Another failed transfer #4 (second EC)

[PrincessGurn1984]

Unfortunately I got a negative test this morning, official test day is Wednesday but not even a hint of a line. This is our 4th transfer and from our second egg collection. We have no embryos in the freezer as just got 1 day 3 from this cycle.

Feel like don’t know what to do about next steps. We will continue with the journey but we haven’t had any implantation at all yet with any of them, is it the embryos? Or something else. They say my lining is perfect etc so I don’t know what else it could be other than embryo quality.

Do we change clinics? Would that even make a difference. It’s hard to see a way forward at this point with it all. Anyone had 4 transfers fail in a row without any implanting then gone onto have success? Any advice on any of it very much welcome please. Hard to feel hopeful. I’m 38 in July too not sure if that’s making a difference to quality X

[Gempuddleduck]

Hi there. I’m so sorry ti hear about your negative tests. I know how heartbreaking it is. I also had 4 failed transfers and yes, it was the embryo quality. I had an ‘ ok’ embryo transferred last year on our 5th go which implanted but unfortunately had Edward’s syndrome and an excellent embryo implanted this year and I’m now 9 weeks pregnant. Our issue was my egg quality and sperm quality so we have ended up using donors. Have you any male factor issues? I am 39 years old.

[PrincessGurn1984 in reply to Gempuddleduck]

Thank you for telling me your story! It does make me feel less alone. As I know people that have had multiple transfers fail but they seem to get maybe a chemical and we haven’t got to that stage even as they just don’t seem to implant. We have a 7 year old son naturally but we are now facing secondary infertility due to my husband now having motility/concentration issues. He’s 44 now. Do we keep trying will any of them be good enough quality? It’s such a gamble isn’t it there’s just no way of knowing x

[Gempuddleduck in reply to PrincessGurn1984]

There’s just no way of knowing is there - it’s horrible. I really feel for you. I do have to say that when it was time to stop and try something completely different I just knew and once I’d made the decision, a huge weight was lifted. We also started testing ours and that made a big difference as less heartache and time wasted xx

[PrincessGurn1984 in reply to Gempuddleduck]

Maybe we need to start testing them, we haven’t tried that yet. It’s scary though as by testing them could be left with zero to transfer? X

[Gempuddleduck in reply to PrincessGurn1984]

It’s so hard. ☹️ Could your husband try surgery to extract good sperm? We tried that too?

[PrincessGurn1984 in reply to Gempuddleduck]

No we haven’t considered that yet, we are doing ICSI. Does the extraction make a big difference to the sperm quality? X

[McQueeny]

Heya. I’m so so sorry….. I don’t know what advice to give - I’ve also wondered about changing clinics, but like you I don’t know if it would make a difference. Just wanted to say I’m really sorry you got another negative result, it’s so devastating . Two rounds is still relatively early days, and even with no implantation to date there’s still definitely a chance of success in the future - every cycle is different and every cycle is another learning opportunity. But I know none of that helps the pain right now….. be good to yourself, allow yourself to process how you’re feeling, and wishing you strength and the very best of luck for next steps 🤞🍀💫💜

[PrincessGurn1984 in reply to McQueeny]

Thanks for your lovely message, it’s so hard to know what to do as next steps, just have to keep trying and not lose hope. I guess with every failure it hopefully means we are closer to success eventually xx

[McQueeny in reply to PrincessGurn1984]

Absolutely - just have to keep trying 💪💫 xx

[Millbanks]

Hi lovely,I’m so sorry - I know exactly how you feel.

I had 5 transfers in a row that failed so I understand the emotion and feeling of hopelessness.

I also had good linings and was on extra progesterone.

But what did it for us (on our 6th transfer) was taking steroids and intralipids. I had my immune system tested and it turns out that my natural killer cells were really high and rejecting the embryos.

No embryo issues…

I would recommend the immune tests.

Hang in there xxx

[Millbanks in reply to Millbanks]

Oh and I was 38 when we finally got our BFP just turned 39 when I gave birth xx

[PrincessGurn1984 in reply to Millbanks]

Thanks that’s good to know! It’s hard to not worry about the age issue too x

[PrincessGurn1984 in reply to Millbanks]

Thank you it sucks doesn’t it, to feel like you just keep transferring embryo after embryo with no difference in result or even a sign they are trying to implant. Did you have to change clinics to get that testing done? I’m not sure my clinic does it I’d have to check but I’ve heard there’s a London bootcamp style IVF clinic that always does immune testing. Did consider switching but it’s very expensive there and full on x

[Millbanks in reply to PrincessGurn1984]

It really does 💔

So because of covid we were actually between NHS and private but ultimately the private clinic did the testing.

There is a london clinic that does stand alone testing as you say… unfortunately not cheap but I would say probably worth it.

Or you can go to a Recurrent Implantation Clinic and talk it through with them.

Xxx

[PrincessGurn1984 in reply to Millbanks]

Thanks I’ll take a look 👍🏼 Did you ever stop meds early once you got a negative a day or so before offices test day? My official test day is Wednesday but seems pointless carrying on with them (although I know it’s advised) x

[Millbanks in reply to PrincessGurn1984]

I always carried on “just in case” a miracle happened (never did)… xx

[PrincessGurn1984 in reply to Millbanks]

That’s true! Xx

[PrincessGurn1984 in reply to Millbanks]

Also I forgot to ask did you have any of your embryos tested? We haven’t done that, maybe we should x

[Millbanks in reply to PrincessGurn1984]

We did do PGS on 8 embryos and 6 were normal so I assume that wasn’t the issue xx

[PrincessGurn1984 in reply to Millbanks]

In our first EC we had 3 blasts and then 1 on our second EC so not sure if they would test that many embryos not sure how many you need to warrant testing them x

[Millbanks in reply to PrincessGurn1984]

I think 2 or 3 is fine - we actually tested because we had so many x

[Star3129 in reply to Millbanks]

Congrats on your bfp!Just crossed your message about testing immune system is it a blood test where you can find out or endo biopsy is the only option? I really confused n struggling for many years to get pregnant as implantation never occurred so things of immune system getting checked after many transfers.

I am in my 2ww now hoping I get the goof news this month.🤞 crossed.

[Millbanks in reply to Star3129]

Thanks lovely, I had the blood tests done rather than the biopsy….

It’s quite expensive but for me it was one of the last testing options, so I knew I had to try.

Fingers crossed for you xx

[Star3129 in reply to Millbanks]

Thanks hun,are the blood tests accurate? No need for biopsy? I was thinking for the same to check if all is OK bcz of implantation issues.

If you don't mind me asking how much did you pay and where?

Take care

[Millbanks in reply to Star3129]

I’ll message you ❤️

[Barenina]

Hi. So sorry to hear about your negative test 😢 How are you coping?

Have your clinic suggested the Era, Emma, Alice test?

We don’t have that exact test here in Norway but I did a test that is similar to the Emma/Alice test and the results came back that I needed to be treated with antibiotics because of chronic endometrisis. I’ve actually had 4 courses of antibiotics the last year because I am one of the few (off course 😤) where it was persistent.

This matters for implantation and to not miscarry. I am now taking probiotics orally and vaginally every other day to keep the environment down there healthy.

So you could ask you clinic for this test or some also just chooses to take a two week treatment of antibiotics before their cycle and then probiotics. (Avoiding the cost of the test and the waiting for results …)

Your man could also benefit at sometimes poor sperm quality is due to an infection.

I also did the “natural killer cell” test which came back negative for me.

For your egg quality you already tried q10 and all that. What about testing your testosterone levels? It’s just a quick blood test, and if it’s on the lower side lots of women coming close to 40 can benefit from it as we usually have lower testosterone levels.

It’s what I think made all the difference for me as my levels was indeed low.

+ antibiotics and both me and my partner taking supplements and my partner also ejaculating every other day up to egg retrieval and then just 18 hours before he had to give him sample 🫶

You know our long story and I just wish we did a lot of testing earlier and not just continued doing the same thing which was not working.

All the best for you!💫💫💫

[PrincessGurn1984 in reply to Barenina]

Thanks I totally agree that I want to look into more testing before we go again for another egg collection, it seems like a waste otherwise time wise and financially to jump right in when there is obviously something that hasn’t been looked into further. It’s so hard to not know exactly what it is as all our ‘basic’ tests were ok but I do think I want the killer cells checked and like you say maybe even something like thyroid checks as there must be a reason. As I’ve had a child naturally that maybe something in me has changed or out of balance since then that needs addressing. I wish they could just guarantee a baby at the end of all of this 🤪 x

[JudithSS]

Hunny I’m so so sorry! We’re about to do our third round and decided to have my NK cells tested. I thought if we’re going this again then I need to know even though it’s unlikely…. Turns out I have high NK cells. Anyway angel please take it easy and im so so sorry that this has happened to you xx

[PrincessGurn1984 in reply to JudithSS]

Thank you! So glad you got results and to the root of the issue doesn’t it seem like NK cells seem a regular thing on this journey! I don’t know why they aren’t checking this from the offset right from day 1? Have you had to switch clinics to get that done? X

[JudithSS in reply to PrincessGurn1984]

Hello darling, sorry for the delay, I’ve been AWOL! Well the results don’t necessarily mean that I will achieve a pregnancy but it’s something that can help hopefully. So I advocated this for myself, my clinic wasn’t interested and I just wanted to get it checked in case the next round failed etc before we decided on our new clinic! I hope you’re doing ok x

[PrincessGurn1984 in reply to JudithSS]

Hey! Sorry for the delay, so you also decided to switch clinics? I’m proper on the fence with if to do that. I just can’t seem to make decisions anymore it makes my head spin 🤣

[JudithSS in reply to PrincessGurn1984]

Yes! We’ve switched everything up! But before this I said I was never doing ivf ever again and needed 6 months off. Then I seen my friends baby and I felt a bit of hope again. Make sure you take time out love xx