Do any of you see a nutritionist ?

I just watched What The Health ! Wow , a serious eye opener. I grew up on a farm and have always been a carnivore. After watching this program I am ready to consider the impact diet has on our bodies.

My husband is all for trying a plant based diet for at least one month. So no dairy, meat, meat by products, wheat Ext only plant based food. The people in documentary saw such a radical change in a short period ie fourteen days. It seems simple enough short term. Then if it does have a dramatic impact that will motivate a permanent change. I desperately want feedback from people on this diet or lifestyle change. I strongly recommend viewing this documentary. It is very comprehensive.

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  • I haven't eaten meat since 1982! Stopped for 2 weeks to see if it would help my painful joints and never wanted to eat it again. I've modified my diet a lot and have always had low inflammatory markers. But have still had some erosions, and have had to go onto MTX and Humira.

  • I think a ten day trial is very doable. My husband needs to loose weight and has psoriasis. He is open to trying this as well. I will clear it with my doctors first. I will not discontinue treatment without consulting her , this time lol

  • I don't see it as an either /or. Try the diet modification and see if you can then slowly reduce the medication...

  • It's worth a go!

    I actually got very sick on a totally vegan diet. I became anaemic, had low bloid sugar issues (non diabetic) and felt generally cack. Then discovered grains were the issue!

  • Hi Damaged,

    Hope you're having a good day.

    If you go back and read some of my posts you'll see that I've written a lot on here about how diet can have a huge impact on RA symptoms.

    I don't want to dig up old news but my wife went from barely being able to walk, to being virtually pain free in under 5 months. One thing I would say though...

    Depending on how long you've suffered from RA, a few weeks may not be enough to see any real improvement in symptoms. Proteins found in Gluten and Dairy stimulate the immune system for up to 3 months so it could potentially be 3 months cold turkey on these foods before you see dramatic improvements in your symptoms if you are one of the unlucky few who are highly sensitive to these foods.

    One thing to note...

    EVERY HUMAN ON EARTH is intolerant to Gluten and Dairy so please don't feel like you've been dealt a bad hand in life. The intolerance just manifests itself differently in different people depending on your genetics. Some people develop an autoimmune disease, some people get plagued their whole life by depression and anxiety, some people suffer from fatigue and a lack of drive, whilst others will appear to cope with these foods very well and then get struck down with Cancer in their 40s or 50s. If you want to learn more about this just go to Youtube and watch some videos on something called "Epigenetics".

    A lot of research in the last 5 years has basically discovered that Autoimmune Diseases are more like complex and severe allergies. If you remove triggers, slowly the immune system will return to homeostasis, calm down and symptoms will dramatically reduce.

    The longer you can go without exposing your body to it's triggers, the fewer symptoms you will get. Eventually, your symptoms should disappear altogether if you can avoid your triggers for long enough.

    One thing I've learned from my research is that there appears to be optimum diets for each type of health condition. For example a Ketogenic Diet is very beneficial for people suffering from any neurological issues like multiple sclerosis, depression, anxiety, Epilepsy etc. It is well documented that people suffering from daily seizures and Chronic Epilepsy have a dramatic reduction in seizures when they go on a hardcore Ketogenic Diet.

    Neurologists in the NHS actually now recommend that people suffering from Chronic Neurological health issues go on to a Ketogenic diet if they fail on two medications. If only they would get them to go onto the Ketogenic diet first we'd be making real progress with our health system!!!

    From my research I have found that a modified Paleo Diet appears to be the optimum diet for people with RA. This is for two reasons:

    1. Nightshade Vegetables appear to be a big trigger for people with RA and Nightshades form a big part of a Plant Based Diet. I highly recommend you eliminate Nightshades from your diet. It's not really possible to consume a Plant Based / Vegetarian / Vegan diet without Nightshades because they are an important food group on this diet.

    2. People with RA often have damaged cartilage, tendons and bone erosions due to Chronic Inflammation. All of this can be healed in time with a diet rich in Collagen. Rheumatologists have told people for years that joint damage is permanent but this is absolutely not true. If you do some research on this you'll see that even bone erosions can heal if you can reduce inflammation in the synovial fluid surrounding them and eat a Collagen rich diet. Collagen is very difficult to consume on a Plant Based Diet because Collagen is only really found in Meat. The body can use Collagen to repair joint damage. It can grow new bone tissue where there are erosions and also regrow damaged cartilage and tendons.

    What the health is a good documentary, but it is also misleading because it contains a lot of information that is not true.

    Reasearch has shown over the last few years that good quality organic animal fats are essential to proper brain function.

    They also say in the documentary that meats are primarily responsible for Cancer and Diabetes, whilst we also know that this is not true. Sugar is the primary cause of these Diseases for a variety of reasons.

    What the health has a lot of good information, but the producers let themselves down by giving inaccurate dietary information. You should know that the documentary was funded by PETA, which is a militant Animal Rights organization.

    I feel like they produced this documentary as propaganda to try and stop people from eating meat.

    Please read the books below to gain a more balanced insight into the best diet for people with Autoimmune Diseases. If you want to jump right in I recommend sticking to a Paleo diet and removing Nightshades and Dairy.

    amzn.to/2weXoqJ

    amzn.to/2uN6cUk

    amzn.to/2w6biL3

    amzn.to/2vHPkx9

    You can follow my wife's progress and learn more about our journey by following her on Instagram:

    instagram.com/girls_new_hea...

    I really want to spread this message to as many people as possible because you can absolutely reverse your disease by identifying triggers and removing them from your life.

    Please don't hesitate to PM me if you'd like anymore information on anything I've said.

    Good luck! I can't wait until you come back on here in a few months time and tell everybody about how great you feel.

  • I looked into the sponsors of our foundation and they are all medical . American systems are not like Canadian MSP and also nothing like NHS. I read everything with an open mind.

    I just feel the medications are not for me. Something is yet I identified or that approach is 'to late'. So time to consider other options. Diet is clearly essential to wellness so I begin my journey.💉no more drugs being my primary goal.

  • I have osteoporosis and calcium pills leak out of my urine. I eat dairy and have PMR. Two tons of broccoli daily is not appealing. Suggestions for daily calcium, please.

  • Hi Sandy, Watercress, salmon/sardines, nuts and pulses I tend to go for as although I love cheese and yogurts I'm not a milk lover. Only lacto free in drinks. X

  • Allsop, you state: "EVERY HUMAN ON EARTH is intolerant to Gluten and Dairy"

    That is an extremely sweeping and entirely unsubstantiated statement. You then go on to tell people to check your claims out on Youtube. I learnt how to pluck a pheasant on Youtube, very useful. I'm not relying on it for scientific verification though. You also claim "you can absolutely reverse your disease by identifying triggers and removing them from your life".

    Who are you? What are your qualifications? Who have you studied with? What have you published? (Apart from posts on social media).

    I'm going to leave this site & withdraw my subscription to NRAS because they should be preventing this lunacy at source.

    Conventional medicine is not perfect but it is the surest way of controlling inflammatory arthritis. Complementary remedies can be of use. Lifestyle changes definitely help. That's what I think. Boring isn't it? If I were to claim that my PsA had been cured by eating only dandelions, dress it up a bit, employ social media, bang on about it ad infinitum, make increasingly outrageous claims ..... that would be a little more exciting. And a big fat lie.

  • It is worth a punt for sure.

    You have to be organised with planning what to put with what to make a balance meal. I'm similar to Nettac, tried to be vegetarian but got anaemic and my hair began to thin. Now I'm a Flexitarian bcz of this. I don't eat red meat, mostly legumes, vegi's, fish, eggs and rarely some chicken thrown in.

    D

  • Hi Deminem,

    Hope you're having a good day.

    Have you seen a big improvement in your symptoms since changing your diet?

    Most of the research I've read suggests that Legumes can be highly inflammatory for people with RA.

    Do you find that you tolerate them well?

  • Hia Allsop!

    I had no idea about legumes being highly inflammatory for ppl with RA, yikes!

    I can't give an answer to whether my sypms are better bcz I've been eating this way for so long, well before DX. But I feel good mentally, as though I'm being kind to the planet and animals eating the way HelixHelix does. I'm not saying my way is best or the right way. I'm not perfect by any stretch.

    Hopefully we all do what fits best for our mind and body and the planet, and if that means eating a whole slab of Galaxy milk chocolate to help the universe then I'll reluctantly do it, or maybe a Mars to help the Milky way, hey someones gotta do it :-)

    D

  • 😂😂😂thank you .You brightened mg day!

  • Not everyone finds legumes inflammatory Deminem so I wouldn't strike them off your shopping list without checking or trialling first. I find it's better to test the water, try each you eat regularly separately to see if you feel any different. Heck, if everyone in Mediterranean countries responded negatively they'd all have inflammatory problems as their diet includes lots. There's also the consideration of how we cook legumes. Actually, you could have a read of this when you've a mo, thinkybites.com/content/201.... It's not as clear cut as purported by those who've signed up to the leaky gut theory.

    Love the thought eating choc saves the universe, sign me in! ☺️

  • Thanks nom, will defo check the link, after I've eaten my chocolate bar that is tehe!

    D

  • Hi nomoreheels,

    A crazy bit of trivia is that Meditteranean people have some of the highest life expectancies in the western world, but they also have some of the highest numbers of people suffering from Inflammatory Arthritis on a relative per population basis.

    Mediterranean diets are high in Nightshade Vegetables which is one of the reasons why Nightshades are highly implicated as a trigger for RA symptoms.

    This data also suggests that RA may not actually have an impact on life expectancy at all. Instead life expectancy may be caused by other environmental factors that are common amongst people with RA.

  • Interesting. Can I ask where this info can be found? Thanks.

  • Interesting on Mediterranien diet and RA.

    ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...

  • Now that's what I call a study! The result wasn't a great surprise to me given I was living in the Med so naturally eating a Med diet & yet still was diagnosed with RD within 3.5 years of moving there, & eating that way before for around about 10 years I suppose. Yet really the thing is it's recommended to eat a Med diet once diagnosed not to follow one in order to avert the risk of diagnosis of RD.

  • Recently my OH has said we can't eat rice bcz of the high levels of arsenic in ;-( annoying cz being from the med I love me some rice.

    Also not too much soya products bcz of cancer causing chemicals or sumfin, soon I'll be eating only chocolate...yes please, wink!

    D

  • Jasmin rice has the least amount of arsenic. Soya good to keep away from. Drink milk and coffee and eat cheese and ice ceam with lots of fruits and orange juice. Keeps you quite happy and it's really good for you. Strangely enough.

  • Arsenic is metal element & everywhere in the environment, in fruit, veg, it's everywhere, in the air, water & soil, you can't escape it! Thing is it's dependant on where you are in the world, the percentage which make it's way into the food we eat are different. Maybe if you have rice with every meal then it would be better to limit it if you're feeding it to children but as adults there's no risk. If you only eat it say twice a week & you're still concerned by the minimal risk then just soak the rice overnight, this reduces any arsenic which may there by 80%. Or cook it in more water. So you can assure your husband that he probably breathes in more than he digests.

    food.gov.uk/science/arsenic...

  • Thanks nom,

    You know your onions!

    OH has had me doing the soak, and cook in ton of water and drain when we do have it.

    D

  • Mmm, caramelised onions on a hot beef sandwich, granary bread, could just go that now!

    Let him know it only needs to be 5:1 ratio, preferably basmati for me!

    Or, we could just have some choc & save the universe. 😜

  • Yeeeeeaaaah! 😁

  • As with so many discussions the vegetarian vs paleo argument is polarised with fundamentalists claiming truth on both sides. Very confusing, my teenage daughter is three years now since diagnosis and we have followed paleo for a significant period - two years and also vegan, and including elimination of suspect foods with both approaches. Sadly we have yet to find any notable benefit from any diet, we are still searching and working on it, and she has been treated by a number of different meds, currently on third biologic. Of course there is the argument that the meds interfere with the bowels ability to heal which becomes a catch 22 so have that in mind also but continuing to search for a way through this. Thank you for posting the link to the anti-nutrient article. And lots of people have gotten off ra meds with including legumes in their diets.

  • You're welcome. What struck me is as with anything there's reason to be made. I think often reporting is biased or even dare I say sensationalised whether it be for 'healthy eating' life choice or when considering eliminating certain food groups when a condition is involved. Not helpful & it means we've to be savvy & research well before embarking on testing out before changing our diet.

  • Absalutely

  • Thank you BerOGrady, good to hear from someone with experience.

  • I eat legumes, particularly potatoes. My CRP is .05. It was 84 when diagnosed. I attribute the control of inflammation to endurance ( it stayed in 40 range for at least three months ). I am allergic to Naproxen so all NSAID's. I also responded badly to Prednisone. It or possibly Pregabalin made me 😜.

    My Rheum wanted me on Diclofenac but I chose not to risk it. Doctors are a little to casual about allergies. I am the one who gets to enjoy the hives, ulcers, ..

  • Also the use of a vaporizer .

  • Interesting....I had to stop eating beans, and pulses after years of consuming them!

  • Deminem...I had to google Flexitarian. I think it's perfect for me! Thanks for the tip.

  • Happy to help where I can AbbeyRoad ;-)

    When I was trying to be vegetarian there were always those ppl who said...Ha you have leather shoes or you eat jelly/jam ect. Ppl seem to get confused if your not 100% consistent, they try to pin you down, or take you down a peg. But you maybe doing your best, and they shouldn't try to pigeon hole you for it. If you pick ppls lives apart with a fine tooth comb you will find we are all inconsistent in some way or other imo. Being Flexitarian doesn't solve this issue mind you, but stops ppl being less confused.

    D

  • That's pretty much what I do and works well for me. I believe it helps me tolerate the drugs easily. I try not to obsess too much, so if I visit someone who has made something I don't normally eat then I'll just eat it. People are more important to me.

    I also try to eat in a way that is considerate to the environment so try to stick to local, seasonal foods. Buying (e.g.) avocado's that have been air freighted from Africa strikes me as absurd. And I'm very conscious that these debates are very much first world problems...

  • I'm more pescatarian these days and find red meat hard to eat. I'll use chicken or a little lean lamb in the slo cooker in the colder months as it falls apart and easy to digest but I am much more veggie.

  • I will not jump in without a lot more research. My niece has been vegan for over ten years. I am certain she will be a good resource. I am also considering a certification program.

  • Thank you Allsopp,

    I was just looking into taking some courses on nutrition.

    I admit I know next to nothing about food . I do not have weight issues just health.

    I would never consider any diet without first consulting my doctors. Thank you for the links. I love WWW. Everything thing you ever needed to know at the touch of of a finger. I am an egg head. I find comfort in knowledge.

    This site is awesome. I like hearing from others in similar condition.

  • Hi Damaged,

    Just saw your post. When I began to realise the obvious correlation to what I eat with my physical well being after being diagnosed with RA in 2014, I found that Dr. John McDougall, Dr. Michael Gregor and other plant based, low fat, starch based advocates made a lot of sense to me. Just google them if interested. Their research has been my saviour.

    Just as an aside, it was really interesting on the news this morning that the government or whomsoever are trying to tackle childhood obesity by lobbying fast food (in this case pizza) manufacturers into making their goods with less calories! What about teaching the joys of carrots and peas, courgettes, mushrooms and cabbage I say, these are the foods I slaver over since I retrained my appetite. My husband has type 2 diabetes, obesity related, and was offered more and more medication, the last of which has the side effect of "increasing appetite and causing weight increase - Gliclazide"!!. This finally galvanised him into change and after just three months of really just moderate change in his diet, his sugar results has gone down from 8.6 to 6.8! His nurse was amazed and asked him how he did it! Nutrition is so sadly neglected in these days of Big Pharma. I read that in America particularly, there is very little effort put into prevention and cure for chronic conditions, all the money and energy goes into "keeping people alive" on their meds for as long as possible. Ouch. Good luck in all you do.

    Sandra

  • I am a big advocate of prevention .we do need more of it here in the USA and less pill pushing!

  • That's amazing what your husband has achieved Sandra. How has your RA improved since you changed your diet?

  • Hard to say. I was started on Methotrexate very early by the Rheumatologist and it was very effective for me and gave me the time I needed to research and find out everything I could about how to be responsible for myself. I have been able to reduce Mtx from the highest dose to 17 and a half mgs and saw my new rheumy yesterday who said I was doing very well. I am not always pain free but have very little to no swellling at present. So..... I am not sure about improvement as I changed my diet the same time as starting meds but feel much better perhaps than I suspect I would have been if still been eating meat and dairy and not become more active exercise wise!

  • In RA just like in all diseases I find it important to make an assessment of your whole health situation before you take meds or try a certain diet. In RA we know that many underlying dysfunctions are usually at play and have chronicly been under a long time before RA established. Research tell us that a hormonal imbalance is seen in RA both on the adrenal function, sex hormones and thyroids. By correcting or supporting these functions, I do believe you are taking a step towards calming the overactive immune reaction. What is essential ofcourse is that these dysfunctions vary and have different impact in different patients. If you have an underactive thyroid for example you need a diet that gets your thyroid working, plantbased diets do not do this, often on the contrary. If you have an overload over estrogen in relation to progesterone the plantbased may reduce your estrogen dramaticly, relieving symptoms. If you are a man, this effect is even grater. (Yes men may also have estrogen dominance!) If you are no longer young, the. above mentioned functions and their working together is already affected by degeneration that age bring with it and this is probably why results with diets and excersize work better on the young and why hard meds and aggressive treatment of older patients should be carefully planned.

    A comment to Allsopp. If, as it seems, that RA is very much a metabolic disease then the functions of those organs that are central in keeping up normal metabolism should be supported, which means that we need fat, protein and carbs. And carbs are in fact very important for both thyroid and liver function. You can manipulate symptoms with different extreeme diets for a while but if they are not addressing the whole picture, sooner or later they backfire. I am as you quite convinced that grains do no good and the same goes for legumes and most nightshades but dairy I am not so sure about. It has been shown that after getting your metabolism normalized you very often can reintroduce milk.

  • Not scientific at all, but I have noticed a lot of people were vegetarian or vegan at time of RA diagnosis. I myself went 12 years without eating red meat. I reintroduced red meat at the same time that I removed grains from my diet, and whether one or the other, I never felt better. That What the Health documentary has been panned as propaganda as has been noted by another on this thread.

    It's worth researching a few different suggestions around diet and health, and not playing with your health based on one documentary. I think the Primal Blueprint by Mark Sisson, the Perfect Health Diet by Paul Jaminet and the Autoimmune Approach by Sarah Ballantyne are all good books. The Calorie Myth provides another interesting angle (can't remember who wrote it). Grain Brain by David Perlmutter is also a worthy read.

    Basically, sugar is toxic, period. You can't go wrong with eating whole foods/cooking from scratch and getting your meat/eggs/fish from good sources (ie pasture raised/grass-fed/cage-free animals). A lot of people (myself included) feel better avoiding gluten and dairy, in addition to sugar. It is not easy to avoid any of those if you are social at all, unless you are always the host or only go to pot lucks where you can safely eat what you brought. There is some argument that many with RA are Vitamin D deficient, and we're probably universally Omega 3 deficient - those are my supplements. It has been shown that nightshades (as posted above) are inflammatory, but I can't help but think eating a tomato in your salad is better for you than that 2pm candy bar, so try not to get yourself too stressed out. I think @helixhelix has a really good perspective here.

    In the end, of course, you can do your own experiment (n=1) and find what works best for you. Good luck!

  • Here a scientific article about startches and sugar that may interest you😊

    raypeat.com/articles/articl...

  • Hi,

    I've recently been diagnosed with RA, I used to work at a burger restaurant (where I ate my staff food of burgers/fries/fried food) where my RA was really bad - I had massive flare ups but then I've started working in a more healthy eating cafe in the last month and have noticed that with a diet change I do think it is getting better.

    However, although I've looked into how diet affects RA I don't know much what actually works - a few different things I've heard that a lot of people on here seem to advocate:

    No meat diet

    No carbs/dairy diet

    Nightshade plants are to be avoided

    What works best for people? I love my bread, bacon and tea so I'm hesitant to completely cut out grains/meat but I do want to improve what I eat.

  • Keep in mind most doctors do not believe diet will have an affect. Clearly sugar, processed foods are not great choices. I would definitely avoid fast food.

    The key is moderation. Do not do anything in excess, including vitamins . Natural does not mean good so beware. Do what works for you.live your best life, seems like a good moto🏝so I plan to park what is left of my skinny behind on some beach somewhere 😂

  • Here's an article you may find interesting: healthcentral.com/article/t...

  • This RA sufferer was certainly not lisning to her body! Her diet was not helping. Reminds me of people on RA meds that just go on and on inspite of them evidently not having an effect just believing that somehow the situation would change or it would be even worse without them.

  • I feel like you missed the point. It's not a failure to want to try other options. She doesn't feel like she failed herself either. The originator of this post (@Damaged) may go vegan and feel great. I was vegetarian for more than 12 years and I felt great when I started eating meat again. In the end, both of these diets (vegan, one that includes grass-fed ruminants) may work. Let us have an open mind here.

  • If you take RA meds for two years and your condition deteriorates and your symptoms make life really hard, you go to your doc for help. Turning to dietary modifications to decrease inflammation and symptoms, as I see it, shouldn't be different. With the exception that you seldom get help from your doc.

    What this story tells me is that inspite of her hard work she did not find what she was hoping for and let her quality of life really crash, in the belief that something good would come out of the bad. Why in the world did she not follow up her inflammatory markers and joint health during this time of obious suffering? Why was she ok with just " believing" the pain came from "detoxing"? I think this story really fundamentally tells us how important expertise support and knowledge is if you want to explore the diet route. Sadly enough it is seldom offered.

  • Simba1992, what are you talking about? You seem to think I did nothing for two years but detox!! Seriously !

    I will have you know that in the past two years I have seen eight specialists, gone through 17 drugs, a best doctors report, genetic screening...With fifteen years of chronic pain I have tried every therapy out there. You seem to imply a pacivipty which simply does not exist.

    Inquiring about diet does not imply I will simply accept the first recommendation. I also recent the implication that your way is the only way.

  • I am referring to Karen77s link. Sorry if you got the wrong impression. Simbs

  • I would just read the Clever Gut Diet by Dr Michael Mosley first. A lot of the gluten intolerance, paleo, cabbage water only diets are bunkum. It is actually far more complicated than that anyway. It seems every person is different depending on the gut microbes they have and we are all different in the percentages of cetain ones. I know a few people with RA who say they have felt better by making a few adjustments after reading the book. I think the latest research points to a potential link between RA and a leaky gut.

    I remember well at Great Ormond Street there being lots of unwell middle class kids. It turned out they were actually malnourished because their parents had them on strict diets because they were sure they were allergic to various things like gluten.

  • I intend to follow Nutrigenomics. My genes will dictate the best choices for my body. Allergies and intolerance due a great job of that as well.

    We went on our whale 🐳 watching excursion today. I am pooped but what an amazing day. The weather was beautiful . We saw several pods , an eagle, seals and serial birds. We live in Vancouver so Pacific Ocean, Rocky Mountains and a day spent on the water. Who worries about pain? Lol 😂I was fabulous and the payment will be well worth it. Hope you all had a fabulous day.

  • If only .. We aren't afforded that luxury at the hospital I go to. Only if you are diabetic or very overweight or underweight.

  • look at proteolytic enzymes and probiotics as well as a "healthy eating " programme; has done wonders for me

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