Canada ends vaccine requirement for travellers.

[onu1tadi2]

As of Oct. 1, Canada no longer requires masks or or proof of vaccines on planes or trains. Unvaccinated persons entering Canada no longer need to be quarantined. (I was unable to copy and paste a source but googling will yield reports of this.)

[MistyMountainHop]

I hope this helps.

news.yahoo.com/canada-drop-...

[Agfar]

I'm not sure if that pleases me or concerns me. Probably the latter but I can understand that Canada wants to be in line with other countries.

[onu1tadi2 in reply to Agfar]

I am pleased as am unvaxed. But if i get on a plane (necessary not holiday travel) I am a bit wary of the recirculated air. I generally avoid closed crowded places. Now wondering if it is worth getting Evusheld. The treatments in Toronto for unvaxed infected persons work well and require no hospitalization.

[bennevisplace]

Most other countries did this some time ago.

Canada now needs to get going with the latest bivalent vaccines, before Omicron BA.4.6 sets in. If that happens, CLLers can't depend on vax or Evusheld for neutralising antibodies.

[New-bee-cell in reply to bennevisplace]

Bivalent vaccine now available to all 18+ in Ontario 😁🇨🇦

[bennevisplace in reply to New-bee-cell]

OK, but by "the latest bivalent vaccines" I do mean the vaccines targeting the Omicron BA.4 and BA.5 subvariants as well as earlier iterations of the virus. These latest vaccines (from Moderna and Pfizer) are also believed to be effective against the BA.4.6 subvariant, which has been rapidly gaining ground in the USA, Europe and elsewhere because it's the top escapist yet v. antibodies from first-generation vaccines theconversation.com/another...

From a recent post healthunlocked.com/cllsuppo... I understood that these latest vaccines had not yet been introduced in Canada. The first bivalent vaccines, which had, might not be as effective in neutralising BA4.6. Therefore, if Canada's main controls against the spread of BA4.6, i.e. travel and border protocols, are to be lifted imminently, it seems important to get as many people vaccinated with the latest bivalent vaccines as soon as possible, to head off a surge of Omicron BA4.6.

[Red49 in reply to bennevisplace]

You are correct the newest bivalent is still not here I have been searching the news every day in hopes Health Canada will make an announcement. As per a recent post I feel like I am at a crossroads as I am almost five months since last booster and everyone’s lives are continuing around me. And I expect that of course but it makes me feel like I should go get what’s available.

[onu1tadi2 in reply to bennevisplace]

I assume you mean Evusheld needs to be taken before gettting infected as it is not a treatment.

[bennevisplace in reply to onu1tadi2]

No that's not what I was getting at. I mean if BA.4.6 is allowed to become dominant, CLLers can't depend on Evusheld for antibody protection, because the antibodies may have little to no neutralising capacity. The same applies anywhere, but other countries seem to be further on in vaccinating with the latest bivalents.

To expand on this:

The antibodies that Evusheld delivers into the bloodstream were a good match for antigens in the spike protein of the original virus and variants up to and including Delta. With the evolution of the Omicron variant things started to go a bit pear-shaped. Unfortunately, because Omicron was found to be generally less virulent and people wanted life to return to normal, "fringe" clinical research like "how well does Evusheld protect the immunosuppressed against current variants?" did not get done, and all we have are lab studies. But these point to Evusheld having much reduced neutralisation capacity against the dominant subvariant Omicron BA.5 and little to none against the upcoming subvariant BA.4.6. See my reply to New-bee-celll above. See also Figure 1B in biorxiv.org/content/10.1101...

[SofiaDeo in reply to bennevisplace]

And not much more effectiveness against the newer variants either, from what I am reading. Hopefully it will turn out that T-cells will help a lot if these strains can evade antibodies.

I was also reading about how some research points to Covid virus being able to hijack adipose cells and replicate inside them, which is thought to be a major contributor to obesity being a risk factor for severe infection.

livescience.com/novel-coron...

[bennevisplace in reply to SofiaDeo]

Thank you Sofia, that's a very interesting study. Another article describing the same, from Stanford's own website med.stanford.edu/news/all-n... wherein: "That means clearing SARS-CoV-2 from fat tissue could require new drugs. Monoclonal antibody therapies licensed for COVID-19, for instance, generally work by interfering with ACE2/SARS-CoV-2 interaction". Any theory as to how the virus gets in there?

[SofiaDeo in reply to bennevisplace]

Hmm, coronaviruses have a fatty cell membrane, which is why plain soaps will disrupt the viral envelope/inactivate the virus. Perhaps something about it being a fatty-type molecule allows it to penetrate or be actively transported easier into certain fat cells. Similar to how some toxins can penetrate into fatty tissues due to their molecular structure, "fat soluble toxins". I don't know exactly what parts of these molecules allow them to enter adipocytes. I think it might have something to do with the chemical structure being able to modify phospholipids in the fat cell membrane. And since fat cell chemicals also exhibit hormone like activities, this complicates it even more. The shape of the virus may be similar to something that is usually transported in during normal metabolism, instead of a passive diffusion. The article didn't say if this occurs in only certain adipocytes, there are several types and each has different functions:

biologydictionary.net/adipo...

[bennevisplace in reply to SofiaDeo]

Thanks, some tantalising possibilities. All well beyond me to unravel. The biology dictionary info is great.

I recall a study that found virus-infected fat cells in a high percentage of Covid victims. Will try to find it.

[onu1tadi2 in reply to SofiaDeo]

Very interesting. Would this then have any relationship to how fat someone is affecting their susceptibility to getting ill due to covid, I wonder?

[onu1tadi2 in reply to bennevisplace]

Well, you have just convinced me not to bother with Evusheld. I will stick to my policy of no vaccines. The treatments work well and shelves are overstocked with it. So when I travel I will try to get some to take with me. Based on research I have faith in the treatments. The vacccines for CLLers seem to offer too little. Going by probabilities I feel good if i can get a perscription filled for treatment in case i get infected during travel.

[bennevisplace in reply to onu1tadi2]

Your own no-vax policy should not deter your cohabitants from getting vaccinated. My wife will get a priority booster shortly. And there's no reason you should stop taking the precautions we vulnerable folk are used to by now, and most other folk have ditched. I've had Evusheld twice but still use a FFP2 respirator a lot.

[onu1tadi2 in reply to bennevisplace]

I live alone with daily visits from unvaxed son. We keep room well ventilated and take precautions. I go out shopping, walking, coffee shops. When i take a plane in November I will try to get a seat with more room and might wear a mask in crowded lines. Biggest problem is keeping people at a distance when they talk to me. I will not be travelling with a tropical holiday crowd. I do wonder if i would be able to get a new vax without having taken the early ones first.

[AussieNeil Partner Administrator in reply to onu1tadi2]

I'm not sure what you mean when you say "The treatments work well and shelves are overstocked with it". Treatments are also becoming less effective as the new variants become far more infectious and elusive of even healthy immune systems. Early in the pandemic, you could get by with low quality masks. They still help a bit, but people who could be infectious (ie anyone you meet) are no longer required to mask up, so nowadays with that and the so very infectious recent variants, you really do need well fitted N95 or better, particularly since so little was done to improve ventilation in public spaces - a lost opportunity.

It would be so much easier if everyone developed symptoms when they were shedding the disease, but they don't, plus LFT/RAT tests may not only be reducing in sensitivity in their response, they can work a bit late.

Don't forget that nearly all of the CLL related vaccine efficiency study reports have been concentrating on not only the easiest measured part of our immunity - antibody production, it's also the that part of our immune system most negatively impacted by our CLL and by treatments. T cell response to vaccines was recently reported in 80% of those with CLL.

With reference to the Swiss cheese model, quite a few of the slices have gone and those remaining have more and bigger holes, plus you are considering travelling by plane. Think of the green droplets being replaced with a range of droplet colours and some slices not completely blocking all colours.

With CLL specialists recommending vaccinations, you are now an outsider when survival studies are released . Having the first vaccine in the series then the bivalent booster would be a good way to catch up. Reputable studies do show that unvaccinated folk do get sicker and have a disproportionately worse survival rate.

Neil

COVID-19 variant Swiss cheese slice holes are getting larger, so we need more slices.

[onu1tadi2 in reply to AussieNeil]

I saw an article about the supply of treatments and how doctors are not prescribing them. So much emphasis is placed on masks and vaccines and not enough on maintaining distance when conversing with strangers and also on good ventilation. To me these are ultra important factors. Masked people have a false sense of security. I sometimes have to ask sales clerks to move back from me as they come so close to talk. I feel maintaining distance and avoiding sick people and rooms with poor ventilation or closed windows are more important considerations than masking and vaxes. Of course for people going to work in crowded subways or sleeping in care homes the situation requires masking and vaxxes. But so far none of my friends except one are vaxed. We attend events, eat meals and converse together. Ironically only the one who is vaxxed has had covid, twice. He lives in NYC and takes subway to work.