This isn’t good news. Low T at high risk of death from Covid 19

[Longterm101]

google.com/amp/s/www.dailym...

[Tall_Allen]

This was just posted. You are conflating low T (hypogonadal) with castrate. They are very different.

[Longterm101 in reply to Tall_Allen]

T is T in my book.... but what do I know

[Tall_Allen in reply to Longterm101]

Castrate levels of T enhances immune response, and puts the brakes on prostate cancer growth. Low levels of T accomplish neither. In fact, low T (hypogonadal) is associated with increased risk of prostate cancer. You probably missed this post:

healthunlocked.com/advanced...

[Schwah in reply to Tall_Allen]

So confusing. So super low T is good. Low T is bad. High T is good. The logic is hard to follow. I’m on an ADT “vacation” for almost 8 or 9 months and my T had gone from below 10 to about 125. Still relatively low T. I suppose this means I should go back on ADT or add T to protect myself from Coronavirus? Very strange.

Schwah

[Tall_Allen in reply to Schwah]

Trying to simplify biochemistry is always fraught. Especially the biochemistry of steroids (testosterone, estrogens, progesterone, cortisol, Vitamin D, etc.) There are multiple receptors, and sub-receptors (e.g., Estrogen Receptor α and Estrogen Receptor β) often with opposing functions, there are complexing and escort proteins (e.g., SHBG and Vitamin D binding protein), receptor upgrading and downgrading, enzymes that convert one into another, negative feedback regulated by the pituitary and hypothalamus, differing effects on cells in different organs, in different cells of the immune system, within cells vs the exterior, and in the presence of other biochemicals.

[Schwah in reply to Tall_Allen]

Ok. Now I understand lol 🤔.

[Tall_Allen in reply to Schwah]

This is why I roll my eyes when people post lab research on here. Only randomized (or at least some attempt at randomization) clinical evidence is useful to patients.

[monte1111 in reply to Schwah]

Now you can explain it to me.

[Schwah in reply to monte1111]

Lol. I have no clue what any of that means. I consider myself a reasonably intelligent and educated guy , but a lot of this science stuff we see in here goes right over my head.

Schwah

[Hidden in reply to Schwah]

You and me both brother. Who’d of thunk that we need to be scientist to figure out our life’s? I leave pc science to the experts . We have many .

[Hidden in reply to monte1111]

😳

[Shooter1 in reply to Tall_Allen]

Easy to read that way. What about us with zero T who are not on ADT??

[Tall_Allen in reply to Shooter1]

It doesn't matter if one is castrated chemically or physically.

[Shooter1 in reply to Tall_Allen]

OK ,Thanks

[joeguy in reply to Tall_Allen]

So are you saying a low T level of say 200 would put you at high risk of dying from covid, but a super low T level of say 20 would not ??????

[Tall_Allen in reply to joeguy]

That's what some data are showing.

[joeguy in reply to Tall_Allen]

not good news for those of us currently on ADT vacation with T in the 200s

[Tall_Allen in reply to joeguy]

I agree, not the best time for a vacation.

[pjoshea13]

Hypogonadism has consequences - there are usually symptoms of the metabolic syndrome. To single out low T as the reason for COVID-19 death is to ignore other potential factors or co-factors. Note that diabetics do poorly too - & perhaps pre-diabetics.

-Patrick

[kreg001]

Here is a link to the prepub doi: doi.org/10.1101/2020.05.07....

This is all very confusing. I wonder if the PATCH test will have data on low T, 'high' E, and the virus?

[Chubby42]

Im still confused I'm on Zoladex so am I more likely to die from Covid19 ? I've go no idea what my testosterone level would be. I'm not due to see my Onc until mid June.

Kind regards

Gary

[Tall_Allen in reply to Chubby42]

If you are taking Zoladex, you are chemically castrated, which strengthens immune response.

[Chubby42 in reply to Tall_Allen]

Ok thanks Tall_Allen

[j-o-h-n]

T for Two......

Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.

j-o-h-n Thursday 05/14/2020 5:56 PM DST

[monte1111 in reply to j-o-h-n]

Not supposed to go near the hospital. Guess a pair of tin snips will do. Snip, snip; large pair of tweezers and a glass jar and its a done deal. Maybe invite the neighbor gal over for conversation. Ask her if she likes nuts. What's the going rate on Ebay? Maybe I can get one of those small business grants. Pun intended. How about "Nuts Are Us"? Curbside pickup available.

[j-o-h-n in reply to monte1111]

Funny and not a bad idea..... Maybe post a sign

"2 for the price of 1"...

-or-

"We give you more room when we remove your heirloom"

-or-

"Let us whack your sack"

Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.

j-o-h-n Thursday 05/14/2020 8:12 PM DST

[Hidden in reply to j-o-h-n]

Nuts be gone!

[Seebs9 in reply to j-o-h-n]

I'm just happy we can only die once...

[j-o-h-n in reply to Seebs9]

Two for me..... Living with my ex-wife was wishing for number one.............

Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.

j-o-h-n Friday 05/15/2020 12:59 PM DST

[Hidden in reply to Seebs9]

That’s all that we will need🙏

[R410a]

There was also an article in the Daily Mail that data from Italy described the opposite. In that study, males on ADT with low T were less likely to get Covid -19 with less death.

Maybe drinking more wine than beer is the answer.

[j-o-h-n in reply to R410a]

I think it had to do with that Italian sport, pinching strange women on the ass.....

Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.

j-o-h-n Tuesday 05/19/2020 7:18 PM DST

[Hidden in reply to j-o-h-n]

That’s a fact jack!

[BruceSF]

Sorry to jump in so late. The full article is at medrxiv.org/content/10.1101... Most of the ‘low testosterone’ was 90-240 ng/dL, extremely low was <90, so they probably didn’t have many at castrate level (<50), (though they did not report that percentage). I’m concerned because I stopped Adt plus Zytiga at the end of January, and my testosterone just went up to 9 (from <4) a few weeks ago. The way I see it, I have some residual protection from COVID-19 while my T is < 50. When it goes over 50 I will be at increased risk, which I figure will be in a couple of months. Hmm, that’s just in time for the second wave (yuck!). I guess that’s when I really need to go into isolation. Does that make sense?