I have been having significant bone pain in my shoulder that keeps me awake at night. I thought that maybe I was just being a hypochondriac and assuming that every ache or pain was due to "my cancer". Or maybe I fell but forgot about it. Well it has been getting a lot worse and I just had a PSMA scan in anticipation of Pluvicto.
It is quite clear that there is a lot of uptake throughout much of my left shoulder. Nice to know that my PC is PSMA avid but the amount of involvement is pretty scary. Also had an other PSA test just one month after the last and it is still increasing at a 1 month or less doubling rate. Now at 36.65.
I can tolerate the pain during the day it is just an annoyance maybe a level 5 or so. But at night it keeps me awake constantly trying to find a comfortable position of which there really is none.
I had been taking morphine when the pain was less and it seemed to be effective. I took it only at night and just 15 mg for a while and then graduated to 30 mg again just at night with rare exceptions. So I don't think I am addicted or should be requiring larger does but it is not really doing anything to help with the pain.
Any suggestions as to how to reduce the pain and get some sleep?
I have lidocaine patches and am trying one right now but it does not seem to do anything. Is bone pain just difficult to relieve?
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might try the floor but i feel the pain no matter if head or other parts are supported or not. i have the world's best mattress, the one that the King of England sleeps on. I bought it a long time ago when it was maybe $500 not $6000
That's your problem, you're sleeping with the King............ Try sleeping with the Queen, that just may do the trick........(Sorry couldn't bypass a setup like that - Humor is in my DNA).
yes where have you been? Lizzy died a while ago. here son Charles is the King he is the one who sleeps on a mcroskey.com/ mattress made in San Francisco under Market street
Well I'll be a unkeys moncle..........Did you participate in the funeral.....by demonstrating how to make love to someone's' sister on a King Size mcroskey.com mattress made in a market in the streets of San Francisco? If you did, can you send me a copy of your autograph....(not the sheets or pillows)....
And all this time I though you were Chinese..............not with that autograph you're not...Come to think of it, it could be short (note I don't use the dirty word abbreviate like in DNA) for Lee......... Oh yes I put it in my Safe Sex Safe...........Next to those little rubber bags I used when I was young and stupid as opposed to now, old and stupid.....
She was well preserved when she was alive so who knows. Wanna have a competition for one liners? I have come up with a few good ones lately. How about this one. At the local (under the radar) farmer's market, Thia was castrating a little baby pig. Everyone was watching intently. She threw one testicle to my Poodle which he enjoyed immensely. As soon as she was done I said in my most barberly voice "next" !!! Got a few chuckles.
You took the wind out of my sails.....A few days ago I was telling "da boss" that if we ever had another offspring we should name him/her NEXT..... (I also though of the name "OKAYWHO'SNEXT" but that's pushing it a bit, don't you think?).
How many offspring do you have already? I some times name my variables with sequential numbers which gets pretty confusing. What if Next is not the last?
you need to ask Elon about names he can come up with something. if you buy a Tesla I am sure he will feel obligated to name your children. Do you still have working reproductive parts?
Even though I'm not a Tesla owner, but drive a "Ronsoni" (Italian sports car) that Elton loves, he picked names for me anyway: for my daughter he chose "Duesenberg" and he picked the name "Studebaker" for my son. He said he chose those names since he got such a charge out of them.... I though he would choose the names AC and DC. But what do I know?
however Elon does change his mind now and then, the model 3 uses a motor that is called DC by some. None of these are conventional brush type or true induction motors. So did Elon change his mind? More of a semantic issue.
So he didn't like it direct?........ I guess he was a "beat around the bush" kind of guy...I was in the Army with those types, eventually most received a DD.
Offensive? "long live the queen!" Most Americans don't find that cheer / wish offensive.... No wonder you guys drive on the wrong side of the road.....do you suggest we cheer out "Early demise for the Queen?".....
I think he might have been referring to my lack of interest in sleeping with a cadaver. The threads are so hard to follow especially since they override (sort of in an inconsistent way, this must be a bug it could not be by design) time of entry. It would be nice if you could view the posts by time order instead of only by thread. Even my email programs lets you disable threads if you hate them. The only way to easily find a recent post in a big mess of threads is to copy text from the email notification and use find in page to find it.
I don't think it was the "Queen'" cadaver post he was annoyed at...It's my guess that it was the "long live remark by wonder boy........Anyway that's water under the London bridge. I do believe you were correct in saying we have the same DNA in someways. You are a detailed guy as well as I am..... I hate that about myself.... cause I lose a lot of enjoyment just focusing on details.... (details and more details). This website (now I have to whisper)........ leaves a lot to be desired, but hey what do we expect if all day they're concentrating on a Queens longevity. I was/am an old Mainframe computer programmer/analysist who was involved in the whole process of batch programming. I am a dinosaur and even have scars to prove it. I find get arounds in this system for researching and retrieving old relevant posts..... Many of these post, I send to users to aid in their research and questions regarding their health..... Okay that's enough BS about me now it's back to general humor.....As slugs say goodbye to each other "inch by inch".............
The reason they drive on the wrong side of the road is because their cars have the steering wheel on the wrong side of the car. Some people drive in the middle, there is no hope for fixing that.
Middle of the road is okay as long as they don't move off of the middle white line.
Ever try driving an on the floor stick shift automobile (when the gear shift lever is on the outside of your left leg) and shifting with your left hand while you're driving from the right seat? Not to mention "out the window" hand signals with your right hand and/or the need to step on the gas/brake/clutch (not simultaneously, but understood why).
i had a 1967 Land Rover but it was left drive so no problem. My 1967 Landcruiser has three on the tree so no problem there either. We live on a dirt road and it is not uncommon to have people drive in the middle of the road, no white or yellow lines and most people have no clue how wide their cars are or where the road it so they just choose the middle
Ah, So they use pebbles in dirt roads as their white lines...... American ingenuity can't beat it...........It gave us the word "woke" whatever the shit that means.......
Note: For many years, the Land Rover has been listed at the bottom of the list of "woke" cars whatever the shit that means.............
I have had a LOT of pain from many broken bones, including a shoulder. My PCP prescribed a pain reliever for me called Diclofenac, 75 mg, DR (delayed release). For me, it is an excellent pain reliever and one pill seems to last 48 hours or so. Prior to that I was taking Oxy for two months and I needed it for the pain. Diclofenac is a NSAID so is in the same class as advil, etc. Thankfully, I'm on the mend after a year and only take one, possibly two of the pills a week. I think you should give it a try.
unfortunately diclofenac can interfere with peeing. i tried lidocaine patch and it did n ot work, i have diclefenac patch which i will try next it is not likely to interfere with peeing but i did not thin it would work am going to try it now thanks for the suggestion
It never seemed to interfere with my peeing but everybody reacts differently. With my insurance, it is cheap. It might be worth a try. I also have the diclofenac gel but it was about as effective as kissing my sister, didn't seem to do anything.
my sisters are on the other coast. i have diclofenac pills gel patches and am trying the patch right now and it does seem to help
it was some doc who said the NSAIDs can interfere with peeing but my peeing is OK for now and i think that the path or gel will not do that.
shoulder does feel a little better to the point that i might be able to sleep tonight. nees to get a script for the patches when i see my primary on monday. i inherited the ones i have from my step mother
You can also get diclofenac gel sold under the brand name Voltaren, but be sure to read the instructions and the warnings carefully. It is not intended for long term use.
My husband has bone pain in the leg and knee area where he had a left leg femur break and surgeon put in rods. He has severe arthritis in both knees as well. He had cortisone injections in both knees last month and it really helped with the arthritis pain. He heard a pop when he was chasing a chipmunk out of our house a few weeks ago and now he has been in pain every since. We see the surgeon that performed the surgery tomorrow after X-rays. Hopefully he did not do damage to the rod and nails in that leg. He takes one extra strength Tylenol or hrdrophone pill a couple times a day. I think he should take advil as well. Thought?
Two extra strength Tylenol one Advil is what I use for moderate pain. I use diclofenac plus misoprostol, which takes care of the stomach issues, for my hip pain.
what seemed to work the best so far is dicolfenac patch but not big enough. i just talked to onc nurse and she said that bone pain is actually due to inflammation of nerves so anti imflammatories can work. morphine suppresses nerve activity i think.
I've metastases everywhere, but the original reason for seeing the GP was deformed bones in my shoulder very painful. After chemo, I'm on ADT and morphine (2 x 30mg daily) and this seems to work very well with only odd wandering pains. Only occasionally do I take paracetamol. The exception is that my shoulder, arms and hands are painful in the morning. It wears off quickly. I'm not intending to change anything.
I considered acupuncture and contacted an old Chinese friend who runs an acupuncture clinic. He told me that acupuncture would not help with this type of problem.
Hey ask your Chinese friend about maybe using some well aged DIT DA JOW liniment. The older the better. — warning contains alcohol for external use only —
Rick, he did mention that it's pretty extensive: "It is quite clear that there is a lot of uptake throughout much of my left shoulder... the amount of involvement is pretty scary."
This system really sucks for adding images. Took me a while to figure out where the main text goes. How about a cursor or some sort of hint? Anyway the shoulder mets are quite large. The kidneys can be used for size comparison. I am not sure if mets this big can be zapped? The sternum met is also quite large but not painful. I had a pathologic fracture there but it healed nicely. I am worried about fracturing my shoulder if I fall from my bike. Is it time for something recumbent or ??? I am not going to give up biking until I am dead or very close.Also would pluvicto or the new actinium treatment do anything about bone mets? Does the stuff get in to them?
This shows the shoulder mets pretty clearly. The kidneys can be used for reference.
I don't know if this will help or not, but I fractured by left shoulder and knee 9 months ago. Extremely painful. We got a recliner that I slept in and it helped so much with the pain. I think it was the level of support that it provided. It was one of those automatic recliners that go all the way up and lift you out. Sometimes I still sleep in it when my shoulders hurt.
I have one of the tilted bed pillows that lets you sleep somewhat upright. I should try that. There is no room for a recliner unless I get rid of my 9 ft piano which I am going to be buried in.
Should have mentioned it thank you DD. When I was bad I couldn't lay down (it is still painful for a few minutes); recliners were expensive and we have a small house, so we bought a gaming chair. It is wonderful. Everything adjusts. I slept in it every night for about 6 weeks. It is still just right for times when I cannot sleep and of course spot on for computer use. A foot-rest (lump of old wood) is useful. In bed, a pillow between my legs makes a lot of difference to how I feel pressure on my shoulders.
I get mild pain in my back hip belt line area, the degree of pain varies from time to time, yes mostly night or early morning, so for me I found Hemp cream( has pepermint in it) works to dull or eliminate the pain, When it is bad I do ice 15min then heat 15min , some say first heat then ice, ? Let me back up here , first and most important is supplements Modified Citrus Pectin brand Pecta Sol , pricy but helps with bone met and acts as detox, next is a combination of Curcumin brand Ultra Cur, and Bovine Lactoferrin brand Lactoferrin Co. For sleep I take 40mg of melatonin 30min before lights out. I also sleep on a wedge pillow that has really helped my sleep not to high maybe 25 degrees , not sure. Nighttime supps before the melatonin are, Apigenin 550mg, Andrographis 1500mg, Magnesium Citrate 500mg and Boswellia Pro Liposomal -brand MCS Formulas. First morning supp is Vitex ( chaste tree berry ), 500mg, Look into benefits from Zeolite, and DMSO I use them indivdualy when taking my Fenben, Ivm, and now DCA (dichloroacetate). MCP has been shown to help with pain and is somewhat anti cancer. Liposomal Artemisinin 1000mg brand - Healthy drops 1wk on/ 1wk off, taken with Black seed oil take in morning. monitor ph levels they say keep at 7.5 don't fall below 7.2 . They say zeolite helps maintain that ph level. along wih it is a detox and acts as a drug carrier agent.
Two things; not everyone responds to morphine at lower doses. Try some other meds, like Norco. Also, keeping a schedule is so important. Find a drug/dose that works and then don't skip because you're feeling better that day.
My husband has started experiencing more pain in his r&l hips/pelvic areas and his palliative care nurse practitioner prescribed Gabapentin each night before bed. Pain has decreased and he's sleeping better.
Hi spencoid2, I have had much bone pain and tried not to rely on the Dr. prescribed meds.
Will complete the 4th pluvicto treatment in two weeks. These have greatly reduced bone pain. Now I occasionally take Claritin or Advil nothing stronger.
no the winch was extra i did not get it. i use the winch on my 1967 Landcruiser to move it. yes it is heavy made with hand tied coil springs. i bought it when i lived in SF. I can not afford one now but all good mattresses are expensive. This one lasted me 45 years. When I had the mattress in the guest bedroom, more than one person said they had the best sleep ever on it. I will have to ask King Charles III how he likes his.
i was on xgeva when doing chemo but no one mentioned continuing it until i did recently and i should be back on when starting pluvicto if i do. not interested in driving 8 hours just for that. my primary can not prescribe it because i am not female and she is not an oncologist. pretty fucking dumb so they expect me to drive 8 hours to get a shot.
Was recently in another support group setting where one of the participants with chronic pain from cancer issues has been getting good relief from low dose fentanyl patches. They are opioid adverse and weren’t keen on using the dosage of opioids needed to control the pain. They’re (speaking in the “Royal” pronouns, of course!) getting their fentanyl via a pain management doctor.
Before I started adt for Pca I had terrible pain. Doc put me on Celebrex and I added curcumin. Reduced pain drastically. I prefer Celebrex as it is a cox 2 inhibitor while naproxen and ibuprofen block both cox 1 and 2 enzymes. Cox 1 enzyme protests the gastric system and if you google curcumin and Celebrex for prostate cancer you will find some interesting reading. It takes several weeks to get full benefit of this duo.
Have you tried a alkaline diet & have you ever tried Bicarbonate of Soda in a drink of water to reduce your acid levels in the body,
I am attaching some alkaline foods below - at night i sleep on a air mattress that fluctuates in pressure during the night with a air pump that clips on to the end of the hospital type metal framed bed, can you obtain a air mattress ? I use Amytryptaline to get to sleep at night
My husband tried morphine for his pain as well and it did not give him any relief. They switched him to Norco and it really helps. Hope you get some relief
If the bone pain in the shoulder is PCA have you discussed radiation to treat it . You need to see a shoulder Ortho familiar with Cancer and get evaluated by a radiation doctor. Ask your mo for recommendations.
If it is pca you should apply heat, 110 degrees for a minute each day, e.g. in shower. Also drink V8 juice several times a day. This will kill the cancer, as well as the pain.
It will, if a fly crash lands in your soup not wearing a mae vest (and of course doesn't know how to swim, front or back stroke or just plain ole float).
no but i have been referred. is there any point since it seems that naproxin does the job of pain reduction well enough for me? should i accept the referral?
Yes …. Get with your pallitive care team . They will be very helpful and work with you to get the job done. Dunno how often you are getting liver tests , but within 30 days of starting naproxen, it nearly heavily damaged my liver. As with any NSAIDS , esp prescription…. You have to keep close watch on your liver. Those can and will impact your stomach ( cause holes ) and liver. This my own personal experience and IMHO ( disclaimer).
I use 2.5 mil oxy with 600 mil ibuprofen after the morning meal. Then 2.5 oxy 400 ibuprofen after each meal. Some cannibals at night. Sometimes I up the dose of oxy when I have more pain. Get lots of rest.
I don't take extra calcium, it seems to increase the pain. I get calcium from my diet.
no idea if this is the right insertion point but here goes I tried plain old naproxin 500 mg an hour before bed and had the best almost pain free night in months. Side benefit, my back pain due to degenerative disc disease was almost gone.
I'm sure that enough heat would kill it but the problem is keeping that heat away from what you don't want to kill. Same with the application of any form of energy. Electrical Energy, Chemical Energy, Mechanical Energy, Thermal Energy, Nuclear Energy. The only kind of energy that is safe is potential energy as it won't kill anything, good or bad. Maybe dark energy?
Cancers (Basel). 2022 Jan; 14(2): 315. Published online 2022 Jan 9. doi: 10.3390/cancers14020315
PMCID: PMC8774274PMID: 35053479
Hyperthermia: A Potential Game-Changer in the Management of Cancers in Low-Middle-Income Group Countries
Niloy R. Datta,1,* Bharati M. Jain,1 Zatin Mathi,1 Sneha Datta,2 Satyendra Johari,3 Ashok R. Singh,1 Pallavi Kalbande,1 Pournima Kale,1 Vitaladevuni Shivkumar,4 and Stephan Bodis5,6
Hiroto Hatakeyama, Academic Editor
Author information Article notes Copyright and License information PMC Disclaimer
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Abstract
Simple Summary
As per the Global Cancer Observatory, in 2020, 59% of all cancers globally have been reported from the low-middle-income group countries (LMICs). Cancers of the breast, cervix and head and neck constitute around one-third of the cancers in the LMICs. Most of them are in advanced stages and thus deemed inoperable. Chemoradiotherapy is usually advocated for treatment of these cases with limited success. Moderate hyperthermia at 40–44 °C is a multifaceted therapeutic modality. It is a potent radiosensitizer, chemosensitizer and enforces immunomodulation akin to “in situ tumour vaccination”. The safety and benefit of addition of hyperthermia to radiotherapy and/or chemotherapy in these sites have been well documented in various phase III randomized clinical trials and meta-analysis. Thus, including hyperthermia in the therapeutic armamentarium of clinical care, especially in the LMICs could be a potential game-changer and provide a cost-effective addendum to the existing therapeutic options, especially for these tumour sites.
Abstract
Loco-regional hyperthermia at 40–44 °C is a multifaceted therapeutic modality with the distinct triple advantage of being a potent radiosensitizer, a chemosensitizer and an immunomodulator. Risk difference estimates from pairwise meta-analysis have shown that the local tumour control could be improved by 22.3% (p < 0.001), 22.1% (p < 0.001) and 25.5% (p < 0.001) in recurrent breast cancers, locally advanced cervix cancer (LACC) and locally advanced head and neck cancers, respectively by adding hyperthermia to radiotherapy over radiotherapy alone. Furthermore, thermochemoradiotherapy in LACC have shown to reduce the local failure rates by 10.1% (p = 0.03) and decrease deaths by 5.6% (95% CI: 0.6–11.8%) over chemoradiotherapy alone. As around one-third of the cancer cases in low-middle-income group countries belong to breast, cervix and head and neck regions, hyperthermia could be a potential game-changer and expected to augment the clinical outcomes of these patients in conjunction with radiotherapy and/or chemotherapy. Further, hyperthermia could also be a cost-effective therapeutic modality as the capital costs for setting up a hyperthermia facility is relatively low. Thus, the positive outcomes evident from various phase III randomized trials and meta-analysis with thermoradiotherapy or thermochemoradiotherapy justifies the integration of hyperthermia in the therapeutic armamentarium of clinical management of cancer, especially in low-middle-income group countries.
I myself just hot showering my spine, you could hot shower your shoulder in pain. Maybe start with 30 seconds and see if it is helping you. 40C- 44C is not very hot for your shoulder?
not a treatment on its own but an enhancer. sort of like the opposite of icing during chemo. no one offered my hyperthermia during chemo. would have been nice.
You could kill some cancer in your shoulder by simply exposing it to hot shower while you are in your bathroom. I am doing it with my spine. Your immunity is also better. It acts like a vaccine.
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Bone Pains
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severe pain
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