cll and Fenbendazole

[tbeau]

My friend has CLL and i have read so much on Fenbendazole joe Tippens protocole having used it on my husband im wondering if it could be good for my friend with cll?

[cajunjeff]

The answer is no.

[caven]

The active ingredient, Fenbendazole, is a canine dewormer for dogs older than six-months (tapeworm, whipworm, roundworm & hookworm parasites).

Do you bark? Have you worms? Is your husband a canine? If the answer is NO, then this medicine is not for you or any family members (except perhaps for Fido)!

Caven

[MsLockYourPosts Passed Volunteer]

The best thing that you can do for your friend is to not make suggestions about her care. Most of us can post lists of things "friends" tried to talk us into. Your friend needs a good doctor who is very knowledgeable about CLL to make any and all treatment decisions, and friends who offer support rather than treatment advice. I wrote off one good friend who just couldn't accept that. Noni Juice was going to cure all of my health issues and CLL doctors were going to kill me with chemo. I had enough going on without that!

[81ue]

Looks like it was researched in 2014

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...

and in 2008

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...

[AussieNeil Partner Administrator in reply to 81ue]

You've referenced the 2014 article twice, which reported on in vitro mouse model studies - the lowest level of confidence, with confidence of an effect improving with in vivo mouse model, then in vitro and finally in vivo human studies. To save others looking, note the conclusion: "These studies provided no evidence that fenbendazole would have value in cancer therapy, but suggested that this general class of compounds merits further investigation."

Neil

[81ue in reply to AussieNeil]

Meant to cut and paste

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...

from 2008

Those were the only 2 that came up

[AussieNeil Partner Administrator in reply to 81ue]

Interestingly, this older in vivo rodent study uses the B-lymphocyte P493-6 cell line, which was established from a clone of the EREB2-5 Epstein Barr Virus positive lymphoblastoid cell line. Of concern from that paper, "Fenbendazole has had immunomodulatory effects in sheep and mice18 and stimulated proliferation of T and B cells in healthy mice." One tumour also was reported as growing in the study.

Thanks for finding these interesting studies.

Neil

[BlueEyes90 in reply to AussieNeil]

You may want to look again at this study published in nature, it turns out fenbendazole acts by three seperate pathways. nature.com/articles/s41598-...

[AussieNeil Partner Administrator in reply to BlueEyes90]

Sorry, there's nothing in that 2018 paper that indicates fenbendazole could be useful for the treatment of CLL. No lymphoma cells lines were studied, with the only human cancer research being done on lung cancer (NSCLC) cell "in vitro" observations - not "in vivo" - people actually taking fenbendazole. The oral treatment studies were on mice.

Also the primary pathway of interest in that research is glucose uptake, but CLL cells preferentially metabolise fats, not glucosehealthunlocked.com/cllsuppo...

Neil

[Ellieoak]

Dear Tbeau, NO!!! Sincerely, Anna

[frostbiteapple]

There is a phase 1 study using a sister drug Mebendazole for brain cancer:cancer.gov/about-cancer/tre...

[BlueEyes90]

Here is an interesting article, outlining the multiple anticancer pathways that fenbendazole exerts on the body. It was published in nature..nature.com/articles/s41598-...

[AussieNeil Partner Administrator in reply to BlueEyes90]

BlueEyes, do you have a diagnosis of CLL or lung cancer? You've replied three times to a 4 year old post, referencing a 2018 study which mainly focuses on the effect of fenbendazole, a canine dewormer for dogs, on a range of Non Small-Cell Lung cancer cell lines. Per my reply to your earlier reply to me here, there's nothing in that Nature paper that's relevant to CLL, a B cell Non-Hodgkin's Lymphoma healthunlocked.com/cllsuppo...

Neil

[Hidden]

Checkout Florida Sharkman and Contraband Cures. They advocate the use of ivermectin, fenbendazole, doxycycline etc. to cure many sorts of cancers and have developed various protocols. Anti-viral protocol and protocol B is recommended for CLL. I have completed one month of the Anti-viral protocol and got bloodwork on the insistence of my physician who was concerned I would damage my body being on the protocols. Got blood work done - Dr called me and said my blood test results were excellent - white blood cell count dropped by half in one month and I have noticed my lymph nodes decreasing in size.

[AussieNeil Partner Administrator in reply to Hidden]

RoosterRoo,

Welcome to our community. I note that you have just joined today.

Perhaps you can share some more about your CLL diagnosis and journey? You might also find our pinned posts section healthunlocked.com/cllsuppo... will help you better understand how to live long and well with CLL, including this post about how to more accurately measure changes in your blood tumour level. healthunlocked.com/cllsuppo...

You'll then appreciate that it's quite possible for your WBC to go down while your CLL actually worsens. We need to monitor trends in our Absolute Lymphocyte Count (ALC), which more accurately measures the CLL in our blood, not our WBC. Even our ALC can halve over a month, only to later increase. See the attached monthly plots of 21 early stage CLL patients.

The papers referenced on the site you mentioned have been previously discussed earlier in this post and in the replies to this post healthunlocked.com/cllsuppo... They aren't CLL specific studies.

CLL being such a heterogeneous illness, you need a randomly assigned double blind controlled trial to determine whether any changes are statistically meaningful and not just due to chance. Hopefully you have seen an improvement in your CLL, but don't be surprised if longer term, more accurate measurement doesn't see a sustained improvement.

Neil

Lymphocyte counts can jump around markedly month by month with CLL

[Hidden in reply to AussieNeil]

FYI - my lymphocyte count dropped by 40% in one month.

[AussieNeil Partner Administrator in reply to Hidden]

I hope your lymphocyte count stays low. I've had big drops too, some over 60%, only to be followed by bounce backs. It's trends that we need to observe.

[Hidden]

My brother is a pharmacist and you sound just like him….says the COVID vaccine is safe and effective and says ivermectin is horse paste and should not be taken by humans….seems like this site is monitored/operated by big Pharma so I won’t post any more. Have a nice day.

[AussieNeil Partner Administrator in reply to Hidden]

Ivermectin, fenbendazole and doxycycline are all made by pharmaceutical companies.

The moderation team for this community are all volunteers who support an evidence based approach to living well with CLL. There's no monitoring or other influence of the content by pharmaceutical companies. See our About page for more information: healthunlocked.com/cllsuppo...

I'm sure many members will be interested in your progress and you are welcome to provide details of your CLL history, prognostic markers and trends in your blood counts, nodes, etc. This link takes you to the edit page: healthunlocked.com/profile/...

The iwCLL Guidelines, Table 4, summarises the requirements for Complete Remission (CR), Partial Remission (PR), Progressive Disease (PD) and Stable Disease (SD). ashpublications.org/blood/a...

Of note, stable disease with respect to circulating lymphocyte count is a "Change of −49% to +49%", so your ALC change is still within the stable disease range. With respect to Lymph nodes, a CR requires "None ≥1.5 cm" and PR a "Decrease ≥50% (from baseline)*".

ashpublications.org/blood/a...

Neil

[cajunjeff in reply to Hidden]

Your brother sounds like a smart guy, as Neil is. Neil has cll, as do most all the people who volunteer their time to provide a place for us with cll to gather information about our disease and exchange experiences. Neil takes a lot of time and effort to respond to people and has helped countless people on here cope with their cll and learn how to be proactive in treating it.

Your statement that Neil and the other volunteers benefit from big Pharma is as unfounded as your dangerous assertion that ivermectin treats cancer. Your accusation demeans all the good people on here, fighting cll themselves, who volunteer their time to help others by moderating this site.

Neil responded in typical fashion, disregarding the personal dig, and providing you with helpful and factual info. FWIW, I am not a moderator and certainly not affiliated with big pharma, be it the big pharma that makes cll drugs or the big pharma that makes horse parasite drugs. And I lack Neil’s diplomacy. I am grateful to the moderators who keep things civil and science based on here. It’s not a site for everybody, you are not the first to leave, although maybe the first to leave after resurrecting a 4 yr old post to bring up the tired ivermectin debate. Hopefully you can find some sort of cll site for you where people share their stories of being treated with ivermectin. Have a nice day too.

[bagelstreet225 in reply to cajunjeff]

Well said!!