Marathon Running and Race Support
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Novice HM training plan realistic?

I'm still working through b210k (JuJu's prog) at the moment but have inevitably started looking ahead to what comes next, i.e. HM.

The most simple plan I have found seems to be to continue with 3 runs per week with cross training inbetween:

W1 - 4km, 4km, 7km, W2 - 4, 4, 8, W3 - 5, 5, 10, W4 - 6, 7, 12, W5 - 7, 7, 12 W6 - 8, 8, 15 W7 - 8, 8, 16 W8 - 4, 4, HM.

Is this a reasonable schedule for someone coming off JuJu' b210k plan?

runnersworld.co.za/wp-conte...

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That seems like a very quick plan with big weekly changes in both overall distance and long run. I would be cautious about this plan for risk of injury, but then I am no expert!

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Yes, I did think it was quite a short build- up!

Where do most people get their plans from? I notice there is not much about plans on this forum yet ( or maybe I couldn't find the posts).

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I have used myasics but for the hm it went a bit all over the place in terms of distances. I have devised my own based on similar to the one you have here but building up more slowly. Perhaps we should have a section on plans that have been tried and tested.

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Yes, seems strange to go from c25k with fixed prog to b210k with JuJu's flexible one, to kind of " you're on your own" for HM. Maybe I've just not done enough reading around the subject to have a feel for things yet. Still craving a bit of structure etc.

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And this has become a reality now that I just this moment had a rush of blood to the head abd signed up for the Helsinki City Half Marathon 19.5.18!

helsinkicityrun.fi/en

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Ooh, a mad moment! Well you have plenty of time to work up to it, what is your max distance now?

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10k (by mistake during c25k) - discovered jogging instead of running and carried on for bit too long!

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Ok that is a good start, just about half way. I would build up slowly though as your legs are still new to running.

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You'll have so much fun! I did the Helsinki Street Run in August, which I believe has now morphed into the half marathon. The support was simply amazing, and way better than at the Royal Parks Half, which was good, but where there was little support from "regular" people. No matter where I was in Helsinki, even in neighbourhoods with only one person around, they always cheered me on. Our reception in the stadium was also excellent.

I did my first couple of HMs with my own programme. I ran 3-4 times a week, and increased my mileage by 10% every week. I mostly did this by increasing my long run by 2 km every week.

I used a plan from Mapmyrun last year. It worked for me, and finally sorted out my intervals. This time I upped my runs to 4 times a week. Like before, the long run generally increased by about 2 km per week, and eventually a couple of the other runs increased a bit as well. This might be why I got a substantial PB in London - or the fact that London is flat, compared to Oslo. Hard to tell.

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Yes, looking forward to it. The route is very nice around the bay. Well done on the PBs!

I need to do JuJu's b210k first (although I've run 10k already) just to build my legs correctly.

I've also got bags of time (5 months) to train for it, so all of this advice is gratefully received! Will look into Mapmyrun plans thanks.

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First of all i would suggest that ju-ju- does a 10k to HM plan!

i think your plan looks ok, but w1 starts at 7km? if you have already got to 10k during the 5-10k plan why go back down? I would suggest starting at 10k and add on a couple of k each week. Then halfway through the plan do one week where you cut your distance in half gives your body a chance to have a recovery week. Also, remember to taper at the end so cut your distance in a final couple of weeks before the race.

Also the shorter distances make sure you do speed work or hill climbing.

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A JuJu b221k type plan would be great! Good idea Ben!

7km issue. Sure, I kindda thought maybe dropping back is for speed work or something? Also at the end of b210k only one run a week is 10k during consolidation and graduates are not running 3x10km, i.e. 10k is their long run?

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So start at 10km for the long run and add on 2km each week, then do 2 shorter distance in the week, one easy and one speed/hill work.

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Gotcha.

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I agree with Ben but as he says, build the 5-10k first. The last thing you want to scupper your plans is an over use injury through pushing too hard too soon. Also as a new runner aiming to go further, make sure you do a lot of reading on the subject, there is such a lot for us novices to learn. Then get your plan together. Good luck Lordi.

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Thanks Millsie-J, there's a lot to learn. Slowly but surely it is...

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I started doing myasics plans to see what one looked like. I had a dread of running too much, which can happen if you don’t know what you’re doing

I had no idea so a plan for me was a good idea Been using them for ages now. Even if you don’t stick to them completely you can use the bare bones of them

Good luck with your training. I have a HM plan on the go now 👍🙂

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I've just taken a look at a plan on the MyAsics app. After it's asked for how fast you can run a 10k and what you desired HM time is it makes a tailor- made plan. The run paces for the slowest jogs it suggests seem really slow tho at 8 min/km! Looks like the super slow jogs are specified right up to the end/ race day. That's a surprise to me.

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There have been many posts about people not being able to run as slow as MyAsics decrees :) Running slowly is supposed to be very good for you though.

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Well I'll try to follow it but 7.16 min has been my slowest (on my graduation jog) and that felt glacial.

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I could never manage to go that slowly :)

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Hmm...five eights are forty...my regular 5k time is 38 minutes.....so either I am super "slow"....or super at BEING slow?

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I think that looks good... For my first, I kept it really simple and did 2 5k's ( one being an interval session ) and then extended my long run. I also did this for my first marathon and it worked really well.

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Beware of any training plan that increase you weekly volume by more than 10%. This could lead to injury or overtraining symptoms.

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The slow running is in the build up phase, if you read all your plan notes

Slow running is great! Don’t skip it!

Bear in mind that you must answer the questions carefully to end up with the correct myasics plan. I would certainly do the beginner plan ! I have run a marathon and still use the beginner plans. Easy it ain’t 😱

Good luck, and as always take it steady. Rome wasn’t built in a day 💪👍🙂

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Gonna have to give 7.30 to 8 min/km a try to see how it feels. Will set a pace alarm on my watch. Should be interesting!

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The slow phase is short. It picks up don’t worry. You will hanker for the slow runs as it does so

Tell me you are doing the beginner plan!

I run 3 times a week usually. I tried four runs a week but soon hit the buffers and went back to three. Three days a week gives you time to cross train, swim, cycle or walk,or do some strength stuff

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Yes, 3 day beginner one. HM is Helsinki City Run 19 May.

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Remember to keep your plan updated! Myasics will recommend tweaks if you feedback after each run. If you don’t get an email from them then everything is good. You can check after each run as there is a little box at the bottom of your plan page which gives you a comparison of how you are performing against your plan.

If at any point you feel it is too much then slow it down. You don’t want to be injured or knackered before race day. Also,it's about enjoying the running 😃

Myasics app drives me crackers and I’ve abandoned taking it on my runs as it rarely works. There is a voice over, or rather there’s supposed to be. See posts “nagging Nancy” 😁

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I update Strava from Garmin connect automatically, but will also use Tapiriik to sync between Garmin and MyAsics so it keeps the MyAsics plan up to date.

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My sister recommends Hal Hidgon for half and full marathon plans:

NOVICE Half plan:

halhigdon.com/training/5113...

Good luck!

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The one I used looked a bit like the intermediate one on here.

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None of the plans factor in cut back weeks which are apparently good for recovery/injury reduction during periods of increasing distance. Why is that?

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That's true. May be a good idea to throw a whole week off in there around half way through perhaps?

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This is what MyAsics recommends (I rounded up or down when the paces were silly like 6.59 or 8.01 etc). I put 1 hour in as 10k time. My Garmin race predictor says silly times at the moment like 23:40 5k, 49:07 10k, 1:48:52 HM! If only! Maybe not enough data yet (quite new toy). Anyway....

MyAsics Plan: Preconditioning 3 weeks 9 runs, 5km 8.00, rest, 5km 8.00, rest, 7km 7.00-7.30, rest, rest, 7km 7.00-7.30, rest, 7km 7.00-7.30, rest, 7km 6.00-7.00, rest, rest, 7km 6.00-7.00, rest, 7km 6.30-7.30, rest, 7km 6.00-7.00, rest.

Getting faster: 7 weeks 21 runs, 8km 6.00-7.00, rest, rest, 8km 6.00-7.00, rest, 12km 7.00-7.30, rest, 8km 6.00-6.30, rest, rest, 8km 6.00-6.30, rest, 12km 6.30-7.30, rest, 8km 6.00-6.30, rest, rest, 8km 6.00-6.30, rest, 12km 7.00-7.30, rest, 8km 6.00-6.30, rest, rest, 5km 8.00, rest, 8km 6.00-6.30, rest, 8km 6.00-6.30, rest, rest, 8km 6.00-6.30, rest, 16km 7.00-7.30, rest, 8km 6.00-6.30, rest, rest, 8km 6.00-6.30, rest, 16km 7.00-7.30, rest, 8km 6.00-6.30, rest, rest, 8km 6.00-6.30, rest, 16km 6.45-7.30, rest, rest.

Going further: 5km 8.00, 12km 6.00-6.45, rest, rest, 12km 6.00-6.45, rest, rest, 5km 8.00, 12km 6.20-6.30, rest, rest, 12km 6.20-6.30, rest, rest.

Race Simulation: 5km 8.00, 12km 6.20-6.30, rest, rest, 18km 6.00, rest, rest, 5km 8.00, 12km 6.20-6.30, rest, rest, 18km 6.00, rest, rest, 5km 8.00, 12km 6.45-7.20, rest, rest, 18km 6.00, rest, rest,.

Tapering: 5km 7.50, 8km race pace 6.00, rest, rest, 8km race pace 6.00, rest, 8km 6.00-6.45, rest, 5km 8.00, rest, Race Day 21km 6.00.

(I'd like to get close to 2hrs for HM hence 6.00 min pace)

Or the alternative might be to follow the same sort of routine that many people on here have suggested like: - 5km + 10km + (11, 12, 13, 14, 16, 17, 19, 21km). I'm rubbish at sticking to plans so maybe this simple one might be better for me after JuJu's plan? 5km slow? 10km pace? Longer run slow but faster towards end/closer to race day + taper like in Asics plan?

Really appreciate the advice on here from you wise-heads!

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I struggled a bit with the jumping distances of the my asics plan, going from 8km to 12km or 16km. The 10k plan was great but for me I think I need my legs to build the distance with gradual increases. That said, I have not run a hm so my plan may not be the right plan!!

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I have to say that I too don't like the look of the big jumps in mileage in the Asics plan either. Maybe I've a,ready talked myself into the 5+10+(10+ 1km extra per) week aporoach?

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I tried running at 8min/km today and it was nigh on impossible for me. Managed 7.14min/km for 6km but not comfortable or natural at all for me. I was in zone 2 heart rate 66% and zone 3 for only 33% of time. I think my super easy pace is above 7 min.

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Yep even the easy ones aren’t really. They do have a taper week though 🙂 They have a sort cool down perio post race and then a period of build up before downloading another plan

As regards the jump in distance, did you feed the correct information about previous race times ?

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Pretty sure I inputted correct data. Might leave the Asics one for a while tho until have more reliable data (i.e. I have not actually tried to run a fastest 5 or 10k yet at race pace). Then try again.

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That sounds like a plan! You don’t want to do too much too soon and get injured 🙂

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Well I`m just about to hand myself another dilemma by deciding to go hiking in Spain for a month right in the middle of my HM training plan! (One of the few benefits of being "between contracts" aka unemployed to dispense with the euphemism!). So will walk 20-30km every day for a month on the Camino de Santiago and still need to follow some sort of running fitness maintenance plan! What this means is I'll be running a 5, 8 and 12km each week just before going to Spain. Then will have 10-11 weeks till my HM after I return. Is running in evenings in Spain too much on top of a 20km walk on run days? Would a 5km a 6km and 7-8km each week for a month be enough to tide things over? I won`t jump up to the 16km run specified in my plan during the hike holiday, so is 10 weeks after my return enough time to getup to 18km and taper?

(Yes, I'm nuts I know....)

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Given your comment earlier about there not being any cut-back or reset weeks in your plan - I think you have your answer here! If you are walking 20-30 km a day I think you can cut back on your running a lot, presumably? Or can you at most factor in days of less walking, with a run in the evening (though far less than in 'normal' life?)

I'd be wary of injury not only because it sucks and will be a setback in your HM training, but most of all because it would NOT be good to find yourself halfway through the Camino de Santiago with a dodgy knee/ankle/etc. You don't want to spoil an experience like that. I have no HM training experience at all but I am sure that your walking holiday will benefit your health and strength enormously, and don't underestimate what it means to walk so far each day.

(I am a also a weeny bit jealous!)

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Thanks Helene! This will be my 4th camino holiday so the hiking/walking aspect is no problem for me and I've never suffered any injuries or blisters (St Jean to Finnisterre 2015, Leon to Finnisterre 2016, Logrono to Leon to Oviedo to Santiago 2017). You must do it one day, it's fantastic!

That said, the concern I have is whether running/jogging same day as walking 20km is a problem. Or could 20km walk be seen as a "warm-up"?! Maybe only walk 15-20km on run days and 35km on rest days etc?

Incidentally, the avatar I use is from the Camino Frances just south of Pamplona, a steel art installation on top of the Alto de Perdon.

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How wonderful! I really want to do it one day (and I shall). Hiking holidays are my absolute favourite and it looks like such an amazing experience.

Perhaps once you've got into the rhythm of things you'll be able to manage the odd run on top of the walk, but I imagine it might have to be one of those things you can only know for sure once you're there and doing it. What you've suggested sounds good.

That said, if a 20k walk is a warm-up, then sir, I salute you... :)

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