Green tea RCT: There are a few positive... - Advanced Prostate...

Advanced Prostate Cancer

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Green tea RCT

RSH1 profile image
RSH1

There are a few positive RCTs. Nothing earth-shattering and, by itself, green tea and EGCG likely will not change your prognosis much. But my opinion is that it is good to move the needle in the right direction (of course weigh the cost and the side effects). Green tea is cheap. I get organic green and white teas and drink tea throughout the day (white is possibly superior to green but most studies I've seen are centered on green).

I have also seen a null RCT but this is an example of one of the weak positive RCTs (I have yet to see evidence that green tea and/or EGCG is a negative for prostate cancer and if someone knows of a negative, please tell me):

clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show...

20 Replies

I've been drinking green tea for 25 years. My brand is Yamamotoyama. It is a Japanese green tea.

I feel the same way, anything that may help the cause, I'm on it.

That trial, comparing green tea drinking to water and black tea found "There was no significant difference in markers of proliferation, apoptosis and oxidation in RP tissue comparing Green Tea and Black Tea to water control."

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...

Here is a "no effect" RCT for EGCG:

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...

There is a risk of using it when having radiation (and probably, chemo or immune therapy):

goldjournal.net/article/S00...

Be careful with antioxidants. Oxidation is how the body rids itself of cancers and precancerous cells, and how the immune system destroys cancer.

There's probably no risk in just drinking the tea, however.

RSH1 profile image
RSH1 in reply to Tall_Allen

Null studies and positive studies. All pretty mild conclusions. Nothing that really stands out. This, along with PubMed metastudies and trials convinces me that odds are that green tea is a mild positive. Not a game-changer. I like tea so see no harm in drinking it other than heavy metal contamination so I try to pick carefully.

Agreed. Be careful with antioxidants. Good warning for all of us. Sometimes they are fine but if you are doing a therapy that increases ROS then be careful (radiation, chemo, or drugs).

Currumpaw profile image
Currumpaw in reply to Tall_Allen

Hey T_A!

The non profit study that has been kicked back and forth here--the study that was the basis probably for Pomi-T--maybe and some urologists are having a supplement with the four ingredients manufactured for them to sell from their offices has green tea in it. Of the four ingredients, large amounts of any alone had little effect on prostate cancer cells --but when smaller amounts of the four ingredients were combined--shazaam!

That is why there are bottles of this "stuff" being sold. A little synergy goes a long way! As you have often said, one can over do something.

Currumpaw

Tall_Allen profile image
Tall_Allen in reply to Currumpaw

There is only one ingredient in Pomi-T that has any value - sulforaphone. You can save money and get the same shazamm from sulforaphane alone.

Currumpaw profile image
Currumpaw in reply to Tall_Allen

Hey T_A!

If you look at the video Dr. Greger posted with details of the non profit study all four ingredients including the cruciferous extract had little effect alone when dosed in large amounts but were quite effective when smaller amounts, combined together creating a synergy.

Supplements are fine. As for a cruciferous plant sources broccoli sprouts are the most effective cancer killer. The living plant has more power to heal than it's extract pressed into a pill and perhaps coated to retain freshness.

Currumpaw

Tall_Allen profile image
Tall_Allen in reply to Currumpaw

I don't get my info from videos - people make up all kinds of shit when they are not peer-reviewed. He would have to compare the results of sulforaphane alone to a Pomi-T pill. I doubt he would be willing to do that.

Here's the data on each ingredient:

Sulforaphane (effective):

cancerpreventionresearch.aa...

Pomegranate (no effect):

nature.com/articles/pcan201532

EGCG (no effect):

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...

Curcumin (no RCTs, but evidence it interferes with PSA tests):

prostatecancer.news/2019/04...

The best kind of sulforaphane is "cold processed" which doesn't destroy myrosinase. Myrosinase is an enzyme needed for bioavailability. Alternatively, take a pill with an uncooked broccoli floret (only a little of the enzyme is needed). Pills contain amounts of sulforaphane you are unlikely to get from eating plants.

Currumpaw profile image
Currumpaw in reply to Tall_Allen

Hey T_A!

The study isn't hard to find. Dr. Greger's video is based on the study! Greger posts relevant parts of the study in his videos. You haven't seen one?

With cooked broccoli. lightly steamed preferably, a bit of olive oil, black pepper and mustard enhances our ability to absorb it.

I really don't care if curcumin or anything else that I take interferes with PSA test results. It is more important to me that I protect myself rather than try to get an "accurate" result from a test that is "inaccurate" . In a space of four days my PSA was once 25% off. That is why my onco said at the time that is why he has reservations about the test. It can be used as a bench mark.

Looking at PSA test results and what can affect the results from an objective view, I believe that whatever one does, takes or whatever-- establishes what is now the norm for their PSA. Why would I stop taking something for a week to get a more accurate result from an often inaccurate test when I am stabile. I am living with the PSA that I have and the supps and diet I follow. If my PSA destabilizes from this, what is now my norm, then I would be concerned. The doctor, research scientist, whoever is concerned about the accuracy of my PSA by controlling what I ingest isn't paying for the disposition of my remains.

I feel that the time is ending when studies focusing on one food, supplement or whatever will be considered to be the 'final word'. We are learning just how important synergy is.

Thank you for taking the time post the studies.

Currumpaw

TomTom1111 profile image
TomTom1111 in reply to Currumpaw

Hey Currumpaw!

I take 2 pomi-t daily.. 3 months worth for 60 buck...about 67 cents a day...how can I go wrong plus there is a double blind study....does keep pca at bay...that can't be discerned with psa alone.

Currumpaw profile image
Currumpaw in reply to TomTom1111

Hey TomTom1111!

I was using the four ingredients in Pomi-T before I heard of it. I am spending the big bucks for the stand alone supps.

I didn't realize Pomi-T was that inexpensive. Thanks for posting this as it may be helpful to some.

Currumpaw

RSH1 profile image
RSH1 in reply to Currumpaw

There is a fair amount of Pubmed data, metastudies, trials, and even some government RCTs that back EGCG, curcumin, sulforaphane, and pomegranate. No slam dunks that are going to wipe out cancer but every little bit helps. Even if I give something a 25% chance at efficacy, if it doesn't have many sides, I'll take the 25%.

Green tea/EGCG, coffee, sulforaphane, pomegranate juice and arils, turmeric/curcumin are all components of my "program".

If you figure out serum max times and half-life you can loosely time them so that they are all active at the same time.

Russ

Currumpaw profile image
Currumpaw in reply to RSH1

Hey RSH1!

I consider myself to be doing a balancing act. It seems that you do too. You know what has been said about apple carts?

Currumpaw

If you upset the cart and the apples need to used--don't forget to eat the apple skins! Seeds too--but not too many.

Tall_Allen profile image
Tall_Allen in reply to Currumpaw

If there is a study that proves there is a synergy with Pomi-T, where is it? I only saw the original RCT - but that doesn't show a synergy. It only shows that one of the ingredients (sulforaphane) has an effect, since, as I've just shown you, none of the others do.

The issue isn't absorption, it's bioavailability. First pass metabolism destroys most exogenous chemicals absorbed through the gut.

RSH1 profile image
RSH1 in reply to Tall_Allen

Thanks, I'll look for cold processed.

EGCG is an effective Zn ionophore, so when you consider green tea, also consider zinc in relation to PCa as well as COVID-19.

Yes Sir!

Nal.

RCT is Randomised controlled trial or radiotherapy and chemotherapy?

The former, randomized control trial.

Russ's Controversial Therapies....

Randomized Clinical Trial

Well I give my kids garlic.... so I can find them in the dark.....

Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.

j-o-h-n Monday 05/03/2021 7:36 PM DST

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