Hashimoto's remission

[Merrymoo]

Hello, is it possible to put your antibodies (TgAb and TPOAb) into remission (i.e zero) on Levothyroxine only, following a root cause approach to lifestyle? Has anyone achieved this, or is NDT required? TIA

[SlowDragon Administrator]

Many members see TPO antibodies slowly reducing on gluten free and/or dairy free diet

TG antibodies tend to reduce the lower TSH is

Antibodies tend to fluctuate anyway and may diminish the longer you have Hashimoto’s

NDT can actually result in increased antibodies in some people

[SlowDragon Administrator]

50mcg levothyroxine is only standard STARTER dose

How long have you been on just 50mcg?

Essential to test thyroid and vitamin levels

Bloods should be retested 6-8 weeks after each dose change or brand change in levothyroxine

For full Thyroid evaluation you need TSH, FT4 and FT3 tested

Also both TPO and TG thyroid antibodies tested at least once to see if your hypothyroidism is autoimmune

Very important to test vitamin D, folate, ferritin and B12 at least once year minimum

Low vitamin levels are extremely common when hypothyroid, especially with autoimmune thyroid disease

Post all about what time of day to test

healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...

Testing options and includes money off codes for private testing

thyroiduk.org/testing/

Medichecks Thyroid plus BOTH TPO and TG antibodies and vitamins

medichecks.com/products/adv...

Blue Horizon Thyroid Premium Gold includes BOTH TPO and TG antibodies, cortisol and vitamins

bluehorizonbloodtests.co.uk...

Only do private testing early Monday or Tuesday morning.

Link about thyroid blood tests

thyroiduk.org/testing/thyro...

Link about Hashimoto’s

thyroiduk.org/hypothyroid-b...

Symptoms of hypothyroidism

thyroiduk.org/signs-and-sym...

Tips on how to do DIY finger prick test

support.medichecks.com/hc/e...

Medichecks and BH also offer private blood draw at clinic near you, or private nurse to your own home…..for an extra fee

[Merrymoo in reply to SlowDragon]

Thank you SlowDragon for your reply. I have only been on Levothyroxine 50 for 4 weeks and increased today to 75. I have a blood test in a couple of weeks. I have done several private blood tests for vitamins and thyroid all first thing in the morning on an empty stomach. Unsurprisingly, the thyroid ones were worse than the ones my GP took mid-afternoon. I am in range for all vitamin and minerals, but not optimal - this I am working on with supplements. I plan to keep an eye on the relationship between my T3 and T4 to ensure they increase at a similar pace. I went gluten and and soy free in November , but not dairy yet. This has been a fantastic site for picking up information and I'm very grateful to you and the rest of the moderation team especially, for you insights.

[SlowDragon Administrator in reply to Merrymoo]

I have only been on Levothyroxine 50 for 4 weeks and increased today to 75. I have a blood test in a couple of weeks

No point testing until 6-8 weeks after each dose or brand change in levothyroxine

Rebook thyroid test for early morning at least 6 weeks time minimum

Which brand of levothyroxine are you taking

[Merrymoo in reply to SlowDragon]

Thank you! I will do that. I'm Wockhardt 25 and Accord 50.

[SlowDragon Administrator in reply to Merrymoo]

Both these brands generally well tolerated

Teva is the brand that upsets many people and best avoided unless you are lactose intolerant

[helvella Administrator]

A root cause approach can only ever stand even a theoretical chance of working if the root cause in the individual really can be identified and addressed.

Many (possibly all) antibody tests never show a result of zero. They have a lower limit of detection below which they cannot discriminate between a true zero and whatever limit that particular test has been validated for. So chasing zero will almost certainly be a very poor tactic as you'll never get there.

As levothyroxine doesn't itself cause antibodies (TPOab and TGab), then I can see no reason to link levothyroxine taking to failure to reduce antibodies. And I certainly can't see why NDT would in any sense be required for that aim.

Indeed, as another reply makes clear, there is some evidence that NDT is associated with a rise in these antibodies in at least some people.

However, I am very much not a fan of root cause approaches and chasing antibody test results. For a start, the assumption there is a root cause - one that you can address - rather seems to make it your fault that you have this disorder. You haven't already done whatever appears necessary so you are doing this to yourself.

And antibodies do fluctuate. If you did antibody tests every day, week, month - the results would go up and down. And you'd rarely be able to identify anything within your control that would change that.

[greygoose in reply to helvella]

And, I would add, even if you did the impossible and managed zero antibodies, you would still have Hashi's. Because antibodies are not the disease, they are the result of the disease. Hashi's never goes away.

[helvella Administrator in reply to greygoose]

Very much agree.

[Merrymoo in reply to helvella]

Thank Helvella for you reply. The diagnosis came as a shock to me and I was at such a low point I began mourning the life I had prior to Hashi and seeking and an answer to "why me?". I am now beginning to realise that acceptance is the first step to 'recovery' and to be realistic with expectations, whilst open to new ideas.

[helvella Administrator in reply to Merrymoo]

That much is quite clear - you and probably most here have had a huge shock.

Don't take any blame - none of what has happened is your fault. "Why me? - totally understandable but possibly not a very productive path.

[tattybogle]

in my experience , even if you do everything 'wrong' TPOab will still tend to go down over the years .

mine were >3000 at diagnosis in 2003 .... started on Levo .....in 2017 they were 195 .

in the intervening years i have eaten whatever i like (which is basically 75% healthy wholefood balanced diet , and 25% rubbish) , smoked moderately , eaten gluten, and far too much sugar. ( this is not a recommendation to do the same, obviously some of those are pretty bad life choices and wreck other bits of the body)

[Mostew in reply to tattybogle]

Maybe if the 'bad habits' arnt seen as 'being naughty' But enjoyed , this attitude shift would balance out the negative effects?

State of mind is as important as food ...

[tattybogle in reply to Mostew]

sadly not .. i enjoy them all ...but my teeth are definitely FUBAR

[Teddyandolive in reply to tattybogle]

a small comfort to see someone else who had TPOab >3000 like mine 🤗 Mine don’t seem to come down no matter what I do

[Merrymoo in reply to tattybogle]

Thank you Tattybogle and Mostew. Tattybogle - That's a pretty spectacular TPOAb you had! I think you both raise an interesting point regarding frame of mind and it's something that I am beginning to work on!

[radd]

Merrymoo,

No, NDT is not always required and Levothyroxine works for a lot of people. As SD has said NDT can encourage higher levels of TPOAb in some people unable to raise NDT meds fast enough.

It’s more about which meds are right for you to achieve wellbeing and lay the foundation for an improved and calmer immune response, which a healthy life style supported with optimising iron/nutritional deficiencies will encourage.

As others have said autoantibodies fluctuate but they do serve to show the extent of a damaging attack on the thyroid gland and aiming to reduce them also reduces the inflammatory cytokines that damage cells and can influence good workings of our thyroid meds. Therefore, it is favourable to have lower levels of thyroid antibodies, particularly TPOAb which research is showing can cause all sorts of other problems outside of thyroid issues.

[Merrymoo in reply to radd]

Thank you Rads for your reply. I realise now I need to be a tortoise, not a hare in tackling this and give my meds some time!

[Astro16]

I am affraid, i cant help here, all i know is that levothyroxine helped me, and got my thrroid levels back to normal ,, I have been ok on them for the last 12 years, the only weird thing was that i went up to 125 with them, and then i went back down to 100mg, apparenty 125was too much, but this must have been my body ajusting things !! im no doctor, but its helped me .

I am sorry i dont know anything about antibodies,, thisw i would suggest you have a conversation about with your gp.

Kind regards Astro 16

[Merrymoo in reply to Astro16]

Thank you Astro 16. It's good to hear they have helped you.

[FallingInReverse]

Hi @Merrymoo!

The diagnosis came as a shock to me and I was at such a low point I began mourning the life I had prior to Hashi and seeking and an answer to "why me?". I am now beginning to realise that acceptance is the first step to 'recovery' and to be realistic with expectations, whilst open to new ideas.

I was diagnosed in August 2022. Your post has reminded me of the earliest questions I had:

Did anything I did cause, or quicken the onset, of my hashis & symptoms.

Would I have to look back with regret that something I did caused it.

The “good” news : ) is that that’s not the way Hashis works. I haven’t thought about this in so long, because the longer one develops a relationship with this condition, gets to know how what you do DOES or DOESNT change things, AND follow along with the brilliant knowledge on this forum…. The initial confusion of it all clears .

The forum can’t make a 6-8 Levo titration period go faster. It can’t make the chain reaction required in our hormonal system go faster. It can’t shorten the many months our bodies need to tortoise our way to our full replacement dose.

But the biggest gift it has given me is to give me peace among the symptoms that I am doing the right thing, and that it just takes this long, that there are ups and downs along the way, but I am on the right track.

In the beginning, my biggest question was whether running a lot (monthly 5k-10k-half marathons and a couple marathons + training!) for the 10 years before diagnosis “caused” this or if I didn’t do as much if I would have had a few more good years before being diagnosed.

I haven’t thought of that in a while.

Thanks for reminding me of how far I’ve come in not being so confused : )

Welcome to the forum!

[Merrymoo in reply to FallingInReverse]

Thank you FallingInReverse, I think I will get to the same point as you are now, one day. I didn't believe I would a month ago, so I guess the clouds are starting to clear.