply to Amy_Lee]

Do drink more coffee! The vit K2 is also very important in fact 15mg a day. You could talk with your doc. K2 is very often prescribed in high doses in Asia for RA so it may be of help there too. He/she may be familar with it. More good protien is also essential. Good luck. xxSimba

[Amy_Lee in reply to Simba1992]

Will look into what you said here. Certainly will put that up with my rheumy to see what she has to say.

[Amy_Lee in reply to Simba1992]

Just finished reading the link. The conclusion is very important, moderation of HP intake is the best. This is to avoid other problems that may result in too much HP intake.

Will continue to look into what kind of food is high in protein then. Thank you so much Simba.

[Simba1992 in reply to Amy_Lee]

Sea food has good quality protein.

[Simba1992 in reply to Simba1992]

Too much starchy foods and grains are definitely not good but the carbs you get from fruits are still very important. To clean your liver you need a good metabolism and good carbs is the best fuel. I hope you find a solution that is good for you.😊

[Amy_Lee in reply to Simba1992]

I love seafood. When I have a choice to choose from, I always go for fish instead of other meats.

[Simba1992 in reply to Amy_Lee]

High protien is thought to be if 35% of daily food intake is protien. One thing that I also came to think about was your thyroid function. Have you. had a compleate thyroid panel done. Thyroid function and fatty liver also have a connexion. Not easy no😓

[Amy_Lee in reply to Simba1992]

Thyroid and fatty liver have connection also? I had remover 2/3 of my thyroid few years before I had RA. Therefore I never thought of the 2 have any connection with each other. Another thing I need to Google then.

Simba, you are indeed very knowledgeable. I certainly love to have any information from you to alert me to do more research into the possible problems that we RA patients may have.

[Simba1992 in reply to Amy_Lee]

Perhaps it really would be a thing to discuss with your doc and look into. Low thyroid function is seen in up to30% of RA patients and often make RA symptoms worse, and this can easily be fixed. There is a thyroid forum here on hu where there are very knowledgeable members. Fatty liver has often discussed since it is often associated with decreased thyroid function. You could have a look there too. It is complicated there is so much interaction going on.😳😊Take care. xxSimba

[Amy_Lee in reply to Simba1992]

Thank you so much, Simba. A lot of things to read up then. I will try to read up as much as possible. Being a full time working person, and doing voluntary work during the weekend, time is really not enough to me.

[Simba1992 in reply to Amy_Lee]

Do ask if I can be of help😊You are welcome to PM me too. xxSimba

[Amy_Lee in reply to Simba1992]

Simba1992 ,

Have a look at these. The relationship between Mtx and Arava and fatty liver.

ehealthme.com/ds/arava/fatt...

liversupport.com/liver-dise...

[Simba1992 in reply to Amy_Lee]

So could you take Hydroxy? Have you talked about this option with your doc?

[Amy_Lee in reply to Simba1992]

I will see the rheumy on coming Monday. Over here we do not call the doctor directly. I have to wait for the appointment to ask. If any emergency, then I can walk in to see the rheumy. Surely I will ask her on further decision.

[Simba1992 in reply to Amy_Lee]

Since there seems to be connection, did your Doc ever try to skip the Arava and just stay with the Mtx, when your bloods went up?

[Amy_Lee in reply to Simba1992]

I do not know. I will ask her when I see her on Monday. She did say long ago to slowly reduce Arava and eventually stop it. I am not sure now. I will update after I see her on Monday.

[Hidden]

Hi Amy

Sorry you have that problem; how was it diagnosed? Blood test?

This was a big reason why I have been reluctant to take MTX, knowing it causes liver scarring so that cirrhosis develops, also reversible if caught on time.

And this is also why I choose to cut all alcohol and find effective natural ways to treat RA.

I hope your liver is very soon back to normal.

[Amy_Lee in reply to Hidden]

Dear Charisma,

My liver markers from the blood tests went up and down since 1 1/2 years ago. My rheumy decided to schedule me for the ultra-sound scan last week. The specialist told me during the scanning process.

I will read more and will do what I can for my own health. Good to know that my liver size is still normal hence it is at the early stage where I can do something to reverse the situation.

[Amy_Lee]

I am surprised too. Since 1 1/2 years until now, my liver markers went up and down, so my rheumy decided to schedule me for the ultra-sound scan. The specialist told me that my whole liver is covered with fat hence it is shinning and lighter in colour. He told me to wait for my rheumy to decide and do not stop the DMARDs on my own.

My next appointment will be 3 weeks from now and I just had my blood taken yesterday. I shall see.

[Amy_Lee]

In fact, before the ultra-sound scanning, my rheumy already reduced 1 more tablet for me. But she said that I might risk to have flare-up. She actually wanted to keep me with 4 tablets for another half a year before she reduced it for me. Unfortunately my liver markers went up a bit, she suspected I might have fatty liver, therefore she reduced mtx for me immediately.

[Amy_Lee]

Hopefully just a hiccup...

[Neonkittie17]

Good luck, Amy Lee. I think we all should try take care of our livers more as we often over stress them with certain foods and then when we have to take oral meds. I have lemon slices in boiled water first thing before any breakfast each day as I was told it helps detox the liver. I certainly seem to have better digestion since doing this for two years now. I will be interested to know what other things you discover are helpful and I am sure you will soon reverse this situation. x

[Amy_Lee in reply to Neonkittie17]

I do hear of lemon slices in warm water, it helps to detox. Also turmeric which will help to detox too. It is weekend now, I will be going out to stock up lemon, turmeric, ginger and honey to start with.

Actually I always eat very simple and a very active person, therefore I was very shock to know that I have fatty liver. In fact, when I told my daughter, she also could not believe it. But the fact is medicines that we take certainly affect our liver, you are right to say that we need to take good care of our liver too.

[Neonkittie17 in reply to Amy_Lee]

That is very hard when you are eating pure and natural things. I also eat mostly excellent food too. I just sin a little with chocolate. Not too much these days. I also love honey and ginger. I use turmeric in cooking. I used to love a cup of tea first thing but the lemon water is much more refreshing and thirst quenching. I prefer that now by far.

[Amy_Lee in reply to Neonkittie17]

I love chocolate too but I do not eat a lot. I think it should be okay if we just take a bit at time. Yes tea is another drink to consider. So much of the detox drinks to consider, I can only take 1 kind each day.

Moderate high protein (HP) intake can help to reverse fatty liver condition. Therefore I will cut down my carbohydrate intake from now on. In fact, people here normally take a lot of rice and noddle, I will cut these items back and replace them with HP food from now on.

[Neonkittie17 in reply to Amy_Lee]

I'm very careful these days with rice as I Iove it but try to have only twice a week. Often I make a mash with carrot and swede instead of potato. When I have chicken and salad I don't add potato or rice on the plate and slice half an avocado to add a little more substance.

[Amy_Lee in reply to Neonkittie17]

Potato is also high in carbohydrate so it will be good to minimize this too.

Asia people always have rice for their meals at least twice daily, I need to change this habit though it is hart.

Beside mtx, Arava is also another cause of fatty liver. Have a look at this link that I share with Simba. I am taking both mtx and Arava currently.

liversupport.com/liver-dise...

[Neonkittie17 in reply to Amy_Lee]

I briefly took Arava many years ago but came off it very quickly as I felt sick on it. I had read some reports about it too. Thank you for the link.

[Simba1992 in reply to Amy_Lee]

Have you tried Hydroxy? That is supposed to have the least side effects?

[Neonkittie17]

I have been on Rituximab for over 3 years now so have left the oral RA meds behind as such.

[Amy_Lee in reply to Neonkittie17]

Dear Neonkittie,

As far as DMARDs are concern, so far I have been only prescribed mtx and arava, therefore I have no knowledge of other treatment. However, I just went to Google a bit of rituximab, it does have its own side effects, therefore it is very crucial we know what we have been given and we have to monitor our own bodies' responses. It is so important to share what we experience and know so that other will be benefited from our experiences.

In fact, I do learn a lot when I read through other posts here, but I will keep quiet if I do not know about the issues posted to avoid providing wrong information.

[Simba1992 in reply to Amy_Lee]

Hello Amy_Lee,

I think you are so right. We do owe to ourselves that we do research on the meds we are offered. Very often you read posts on this forum wher patients are taken aback by side effects of meds that they have never known about or being informed of. Perhaps we sometimes just feel that we have no options and it's just best to trust our doctors and that way not having to face hard facts. When we know more and also go through this step we are much more in control and can work better with our docs concerning our treatment plan. It's never really a onesizefitsall situation, and I do believe the patients input makes the difference. xxSimba

[Amy_Lee in reply to Simba1992]

Simba,

I know many of the patients do not tell the doctors all the facts. For example, they just visit the doctors but do not take the medicines accordingly.

In this kind of attitude will do no good to both sides. The doctors may think that the medicines do not work for them but in actual fact, they skip and do not take the medicines at all. I have such friends here and I am tired to explain to them again. The decision is in their own hands so I shall keep my mouth shut. Again, it is not fair to the doctors.

I have got most of the foods that suppose to clean up my liver today and I will proceed to clean my liver while I continue to take mtx and arava.

I am glad to have your guidance and I will continue to search for more information. I believe we will be in better control to work with our rheumy and do our research concurrently.