Glandulars and NDT, whatty what now?? Confused.

[Ebx_design]

Hi everyone,

I think I'm being a bit dim here but I have to ask ...what is difference between Glandulars and NDT?

I know M is a glandular.... But then what? What does that actually mean re. treating hypothyroidism, I still don't understand the difference despite my Googling. 😐

Also, why all the different types? Porcine, Bovine etc.

Halp!

[SeasideSusie Remembering]

Ebx_design

A thyroid glandular is made from the whole thyroid gland so it should contain everything a thyroid gland contains. There are two types of glandulars - one from pigs and one from cows.

Metavive produce 5 kinds:

Metavive l and Metavive ll are both from pigs, the difference is that Metavive ll is twice the strength of Metavive l.

Metavive lll and Metavive lV are both from cows, the difference being that Metavive lV is twice the strength of Metavive lll.

Metavive Pro is stronger again and only available from practioners, you can't buy that yourself.

There is no declared hormone content, ie they do not declare any amount of T4 or T3.

NDT - Natural Desiccated Thyroid - comes from pigs only and this is manufactured with a set amount of thyroid hormones T4 and T3 (generally 38mcg T4 and 9mcg T3 per 1 grain NDT), it's also said to contain T2 and T1 and calcitonin.

Some people do well with Metavive, others find it doesn't help at all.

Some people do well with NDT, others find the fixed ratio of T4 and T3 is not right for them and they find the flexibility of dosing with synthetic T4 and T3 is better.

[Ebx_design in reply to SeasideSusie]

SeasideSusie Hi, right, that really helps, thank you.

So, overall, it's about knowing the content of them that is the really difference. A gladular will contain some hormone elements but how much - who knows and in what ratio - who knows.

While NDT is engineered to be more consistent and therefore can declare itself so.

Thank you 🙏🙏🙏

[helvella Administrator Thyroid UK in reply to Ebx_design]

It is important to realise that some glandular thyroid products actually make a point of claiming that they contain NO hormones, or no thyroid hormones.

Some say they don't test for thyroid hormone.

If they did contain any, the amount might be variable - from dose to dose, from batch to batch or from year to year.

We know we don't know!

This makes it very difficult to make any decisions. The main source of information is other members' experiences.

[tattybogle]

NDT = Natural Desiccated Thyroid . eg Armour /Erfa /Thyroid-S....... made from whole animal thyroid gland (pig) ~which is desiccated , and processed into tablets (with various added fillers/ excipients used to make it possible to produce the tablets) ... they all contain an openly stated , guaranteed, consistent amount of T4 and T3 hormone .... usually 38mcg T4 +9 mcg T3 .... (but Erfa brand has 36mcg T4 /8mcg T3)

Glandulars= made from whole animal thyroid gland usually pig, sometimes cow .. which is desiccated , and processed into tablets (with various fillers /excipients used to make it possible to produce the tablets.... and recently, something called nucleotides have been added (no idea what they are or what they do )

You have to try it and see if it works for you

Bovine / Porcine ~ pig's and cow's naturally have slightly different proportions of T4:T3 in their thyroid glands ie, one has more T3 and less T4 than the other one does , but i can't remember which.

[Ebx_design in reply to tattybogle]

 tattybogle I can't believe I've not come across this before. Every day is a school day!

After prescribed therapies, are glandulars generally regarded as popular products within the hashimoto's community? Surprisingly very little being said about it. 🤷

[Mlinde]

Who knows what's in Metavive? The makers can't declare its contents else it would have to be declared a 'medicine' and have to get approval from the powers that be. I tried it (II) and it had no appreciable effect.

[Ebx_design in reply to Mlinde]

Thanks for sharing your experience. 👍

[metamorphica]

NDTs are regulated at medicine, Glandulars are seen as supplements.

The former says the amount of active T4 and T3 because it's classed as a medicine and has to.

Glandulars are classed as a supplement.

[Lynneypin]

I have wondered if the human body has a ‘preference’ for pig or cow thyroid…. I suppose if ndt is porcine then maybe that’s the answer.

[helvella Administrator Thyroid UK in reply to Lynneypin]

In last few years of the nineteenth century, and the first decade or so the the twentieth, the manufacturers tried at least ovine (sheep) as well.

A major factor that swung to using pigs was seasonality.

Pigs can breed all year.

Pigs do not change massively between summer and winter.

Sheep and cattle are one-a-year breeders. And change markedly between summer/autumn (eating as much as they can to build up for winter) and winter/spring when they have to both survive and prepare to lamb/calve.

These differences affect availability and things like hormone balances - thyroid as well as others.

It was only development of freezing and freeze-drying that has permitted desiccated thyroid to be produced year round. They couldn't operate by producing the supply for the next year in only part of the year. (OK - tablets might last. But no-one wants the manufacturing of them to be restricted to a few weeks/months of the year.)