Has anybody heard of lactate/lactic acid in CLL?
Thinking about Wimco’s "Pain in the body" makes me wonder if there is anything to the possibility of lactic acid causing some of the aches and pains many have. That is if CLL causes lactic acid.
Just a thought.
Hi Lavinia-Blue,
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Could your question involve this commonly measured enzyme:
Lactate dehydrogenase (LDH) is an enzyme that's in almost all body tissues. It helps the body turns glucose (sugar) from food into usable energy for our cells. LDH (also called lactic acid dehydrogenase) blood levels usually are low.
LDH levels are usually low in the blood. However, high levels of LDH are associated with many diseases and conditions. LDH measurements can show if tissue damage has occurred and help doctors evaluate certain types of cancer.
A higher-than-normal level of LDH may indicate:
Blood flow deficiency (ischemia)
Heart attack
Hemolytic anemia
Infectious mononucleosis
Leukemia or lymphoma
Liver disease (for example, hepatitis)
Low blood pressure
Muscle injury
An LDH test involves drawing blood through a needle inserted into a vein in your arm. For LDH tests of the cerebrospinal fluid, you'll need a lumbar puncture (also called a spinal tap).
Factors that can affect LDH levels include:
Contaminated blood sample
Broken red blood cells
Anesthetics, aspirin, narcotics, and certain other medicines
Medicines with ascorbic acid (vitamin C)
Alcohol
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Len
I was thinking more in line with lactic acid and physical aches. Don’t really know if this has any related factor in CLL, but thought I heard or read something about cancer and lactic acid a while ago.
lankisterguy -
I don't think it's the LDH test, Len.
When I was admitted to the hospital with an infection recently, they ran a different lactic acid test. It's range was 0.4-2 mmol/L. My result was 0.5.
I looked back at my results while in hospital at M.D. Anderson, and they, too, ran it. They listed it as Lactic Acid, Venous, V Lactate, range 0.5- 1.6 mmol/L, My value during a severe infusion reaction to obinutuzumab plus a laboratory TLS (Tumor Lysis Syndrome) was 0.7mmol/L.
My LDH at the time was 421, down from 1701 the day before.
=seymour=
my.clevelandclinic.org/heal...
Intense muscle exertion produces lactic acid as an exercise by product. I always assumed its what causes the muscle burn when pedalling my bicycle hard.
The byproducts of heavy exercise are not especially good for the body, eg increased acidosis / lower pH of blood. CO2 adds to that of course, dissolved in blood. This in part, limits how much exercise can safely occur before effort simply ceases.
Some can exert more due to training which cause many physiological adaptations, choice amongst them is inducing enzymes.
So the sugars get more rapidly shunted around the krebs cycle for e.g.
to produce more energy. (ATP -->ADP) etc.
I am not sure that lactic acid has a role in pain at rest however. I stand ready to be informed.
Wimco’s "Pain in the body"
Do you have a link to this?
Jig
Me too. That’s why I threw the question out there. Perhaps someone heard of it.
Wimco's was posted two days ago. healthunlocked.com/cllsuppo...
I have elevated lactic acid all the time. I train a lot and often change the exercises that I do. Every time I do so I develop muscle pains. Since it constantly hurts then somewhere I don't pay attention to it anymore 😁. I just put it down to exercise induced pain. I can only hope that I can recognize a different one if there is one. If you do not exercise at all then your pain is likely to be caused by something else.
I found out that my blood pressure was rising at times and I had a lot of pain in my body. It wasn’t caused by working out. Diff then muscle pain. Dr. Put me on water pills and pain stopped. Something to do with elevated blood pressure which makes sense to me
You mean diuretics? Do you take blood pressure medication?
Sounds like DOMS?
Delayed Onset Muscle Soreness?
Normal after strenuous muscle activity.
Note: link above talks about lactic acid.
Jig
That must be it. I haven't heard that expression before. Google translator couldn't help me either. Muscle ache is all it could come up with 😁.
My PT talked about it since ever!
I guess it's to do with how muscles grow. Sign of a good work out session.
I don't treat my DOMS, apart from a little rest.
Jig
😉
From link above
Is there a connection between DOMS and lactic acid?
It was once thought that a buildup of exercise-induced lactic acid was to blame for DOMS, but this common misconception has been debunked.
Acute muscle soreness is due to lactic acid buildup. DOMS, on the other hand, is not related to lactic acid buildup; it’s due to microscopic tears and muscle damage.
Thanks, I did not know that it was debunked already😊
Lavinia-Blue -
I don't think the blood lactic acid result relates to pain at all. It relates to muscle metabolism, which might also have muscle pain due to the acid buildup. On the other hand, I don't think a bruise in a muscle would raise lactic acid. A cramp might raise it locally, but I'm not sure if a single muscle could raise the test value. From what I can tell, it's more seen in athletes.
You can certainly order your own lactic acid test online or through your doctor. I don't think it's expensive. But what to do if it's high? IV fluids?
In reading the Cleveland Clinic article, I notice that general acidosis can be evidenced by the anion gap test that many of us get on a comprehensive metabolic panel. In 20 years of blood test results, my anion gap has never been high. More often, I see my anion gap was low twice - while I was in hospital on IV fluids. I certainly have muscle aches, as well as pain due to arthritis. But we're all different, so test it and find out.
=seymour=
I don’t remember where I got the thought from, but this little blurb says “cancer cells create lactate” —for what it’s worth. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
healthline.com/health/lacti...
“Cancer
Cancer cells create lactate. This buildup of lactate may accelerate as a person loses weight and the disease progresses.”
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