Song and Dance ?: I was thinking of the... - Atrial Fibrillati...

Atrial Fibrillation Support

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Song and Dance ?

saulger profile image
60 Replies

I was thinking of the best way to celebrate my eight month anniversary since my WMM (Wolf Mini Maze) in Tokyo by Dr Ohtsuka at the NewHeart Watanabe Hospital.

I am still in NSR (normal sinus rhythm) and my divorce from AFib is finalised. As our friend Jim knows, I went a little mad (as you do) when at 6 months post-Op and caused a stomach/diaphragm issue, which thankfully went away after taking PPI medication for 28 days.

What can I say. I've had some ten approaches from people (including from the UK) interested in the procedure which is not readily available in their home country. In a few weeks eight folks will have followed me to Tokyo for the procedure.

If you recall, I had a very easy surgery and recovery. After the first day I did not require any pain-killers and did not feel that I just had heart surgery. The scars were eight small punctures, four on either side of the chest, and have mostly gone by now (just two dots more noticeable on the right side). I stayed in Tokyo for four weeks after the surgery (Covid days) and on the day that I left Japan for Greece, I walked 10-12 Kms along the Sumida river in 2 hours :30 minutes.

I am at peace with my heart. Hardly ever check rate and rhythm. Can imbibe G&T and coffee (all moderately), can exercise every day at 550 Kcal/hr with heart reaching 120 by the end of a 45 minute stint. I can walk uphill here in Athens even in the crazy heat that we are having. The heart is very steady even if the other bits of the body are creaky.

You may remember that the hospital is appointed like a boutique hotel, with luxurious private rooms. The food is artistically prepared and beautifully balanced as all things Japanese. The staff were amazing with their electronic translators and they check up on you many times a day (you can sleep till 08:00).

Finally the travel from Europe is long and may include a lengthy stop-over. The cost is reasonable (I don't know how they do it) at just 18,000 EUR for everything: travel, accommodation, pre-Op tests, surgery, recovery, 2 follow-up surgeon visits, food and entertainment). I went alone and was lucky to get good deals on the hotel and the EUR/YEN exchange rate.

Let me end by quoting Anders, from Finland, who just had his surgery a few days ago.

I send my love to you all and wish us all an Afib-free life and the freedom and peace that we crave.

Saul

**********************

Anders from Finland today:

"Here is a summary of my stay at NewHeart Watanabe in Tokyo. It is a bit long but I wanted to document this completely, hopefully it helps someone like other stories here helped me in April when I first heard about Wolf MiniMaze and Wolf Ohtsuka Procedure.

I am 62 years old and I have suffered from paroxysmal afib over 25 years, 2 times per week on average so well over 2000 episodes, typically 65-95 bpm while in afib. Typical set of drugs: flecainide that luckily still gets me out of the afib episodes (normally takes 3 hours - 2 days), Eliquis as blood thinner etc. Afib has affected my life in a tremendously negative way, for instance no fun with any sport when heart is in afib so much. For whatever reason, my heart has not gone into persistent afib which according to Dr Ohtsuka is highly unusual considering my afib started so many years ago. An added complication is the fact that I have persistent LSVC, a structural anomaly that about 0.5 % of the population has. LSVC is a common trigger of afib and it makes it less likely that cathether ablations would work. I have had 3 ablations (2009, 2010 and 2022) and they all failed miserably: back in afib within 36 hours after each one: apparently ablations can't treat the LSVC effectively, at least not for me.

Through a remarkable coincidence I found out about ************* in late April of this year. He directed me to Dr Ohtsuka, to this group and I found out about Dr Wolf, watched the YouTube videos and read the posts here. I have lone afib (no other medical issues) and it appears to be vagal afib so the Wolf MiniMaze/Wolf Ohtsuka Procedure should be a great match for this problem.

At home in Finland from the doctors it was "get used to the idea that it will become persistent afib" and this is just absolutely awful advice: I do not want to get used to this so Dr Ohtsuka was clearly my last hope. Since he has had patients with LSVC and he has been able to help them I was optimistic before I came here that he may be able to fix this once and for all. The prospect of suffering with this for the rest of my life was unbearable.

Came to Japan on the 16th, to the hospital on the 18th (for all the tests, CT-scans, X-rays etc). There has been zero problems communicating with the extremely friendly nurses using the Google Translate phone app. Surgery was last Thursday (20th), I woke up around 11:30 after surgery and surprisingly had almost no pain, this also surprised the doctors and the nurses a great deal. I had read that many in this group have reported severe pain right after surgery. Now when I write this, 105 hours later everything has progressed extremely smoothly and I am in perfect sinus rhythm since the surgery. I am very sensitive to irregular heartbeats (25 years of experience...) but I have not been able to detect a single irregular heartbeat during this time which is astonishing considering that my heart has not been in continuous NSR even 70 hours this whole year before a new afib episode has begun. Clearly something changed with the surgery.

A couple of times I have had a feeling that "now afib is starting". Before surgery if I felt this, I could immediately measure my pulse and find irregular heartbeats. However, now when this happens and I measure the pulse: it is completely regular! So perhaps whatever signal normally triggers my afib now runs into the "barriers created by Dr Ohtsuka" (or whatever the correct terminology is) and never manages to start an afib episode. It would be interesting to hear if anyone else has felt something similar after surgery.

So although it is still very early, it sure looks like I am getting my life back and don't have to suffer with this any longer, truly, truly amazing. I just can't believe it quite yet...

I will check out from the hospital two days from now, on Wednesday, come back for a meeting with Dr Ohtsuka next Monday and fly back home to Finland on Wednesday the 2nd of August, 9 days earlier than originally planned.

So right now I am so thankful:

- that I by accident found out about *********, this Facebook group, Dr Wolf and Dr Ohtsuka

- for this absolutely phenomenal hospital and the fantastic staff: for instance all nurses are UNBELIEVABLY friendly and take such great care of you.

- most of all I am thankful for the incredible surgeon Dr Ohtsuka who seems to have fixed my afib problem and altered my life forever

Generally in life, there are not that many people that manage to do what Dr Ohtsuka and Dr Wolf have done: with their unique method and skill they truly make the world a better place. That's the highest honor you can get.

Dr Ohtsuka, nurses, my physiotherapist, other doctors: I will never forget what you did for me so THANK YOU from the bottom of my heart! "

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saulger
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60 Replies
MummyLuv profile image
MummyLuv

So so pleased for you Saul and equally as pleased that for those unable to access NHS treatment in the UK where private is not affordable there is a more affordable option in Tokyo. 💕

saulger profile image
saulger in reply to MummyLuv

Thank you, Alison. We were so lucky that our shared research led us to where we are today. Hugs to you and the family.

4chickens profile image
4chickens

congratulations Saul, and thank you for all the support you offer others. Tokyo is a reasonable priced option for folks who can’t access appropriate treatment via the nhs or don’t have private health care.

saulger profile image
saulger in reply to 4chickens

Thank you, Carole. I am so grateful that at my ripe old age (how did this happen?), I can do the small things that bring me pleasure, such as walking. swimming, rowing.

Megams profile image
Megams in reply to saulger

~Wow how awesome is that!!

Like winning a lottery in such a positive sense. Wish we had this in NZ or I would consider even flying to OZ if available - stay well and may love and light continue to surround you in the days ahead~

saulger profile image
saulger in reply to Megams

Thank you Megams. Actually, I followed Lynn Whiting who is from NZ. Her AFib was causing her heart to fail and now, almost a year after her procedure in Tokyo, she is in NSR and good ejection fraction. Thank you and all the best wishes to you.

Megams profile image
Megams in reply to saulger

Oh wow - how can I find her please?

My PVI cryoablation Feb 2022 did not last distance - presently holding my own with usual meds until Holter monitor study mid August. Any feedback appreciated indeed~

saulger profile image
saulger in reply to Megams

Megams, facebook.com/search/top?q=l...

Megams profile image
Megams in reply to saulger

~Thank you so much and sorry for the delay in this response - found her :) Ever so grateful ~ :) :) :)

Corkel profile image
Corkel

congratulations Saul and I would like to thank you and Alison for sharing all the information with us about this procedure.

You’ve been so much help and answered so many of my questions. I too as you know will be on my way to Tokyo in January for the same procedure.

Had you not shared any of this I would not have known anything about it.

Best wishes

Donna

saulger profile image
saulger in reply to Corkel

Dear Donna. The list of us "Eastern travellers" is ever expanding. We are nearly the "amazing dozen". I wish us all freedom from AFib.

Poochmom profile image
Poochmom in reply to Corkel

it was because of this group that I too found out about this procedure through a post Bambi had made here. I am eternally grateful and wish you the very best on your journey through this. You are in the best hands!!!!

Corkel profile image
Corkel in reply to Poochmom

Thank you for your kind reply poochmom. It’s been so helpful with everyone sharing their experiences and all the advice given. Did you have your procedure Houston or Tokyo? I’m a little worried but need to be rid of this afib.

Best wishes

Donna

Poochmom profile image
Poochmom in reply to Corkel

I had mine in Houston, but the stories seem to be the same for both locations, right down to the quality of the hospital and the care given. It’s easier said than done but there is nothing to be nervous about. I would do it all over again without hesitation. It is hard for me to believe I had heart surgery as it was so uneventful. Everyone is different though. You have tons of support in the group. You’ve got this!!!

Corkel profile image
Corkel in reply to Poochmom

Thank you

Wonderful news! Makes my heart so happy to hear! My husband is abt a month away from his 1 year anniversary and thriving in NSR as well! God Bless these great doctors, this forum where I found out about Dr Wolf & his WMM and Bambi & MummyLuv & all the fabulous people here who helped us, and God Bless you Saul! Thank you for posting an update! 🙏🤍✨ Sending prayers for your heart to stay strong & steady from Texas! ❤️‍🩹

saulger profile image
saulger in reply to

Same here. The AFA forum led me to the WMM group and MummyLuv (Alison) and me researched all options and decided that a mini-maze was the best option for us. Congratulations to you on the first year anniversary.

mjames1 profile image
mjames1

Glad you're doing so well, Saul!

Jim

saulger profile image
saulger in reply to mjames1

Thanks, Jim. I hope that your ablation is holding and you recovered well. All the best. Saul

CDreamer profile image
CDreamer

Pleased you are doing well.

saulger profile image
saulger in reply to CDreamer

Thank you very much. I joined the AFA four years ago, and it took me three years to take the plunge. I hope that you are keeping well. All the best. Saul

Ppiman profile image
Ppiman

Good, as ever, to read your posts, Saul!

Steve

saulger profile image
saulger in reply to Ppiman

Hi Steve, I don't have much to add as the months tick by. I am doing well and still "alive" as confirmed by The Hollies. I hope that you are keeping well and the "comma police" can see some improvements in written English (live in hope).

Best wishes from dusty and musty Athens.

Poochmom profile image
Poochmom

woohoo Saul! What a fabulous story! I tip my hand to you and I also enjoy an AFib and medication free life since a year ago June. Here is to all who desire this procedure, that they may be able to obtain it!

saulger profile image
saulger in reply to Poochmom

Thank you very much. Since yesterday I had some 50 "alerts", which is a good sign that folks are interested. For me it was a complete coincidence and good fortune. I saw the post about the mini-maze on the AFA forum, I joined the WMM FB group and, together with MummyLuv (Alison), weighed all the places where to go. Congratulations to you on your anniversary.

My next project is for a fund to help folks who can't do it alone !

secondtry profile image
secondtry

That's great news Saul and thank you for being so generous with your time providing that all important detail. I have saved your post for when the time comes.

saulger profile image
saulger in reply to secondtry

Thank you very much and my next project is for a fund to help folks who can't do it alone !

secondtry profile image
secondtry in reply to saulger

Brilliant innovation!

pusillanimous profile image
pusillanimous

Wonderful, at the moment my AF is not a problem, but if it becomes one, I have a relative who lives in Tokyo, I might have to arrange a holiday with him and his family !!!!!

saulger profile image
saulger in reply to pusillanimous

I had a very easy time and so did Anders from Finland. Women have slightly more painful recovery, I was told. Good luck and I also had a holiday in Tokyo with a procedure thrown in...

bassets profile image
bassets

How fab! Best wishes for the future !

saulger profile image
saulger in reply to bassets

Thank you, thank you, thank you ! All the best.

Ossie7 profile image
Ossie7

so good to hear this positive story Saul . I’m relatively new to the forum but not to AF as had for 6 years now . Currently in sinus awaiting my 3rd ablation as 2 previously failed and I was back in persistent AF until cardioverted yet again . Your post gives me hope for the future as I could combine surgery with seeing my brother who remarkably lives in Tokyo !

Were you well enough post surgery to do any sight seeing out of Tokyo ?

Amanda

saulger profile image
saulger in reply to Ossie7

Amanda, I had the easiest of time. After a painful first day, I never needed any pain-killers.

When I left the hospital, a week after the procedure, I checked into the hotel and walked 3 kms along the Sumida river. I went out every day and walked around Tokyo and museums for miles. Time to visit your brother !!!

Ossie7 profile image
Ossie7 in reply to saulger

that is just wonderful !!! So happy for you x

waveylines profile image
waveylines

Saul I am sooooooo delighted that you continue to do so well & have indeed flourished. I think the current extreme heat in Athens is a true test to the amazing surgery you have had.I can't thankyou and Mummyluv enough for both informing of us of this amazing proceedure and sharing your knowkedge. Until I knew about this my pathway option was medication that is no long managing my P-Afib well, a pathway to deterioration as my Afib was induced by medical treatment. Now I too await a mini maze op.... Hopefully in a couple of months am told.

I'm so grateful to you both for flagging this up and sharing your own personal experiences. Two very brave people. Thank you thank you!!

I wish you many long years of heart happiness staying NSR free. ❤️❤️

saulger profile image
saulger in reply to waveylines

Thank you for your lovely wishes. I was just as fortunate to read Bambi's story and to then follow it up and to finally take the plunge. A bit of good fortune !!!

Bodydoctor12 profile image
Bodydoctor12

Thanks for the update Saul,

What wonderful news - music to my ears. I’m still in NSR post CV but if/when it returns I’ll be heading East.

Keep on keeping on,

Mary

saulger profile image
saulger in reply to Bodydoctor12

Thank you Mary. There have been a few AFA folks to Tokyo already and I will not steal their thunder. Jenny promised to tell her story when she gets back from Tokyo. I hope that your NSR will last and you will not need this procedure. All the best. Saul

Bodydoctor12 profile image
Bodydoctor12 in reply to saulger

Thanks Saul, to you and Alison for all the support and informatIon. I’m hoping this lasts a while as I’m enjoying the feeling of returning to ‘normalcy’ if only for a interim period without the horrid side effects from the drugs blighting my every day, worse than my Afib symptoms tbh.

Onwards……

saulger profile image
saulger in reply to Bodydoctor12

I hope it holds, Mary. No medication is wonderful and you can now plan ahead for good things to undertake. Best wishes and please keep us posted. S

Brandue profile image
Brandue

I have an appointment for surgery with Dr. Wolf in Houston Texas on the 20th of Sept. I suffer from proximal afib and have been since 2012. I too am lucky that it converts on its own. I'm getting episodes every 2 to 3 weeks and can last about 4 hours but as long as 12. I feel this is my only chance to live a normal life since I had 2 failed ablations and refuse to get another. Afib controls me now and is always on my mind, but I am going to put that in the past. I'm happy you are doing well.

saulger profile image
saulger in reply to Brandue

From what I know and heard, paroxysmal AFib is vagally induced and very easy to put right with a mini-maze. Dr Ohtsuka makes eight very small punctures (four either side of the chest) and does the whole procedure in 1 hour, including the removal of the LAA (left atrial appendage). Thank you for your wishes and I found the whole experience to be painless (after the first day) and just mildly taxing (tiredness and weakness). Good Luck !!!

Brandue profile image
Brandue in reply to saulger

Thank you, and I will post my results.

saulger profile image
saulger in reply to Brandue

LAA removed

LAA
Teresa156 profile image
Teresa156 in reply to saulger

Does that mean Saul, that you don’t need anti coagulants by having that removed?

saulger profile image
saulger in reply to Teresa156

Yes, Teresa. Removing or clipping shut the LAA reduces the stroke risk by 97%, whereas an anti-coagulant reduces the risk by 60%. I am on zero medications now.

Teresa156 profile image
Teresa156 in reply to saulger

Thanks Saul,

That’s great news. I wish you all the very best.

JOY2THEWORLD49 profile image
JOY2THEWORLD49

Hi

All the best as you continue your journey free of AF.

I'm hoping mine may disappear of its own accord.

Thyroid Papillary Cancer caused AF but I suffered a stroke Embolic.

Keeo letting us know that you continue to be on the up and up.

cheri jOY. 74. (MZ)

Song and Dance of the cured sound great.

saulger profile image
saulger in reply to JOY2THEWORLD49

Thank you very much Cheri. I hope that your AFib will indeed settle of its own accord and you will not need any surgery. All the best to you and good wishes. Saul

Mrsvemb profile image
Mrsvemb

It’s so good to hear of your continued enjoyment of NSR. Long may it continue.

I have been following your journey and also that of Alison and 4chickens.

I have been referred to Mr Hunter on the basis that I cannot tolerate any of the medication. I haven't had any ablations, no point, because I would still need to take the medication. In fact recently, my AF is much more frequent and lasting for days on end. 🤞crossed.

saulger profile image
saulger in reply to Mrsvemb

Good luck with Mr Hunter. His procedure is "belt and braces" and can't be bettered. I hope that he will see you soon and you will join our little club. Best wishes and good luck.

Jalia profile image
Jalia

Very best wishes to you Saul. What an adventure!

saulger profile image
saulger in reply to Jalia

Thank you. It was an adventure that fell into place very naturally. I was too scared to commit to a date, met a lady from Greece who wanted to go together (earlier than I intended), she dropped out and I had mine !

Best wishes and good luck.

2018NSR profile image
2018NSR

this report just makes me smile. So happy for you my friend. 5 years for me. No afib, no medications and no pacemaker they told me was my ONLY other option.

saulger profile image
saulger in reply to 2018NSR

Thank you, Sandi. Congratulations on you five year anniversary. Saul

waveylines profile image
waveylines in reply to 2018NSR

This is joy to me ears. So good to hear from others who have been through this proceedure. And it's fantastic to hear a pacemaker has been avoided. Brilliant news.....

2018NSR profile image
2018NSR in reply to waveylines

Thank you Wavylines. I feel I have been given the next best thing to a cure. No one has a crystal ball but I plan to rival patients Dr Wolf has who have been afib free and no meds for 19 years. There is hope and more Drs are now learning this procedure.

Teresa156 profile image
Teresa156

Hi Saul,

I am so pleased for you - it proves there is hope for this ‘affliction’ we all have. You are looking very well - and what a great story too from Anders.

I wish you lots of health and happiness.

Teresa

saulger profile image
saulger in reply to Teresa156

Thank you Teresa. I wish you good health and no AFib.

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