Sperm quality

[TheWarren]

We have had 5 early miscarriages, and as all our tests have been normal it is assumed it's down to poor egg quality due to my age. I am doing lots to improve this through supplements, cut out alcohol, caffeine, healthy diet and exercise. Our doctors have said very little about what my partner can do to improve sperm quality (there may be nothing wrong with his sperm, but it can't hurt to improve it anyway). He eats pretty healthy and does plenty of exercise. He doesn't really drink (might have a couple over Christmas - do you think it matters?). Cut down to less than 200mg of caffeine a day and takes multi vits. Is there anything else he really should be doing? It's hard as the doctors have told him he doesn't need to change anything as we're getting pregnant - however my argument is until they can tell us why we're miscarrying then we should be doing everything we can. But he think I am crazy and reading too much and telling him to do something different every day. He's probably right!, Any advice?

[Twiglet2]

my advice would be to relax a little on yourself and defo on your husband as this is something that can put a strain on your relationship if you’re not careful. Especially after having so many losses and heartache. enjoy Christmas together and try not to worry too much about what you eat and drink for a bit it sounds like you are both doing a lot of good stuff already but you do also have to live your life too 💜

we’ve had 4 miscarriages with ‘perfect’ donor sperm, the exact same donor sperm that brought us our little boy so sometimes it can just happen. Ive ate healthy and not drank at all etc in the past but the one that worked I was eating and drinking what I liked and I relaxed and lived a little so I might be a bit bias in that respect about how much importance I place on it as obviously the ‘books’ say otherwise and had me worried about everything I ate and drank and even what shampoo I used and cutlery I ate with!!!. I got proper wrapped up in it all for a while.

I would probably focus on tests to see if there could be any other reason for the miscarriages other than embryo quality due to age (thyroid test, etc) but if you’ve done all that already I see why you would want to try something yourself to have a bit of control back but just be careful not to lose yourself or put too much on your husband along the way (speaking from my own experience here of doing this!) as your mental health is just as important (if not more important) when trying too 🤗 I had to take a big deep breath and put down google for a bit though to do that! I really hope the next one is the miracle one for you both! Xx

[TheWarren in reply to Twiglet2]

Thanks, that's all really good advice.

[Nabsal]

no you definitely need to do something different it’s not common to have miscarriages it’s due to genetics abnormalities. It’s not only due to egg both are responsible egg and sperm. Start eating proper multivitamins you both who help to resolve this issue . Specially omaga3 high dose with DHeA and epa instead ask your doctor to check these levels before start. Ubiquional solfataras 200mg start taking as well.

[Nabsal in reply to Nabsal]

Sorry spelling mistake. Ubiquional solga 200mg

[Countryliving86]

Sorry to hear about the struggles you’re going through. We are quite new to all of this, however due to our circumstances have spent a lot of time listening to the Test Him podcast which talks about sperm quality and DNA fragmentation which apparently can have a big impact on miscarriage so if he is willing it might be worth looking at having more in depth sperm analysis and DNA fragmentation testing done to see if that’s contributing to miscarriages.

As the others have said good supplements for both as well from what I have read, zinc, selenium, folic acid for him too, Co Q10, Omega with DHA, Vit B12, Vit D all good ones.

Good luck xx

[Guru1111]

My husband used FertyBiotic... A bit expensive but It was what doctors said... And spermiogram parameters improved.

[Olive8000]

Hi TheWarren,

I feel you on this one, I’ve had 5 miscarriages and two failed ivf attempts, with a diagnosis of “unexplained infertility’. I think it’s definitely worth your partner having a semen test with your GP as a starting point and considering DNA fragmentation test and then depending on the results considering whether there could be something underlying like a varecocele if the results flag anything. It’s good to explore all options as there are so many underlying factors. Push for additional testing, have you been referred to your local reoccurrent miscarriage unit? If not, ask your GP to refer you. You can also be referred to Tommys reoccurrent miscarriage units, which are national. Take a look at their website for details and ask your GP to refer you. We are not at the end of our journey, but I have some hope at least. I figured out by myself a couple of months ago that I have endo, which I hadn’t even considered before. My doctors (5 in total never suggested it and said that didn’t think so when asked directly). I had stage 2-3, which was removed by laparoscopy at the beginning of December and they found it on my ovaries. I’m hoping this was causing our chromosomal abnormalities- not one of the well known mechanisms by which it causes miscarriage, but their are certainly researchers out there arguing that it can cause miscarriage in this way.

Don’t stop fighting to find your underlying cause, because there is a reason and don’t let them keep fobbing you off with it’s all your age, because of course it’s a factor, but when you get to five miscarriages, there may well be something underlying that they just haven’t found yet.

Good luck and don’t give up!

[TheWarren in reply to Olive8000]

Thanks for your reply, we have been to our recurrent miscarriage clinic and had lots of tests and investigations (including laparoscopy). My partners sperm has had the basic checks, but not for fragmentation. My worry is the time this all takes, I am 41 (42 in May) and can't afford to waste any time waiting for more test results. If the most likely cause is my age, this is just going to get worse the more months we wait. I have looked at Tommys, but there is a wait for referral and most of it is research trials which might not help. The thing is we have had the 5 pregnancies within just over a year, so were getting pregnant pretty much every time we tried, which isn't really normal for someone of my age (possibly a bit of super fertility). As we are likely to have about 80% poor egg quality at this age, it seems to fit that my uterus keeps implanting poor quality embryos and not filtering them out as it should. The last 3 pregnancies we got to at least 8 weeks and saw a heartbeat. I don't know if that gives any indication as to the problem. Just so many questions and I don't feel I have time to spend finding all the answers. We are going to start our second round of ivf in January, so need to give this our best shot and be as healthy and prepared as we can be.

Thanks and good luck

[Skittles11 in reply to TheWarren]

If you are doing IVF could you consider PGTA testing the embryos? This would help show which are genetically normal and save you time perhaps transferring embryos that have potential problems

[TheWarren in reply to Skittles11]

Thanks, yes we plan to do this if we get enough embryos next time.

[Olive8000 in reply to TheWarren]

I completely understand, I’m 41 in March and we’ve really been through the mill with testing and ivf over the last 4 years.

I have a nutritionist and she recommended seeking health’s ‘optimal pre natal’, it has a high dose of methylfolate 800mg, and the men’s multi is ‘optimal man’, there’s also omega 3s; we use Bare Biology, NAC - great for fertility and both of us take 200mg of PhamaNord Ubiquinol. These are pretty expensive supplements, but sounds like you’re in a similar situation to us and throwing the kitchen sink at it.

Good luck. I hope you get your rainbow baby x

[Olive8000 in reply to Olive8000]

Oh and if your partner is under stress, Ashwaganda could help, it’s great for stress and has also been shown to have positive effects on testosterone.

[TheWarren in reply to Olive8000]

Thanks

[Choots]

Proxeed plus is a supplement that really helps! I advise him to take this- you can get it on amazon

[TheWarren in reply to Choots]

Thanks

[Doodlebug23]

Olive leaf extract is good for toxins and free radicals etc

[RekaV]

Hi TheWarren

We also had 4 miscarriages- like you, we got pregnant quite easily as well. The NHS did a biopsy from the last products of conception and found chromosomal abnormalities so we decided to go IVF. My OH had sperm issues, low motility and DNA fragmentation. He has been taking Wellmen Conception tablets and 200mg ubiquinol, cut down on alcohol and improved diet. Our clinic said it doesn’t matter as much because we were doing IVF with ICSI however 6 months after taking the vitamins and changing lifestyle the sperm quality has greatly improved.

We are also doing PGTA and don’t have a normal embryo so far ( I also have a very poor reaction to stimms)

Perhaps PGTA is worth considering if you are worried about chromosomal abnormalities and as people said it before me mental health is also important so try to relax ( easier said than done. I wish you all the best x

[TheWarren in reply to RekaV]

Thanks. Yes we plan to do PGT-A in our next round if we get enough embryos. We only get 2 last time, so did fresh transfer of them both. Frustrating as I reacted well to stims, lots of follicles growing. My partners sperm doesn't have any known issues, morphology and motility are fine. I don't know about dna fragmentation, it's another avenue we could explore, but there are so many avenues we could go down and waste lots of time and money. Can I ask what your oh did to improve diet? My partner is pretty healthy, but just wondering if there is anything else he should cut out or take? He does drink a bit of caffeine but less than 200mg per day.

[RekaV in reply to TheWarren]

It sounds like to me that you are already doing everything you can. In terms of diet we just eat more vegetables but to be honest I think the only thing that made a difference was cutting down the alcohol, doctor said that is a main factor when it comes to sperm quality and fragmentation. We only had 1 and 1 embryos so far but waiting on the results of the PGTA from the last round. Many people prefer fresh transfer to PGTA but because of my history with miscarriages we decided to test them. Good luck to you! X

[TheWarren in reply to RekaV]

Thanks, sounds like similar situation. I have cut out alcohol completely, my partner barely drinks and never has really. Good luck to you, hope your pgta comes back with a good result x

[Kilk22]

so sorry for all your losses, can’t imagine how hard that is. It’s a very tough and frustrating journey. I would 100% get your partner to have the dna fragmentation test done, I wouldn’t think results would take that long to come back from that. Semen analysis isnt enough to go by. Also have you had Alice/Emma testing done? The environment needs to be optimal to carry a pregnancy. I understand you are conscious of ur age but plenty of women have success in their early 40’s and beyond…have you low amh? ..it would make sense to do the above now before you keep transferring embryos that possibly won’t make it. I really hope it all works out for you 🙏🏼🙏🏼

[TheWarren in reply to Kilk22]

Thanks, I will ask my doctor. I am guessing you have to pay for those tests? Also concerned about spending money on lots of tests, the doctors haven't suggested any of these yet and I know friends who have spent thousands on various tests. There are so many avenues you can explore, it's a bit of a mine field! I have had several pregnancies that have made it to 8 weeks, so perhaps implantation isn't a problem? I don't know what the Alice and Emma tests are? My Amh is 7.1 so it's within average for my age, but on the lower side of average.

[TheWarren in reply to TheWarren]

Also reading a study that decreasing abstince to 1 day can reduce dna fragmentation in sperm. So this might be a simple way to reduce chances of the impact of this, without testing.

[Kilk22 in reply to TheWarren]

Hey, yes I'm sure the dna frag test is at a cost , depending on where you are, the cost varies. Some places are cheaper than others. In Ireland it's roughly €350 I think, could be more now as it was a good few years back I had experience with it. Yes there is so many add ons / tests that can break the bank for sure but I just think it's worth covering the basics (personally I think the dna drag test should be a part of the semen analysis )

For me it was a game charger as my eggs were completely getting the blame until we discovered DNA frag. I then had success with donor sperm.

[XXKKXX]

There may be absolutely no correlation but my pregnancies failed to progress beyond 4-4.5weeks. Before my ivf cycle in Oct I took for a month before, youth and earth NMN , LIPOSOMAL RESVERATROL AND LIPOSOMAL ALA

besides that I just took youth and earth q10, has something in it to improve absorption and multi vit and cut out sugar. No caffeine.

No idea if it did anything our embryos were still poor grade but all got to blast and so far my pregnancy has stuck and I'm 10 weeks 🤞

[Zassa]

Hi it doesn't seem only like chromosomal abnormalities past 8 weeks. I have read about several people having multiple miscarriages due to bacteria or other inflammation in the uterus such as ureaplasma. Many people have no symptoms and it is often not even checked for (and this people in monogamous relationships can get too as it's not always sexually transmitted).Otherwise I would say your immune system but I assume you have tested this. There is a list and a lot of information on what can be tested in 'The fertility plan'.

I hope you find out the cause!

[TheWarren in reply to Zassa]

Thanks. It's so difficult and all these tests cost money. It could be lots of things, but I don't want to spend money on tests randomly without good reason. I have seen 3 consultants now and non of them have mentioned any of this. So I am confused what to do for the best. I've had a basic immunity test done by my GP which wad normal, not sure if it was the right one.

[Zassa in reply to TheWarren]

I understand, any bacteria can be checked with home tests that are not too expensive and for more information about immune tests I would suggest any of the books 'The fertility plan' or 'It Starts with An Egg, 3rd edition'. Yes I know it is not really talked about a lot and in my case I didn't find that any clinics that really listened to me so I thought it was better to educate myself.One more thing, do pay attention to the time the embryo stopped developing (if you've done ultrasounds to confirm loss), if you found it was consistently after around 8-9 weeks, when the placenta starts forming, new research says that it's the sperm that gives the instructions for the placenta. If there is a problem there it could be the sperm but most problems related to the egg would be in the first few weeks and not after 8 weeks.

[TheWarren in reply to Zassa]

Thanks, do you know where I can get the home tests? Also would you mind sharing the new research about the sperm? Would be interesting to read, although I have no reason to think there's a problem with my partners sperm, he's really healthy and does smoke or drink. Some miscarriages have been around the 8 week mark, hard to say exactly when though. We did send off samples from the last 2 for testing but unfortunately the samples weren't suitable to test. I was really hoping that would give us some answers.The thing is we got pregnant pretty much every time we tried, sometimes it took 2 cycles, which isn't really normal for someone of my age. So my best guess is that I am super fertile and my uterus keeps implanting poor quality embryos. Someone of my age on average 80% of eggs are bad quality, so 5 pregnancies in a year isn't normal and bound to be some poor quality eggs! But I could be completely wrong, there are so many possibilities and routes to go down. It's a mine field! Happy new year x

[Zassa in reply to TheWarren]

Happy New Year to you too. Here is one at home test that can test a wide range of different bacteria (but there are others more specific that are cheaper just search on google) yourdaye.com/products/at-ho... I saw articles about women having multiple miscarriages and found out it was ureaplasma (I would have sent links but they're in Danish and Norwegian).

Here is some information on sperm and miscarriages:

news-medical.net/health/-Fa...

google.com/amp/s/www.imperi...

In general I would say that once you have become pregnant it's easier to become pregnant again but it's still very unusual that the body has completely 'lost' it's screening mechanism if faulty embryos. Still I would say it's good if both you and your partner work on being your 'best', maybe read 'It Starts With An Egg' (3rd edition) it would have info both for you and your partner.

I hope it works out for you x