Magnesium and virapamol

[Suntanann]

My cardiologist said not to take vitamin and mineral supplements as they interact with the medicines ? Everybody on here seems to swear by them though ? Any advice ...?

[jeanjeannie50]

What tablets are you prescribed?

[EngMac in reply to jeanjeannie50]

Many doctor have minimal knowledge about supplements. Studies are seldom done maybe because huge fortunes cannot be made like can be made on drugs. Ask what knowledge the doctor has about supplements. Most don’t know how to test for deficiencies that can be remedied by taking supplements. Great examples are magnesium and vitamin C. Magnesium is often given in the ER when you have heart issues.

[Suntanann in reply to jeanjeannie50]

Verapamil .40mg 4 times a day

[jeanjeannie50 in reply to Suntanann]

Hopefully, some members who take Verapamil will respond.

[Paulbounce]

Hi Sun.

I hope all is good with you. Great news today - the sun is out (here anyway). Need some rain though to water the plants.

Now then - to answer your question. You wrote

"My cardiologist said not to take vitamin and mineral supplements as they interact with the medicines ? Everybody on here seems to swear by them though ? Any advice ...?"

Your cardio knows far more than I. So I would take his / her advice. Google interactions between the med's you are on and taking vit's etc.

Just be totally clear about this. Your cardio is best to give advice so go with that. Personally I tend be cafeful - but I know I push the 'redline' sometimes - not a good idea though but it works for me.

I think you should follow your medic's guidance.

Have a great weekend.

Paul

[Auriculaire in reply to Paulbounce]

Given that this is not an opinion held by all cardiologists (ie the excellent Dr Gupta) taking this cardiologist's advice might well prevent Ann from taking a supplement that helps to reduce her afib burden ( as quite a few people here who take magnesium have reported). If my cardiologist said such a thing I would ask him to provide the studies that show this. Here in France we have just had a verdict in the trial of the drug company Servier for the promotion of their drug Mediator. This was a drug prescribed to diabetics and also off label for weight loss. It caused cardiovascular problems. It is reckoned to have killed at least 500 people and probably nearer 2000 and impaired the heart health of thousands of others. For the 30 years it was marketed not one professor of cardiology in the whole of the country made a stink about this drug . It was left to a brave pulmonologist in Brittany to blow the whistle and rather than be supported by the cardiology establishment after ripping the scales off their blind eyes she was attacked by them. The French equivalent of the MHRA was fined the maximum possible for negligence. Just because a doctor - even a specialist - says something it does not make it gospel. Another might have a completely different opinion. My gastroenterologist refuses to accept that Cipro causes the problems it does for some people. She is wrong.

[Paulbounce in reply to Auriculaire]

"Just because a doctor - even a specialist - says something it does not make it gospel"

Fair point and well written post. I guess we all take our medic's advise - sometimes without questioning it.

Maybe we should all do this a little more.

Paul

[Auriculaire in reply to Paulbounce]

It's difficult. In order to read up properly about whatever condition you have you need to be able to read and understand the sort of studies destined for doctors - and not just the abstracts which is what most doctors read if they bother to read new research at all. Most of practical medicine actually lags way behind scientific research. And there are conflicts of opinion among scientists and doctors alike. In the end we have to trust our instinct - we are the ones in our bodies and we know how they feel. This is not always reliable of course. Having been both helped and damaged by doctors I am very wary of just accepting what they say as gospel. When I go to see my doctor it is for a diagnosis ( he is very good on the whole ) but I have very little faith in the "arms" in his cupboard for fixing what is wrong with me.

[LizzieAFib in reply to Auriculaire]

Agree. I also have hypothyroidism and my GP did not give me any information about the condition, just pills. Thankfully I did my own research and learnt eg what to eat and not eat.

[Sparky143 in reply to Auriculaire]

AGREE 1000%!

[cindyrella in reply to Auriculaire]

Cipro is deadly for me!

[Sparky143 in reply to Paulbounce]

The cardiologists know know nothing except palliative measures, drugs and invasive procedures. I treat symptoms and test results, not people. They're clueless as to the root cause of AFIB even though there's an epidemic of AFIB in America and in Britain (from what I gather). They know nothing about the benefit of magnesium and taurine in heart rhythm problems and they know nothing about curing because they don't identify the root cause of these conditions and you cannot cure without knowing the root cause because a cure requires the correct remedy. you can arrive at the correct remedy until you have identify the root cause of the illness! Hello??!? This is how medicine used to be practiced before the AMA and Big Pharm tookover in America and it's how it needs to be now and if the cardiologists are failing us we need to absolutely do our own research outside of the allopathic model and try things that really work! And this is from someone who has been through 8 1/2 years of hell doing it the cardiologists way 10 cardio versions and an ablation and they still haven't fixed it not to mention all the toxic drugs!

This is a no brainer. Boost your electrolytes. Take the magnesium. Most people are deficient in magnesium and minerals anyway. They drain out very quickly during time of stress, an we are all of us living in a stress pot now. Magnesium cannot be accurately cannot be measured through a blood test ( there is another test that functional holistic natural pathic doctors will give you that will measure the amount of magnesium in the cells and that's the test that you want. )Good luck! May the force be with you!

[Hidden]

Well since a lot of supplements have the same effect as medication...lowering blood pressure thinning blood lower cholesterol and vasodilation yes they very much can interact with medications he's right. Chilli peppers do the same thing as " blood thinners" so if you had a chilli and a warfarin it would be like taking two warfarin instead of one. And since the cause of things like highbp and arythmias can be a vitimin or mineral deficiency taking them would negate your sysmtoms by addressing a cause which the drugs also do but by addressing a symptom. So you could spend years on drugs having surgeries and never find out you just needed more magnesium. Bevausr the symptoms have been masked or burnt away altogether from making a complaint. The heart complains the brains job is to work out what to do to help its needs. If the brain can't figure it out or doesn't know then it goes to a doctor who's got the symptom repressing medication that quietens the heart ..like taking out your low oil light ehich keeps blinking. Yay no more blinking. But still have no oil! And doctors brains have to assess what's everyone else doing? What will I get sued for? Which drug company paid for my lunch last week and what covers my ass. Not nessiarily thinking about what's best for you except to the extent he doesn't mess up by any " unknown factors" so safest for him to not have you on anything else that might interact and if he didn't tell you he'd be in trouble. But its your brain that makes the choice and your body that reaps the rewards or consequences ... It makes no sense to me that people be out directly on medications without investigating a possible cause. It makes no sense to me to take a medication that is helpful with side effects and long term costs when something else may be just as helpful have no side effects and have long term added benefits. But thats just how my brain works. Other peoples brains think the risk is best figured out by someone who had the money to get a medical degree. Since I know from experience many professionals from.mechanics to builders to plumbers have an infitinite capacity to mess up I don't trust anyone except myself. People seem overly afraid to miss a dose of medication but overly unconcerned with missing a dose of vital elements essential for bodily functioning. I don't relate to the discrepancy of applying the same logic to all essential vutal nutrients as to non vital optional interventions. Obviously at some points in time intervention is nessisary but I don't think it should be considered in isolation from all other things which are known to be factors relevant. And if a full range of interventions are not on the table which they often aren't due to costs or other factors like policy protocol restriction etc...and doctors do not have a full table available and different countries have different things on or off the tsble then I make my own table with the options from one table and others included. I might consider the table of the doctors to be of much more validity than say a table of options from an insufficient study and I would certainly be biased towards western scientific tables but I don't discount entirely anything which may be relevant ... Its hard work. But I see that as the function for which my brain has the most use in my life. Making choices. Assessing data. "All things considered, it would be best to....." Well all things can't be considered but at least the most common things must be considered. And considering people have been considering what are the mkst important things and quantifying them for a few hundred years we have a great many well considered things to avail of in making our own considered choices.

[jeanjeannie50]

Searching online I found the following:

Taking magnesium with these medications might cause blood pressure to go too low. Some of these medications include nifedipine (Adalat, Procardia), verapamil (Calan, Isoptin, Verelan), diltiazem (Cardizem), isradipine (DynaCirc), felodipine (Plendil), amlodipine (Norvasc), and others.

So, that's probably why your doctor said not to take any vitamin pills or mineral supplements alongside verapamil.

[Auriculaire in reply to jeanjeannie50]

Probably because magnesium itself lowers blood pressure. But this can be checked easily with a BP monitor. On this cardiologist's reasoning he might well have told her not to eat asparagus or scoff a lot of nuts.

[The_Lord_is_with_Us]

Doctors go to their books and drug charts for info. So can we.

[Dave0]

I was on verapamil whilst in persistent AF recently and took magnesium after lots of reading on here alongside my meds. Will continue taking it for the foreseeable too I think. My cardiologist wasn’t convinced it would be beneficial as others have mentioned but has also confirmed that he’s happy for me to keep taking it.

[Tomred]

Taking supplements is really something we have to monitor ourselves remembering our food contains vits and minerals etc so wouldnt these also potentially have an effect on meds the problem may be more to do the fillers and binders used in supplements I think so I'd try more organic brands if possible

[doodle68]

Hi Suntanann I told my EP that in adition to my medication I was taking a small dose of magnesium to supplement my diet and he said 'If you think it helps you fine go ahead' .We know from research that a deficiency of magnesium can effect the function of the heart so it makes sense to try to ensure we are not deficient .

I also take Vitamin D 3 on prescription.

I have never been a fan of supplements thinking a balanced diet should cover my needs and was shocked when diagnosed with a severe VD deficiency that was effecting my ability to walk. Some supplements can help to make sure we are not deficient .

[Auriculaire in reply to doodle68]

It is difficult to get enough vit D from diet. Our bodies are designed to make it from sunshine and as we age this process becomes less efficient. The main source being oily fish people living far from coasts would have been at abig disadvantage.

[LaceyLady]

Go on YouTube look for Dr Sanjay Gupta, York Cardiologist

[LaceyLady]

I have had Verapamil in the past, horrible medication, came off it. It caused more problems than my condition. Sorry I can’t be positive about it.

[LaceyLady]

You’re better asking your Cardiologist. I get much better advice. I asked my Consultant what can I expect from my GP, he said ‘if they’re brave, they can adjust medication’.

[KMRobbo]

I took magnesium whilst I was on Verapamil 120Mg mod release. Initially tool pills of magnesium glycinate, (if i remember correctly), but then I went to using magnesium oil spray prior to going to bed. It did not noticeably do anything for my P AFIB, but it did seem to help me sleep so I carried on! I also took cod liver oil and Omega 3 pills whilst on Verapamil 120 Mg.

I am not medically trained, but had no problems with any of this.

I was looking for a magnesium miracle when I started taking it, but that did not happen, so presumably my magnesium levels were not causing my PAF.

[tabletphobic]

I was advised to ask the pharmacist as they can see what medications you're on and any interactions. I was told the pharmacist ( not the assistants ) know more than even the doctors regarding interactions. I asked mine and was told it was ok to take with the meds I'm on

[Rosemaryb1349]

I have been taking mag taurate and vit D3 alongside my 120 mg verapamil slow release tablets for a couple of years now. No noticeable side effects, my Afib and Flutter have remained at bay and at my recent health check my BP was fine and liver and kidney functions OK, only fly in the ointment was slightly raised cholesterol which I am addressing through diet not statins. Hope this helps.

[xr1450]

You should probably ask him for the clinical evidence behind that statement as most vitamins and minerals are allegedly found in a healthy diet in abundance..

[gokf]

When I was in hospital recently I was tested for my magnesium level and told it was ok. I asked the question about supplements and was told that it needs to be confirmed if your level is ok. Advised it was not good to take unless you need the level to be correct. Also he said that if you need magnesium it is better to eat foods that contain magnesium rather than supplements.

[Dee5165]

Hi,I have been in persistent Afib since January. On Sotalol and Eliquis. Had a Cardioversion March 26 and back in Afib 2 weeks later. I have done more research and reviewed more data and studies than most. Unfortunately the Sotalol side effects were killing me more than the Afib and Flutter. Since Doctors usually only diagnose and treat Afib with meds, and there does not seem to be a cure without drastic means or surgeries, I decided to reduce meds and add supplements. My research indicated that Magnesium is fine to take as long as it is taken 2 hours before or after other meds. I now take Wild Salmon Oil, Magnesium and Hawthorn Berry as Supplements. Have been doing this for a short time but will continue for a month or so. Bottom line is the severity of my symptoms have already been reduced!!!

[Dee5165]

Also forgot to mention I take Vitamin D3 with Magnesium, Wild Alaskan fish Oil, and Hawthorn Berry.

[Hidden]

when I asked my EP about supplements he said it’s fine to take them x

[EngMac]

Often the test for magnesium only checks what is in the blood which is 1% of what the body requires. All cells need magnesium. I cannot remember the name of the test that checks this. My GP did not know about the cells and did not know about the test. And he did not offer to find out where to get it. And I have been going to this guy for 45 years. You would think, just may be, he would try to find out since I gave him the info on the test. I think part of the issue is our Canadian health care does not do the test and does not pay for having it done elsewhere so doctors don't waste their time trying to change the "system".

[Cookie24]

I use the interactions checker on this website: drugs.com/

[Poochmom]

Good day to you. I take magnesium every day to calm my heart. It is very important for the heart and the chronic Lyme disease I suffer from takes magnesium out of me. Before I take any supplement or herb however I research them and see what the drug interactions are. You can find it very easily. There are some I cannot take because of blood thinners and also others because if interactions. But I agree that most doctors do t have a clue about herbs or supplements. I do my own research!

[Sparky143]

like they know anything about magnesium or any other supplements for that matter. Absolutely take magnesium and I would recommend taking Taurine as well recommended I take 2000 mg three times a day of Taurine i'm going to do it!I lost 7 1/2 months in normal rhythm after my ablation. Last week I had my 10th cardioversion last night my heart went out of rhythm again I'm not sure if his atrial flutter or for bloody fib but it makes me feel weak and I'm terribly discouraged. I'm here on in I'm following my intuition and leaving no stone unturned in finding a solution to this torturous problem and I wish everyone the very best and normal sinus rhythm forever!

[cuore in reply to Sparky143]

Dear Sparky143, I feel your pain and am with you in experiencing it. Unless I have read our post incorrectly, you have had one ablation and 10 cardioversions with the last one lasting one week. May I suggest that you find out, unless you already know, what parts of the atria were ablated? Sometimes you will continue to get AF because there is a reconnection. Sometimes there is such a swelling during the first ablation if the ablation is extensive, that there may be an area that may not have been totally ablated. Sometimes extensive ablation can cause an arrhythmia development. What I am trying to say is that to find a solution to you tortuous problem, you might want to evaluate at what stage you are at.

You also say you are not sure. It would be wide to invest in an ECG monitor like a Kardia to have more of a handle on your episodes.

There is hope in better techniques being developed. The latest one is Pulsed Field Ablation which is now being trialed. I am not sure whether it can be used on patient who have already had an ablation, but apparently, it can be used for the posterior wall.

I love your spunk of "leaving no stone unturned." I follow the same philosophy.

[Sparky143 in reply to cuore]

Thank you. In hell at the moment. I feel much sicker with atrial flutter than I did with a fib and I feel much sicker since I had the ablation. I feel altered. Your suggestions are all good. I need a new cardiologist although I am seeing the guy who did the ablation on Thursday and I will discuss it with him but I'm not in a hurry to let him touch me again given the way I ended up. Thanks a lot for your kind suggestions.

[LaceyLady]

Ps Dr Sanjay Gupta has a video on YouTube about the types of magnesium.