soy

[foxglove]

Does anyone know why soy products shouldn't be taken if one is hypo? Thanks

[greygoose]

Because soy impedes the uptake of thyroid hormone by the cells. So, you can have good levels in the blood, but still be hypo.

[fiftyone in reply to greygoose]

why can't thyroxine be adjusted for our lifestyles, rather than patients lifestyles having to fit in with the thyroxine figures. eg. if we like a lot of soy products, and we still feel hypo because of cell uptake, just take a higher dose of thyroxine to balance it out. I am fed up with doctors making the patient fit the statistics. What I want doctors to do is find out why the statistics don't match the reality. Eg. in my case the statistics are way out but I am fine. Why don't the figures match the reality?? That's the real question - not making me fit in with the statistics and feeling unwell.

[greygoose in reply to fiftyone]

It's got nothing to do with doctors or statistics. It's a law of nature, not man. Soy contains a substance that stops thyroid hormone getting into the cells, and that's all there is to it. Nobody decided that's the way it was, that's the way it is. And, taking extra levo, as far as I know, wouldn't help because it still wouldn't get into the cells, and you don't want FT4 levels too high in the blood because that causes other problems. And, it happens whether the hormone comes from a pill or your own thyroid. There are some things you can blame doctors for everything.

Soy is pretty evil stuff, anyway. I wouldn't touch it with a barge pole!

[fiftyone in reply to greygoose]

thanks for that explanation.

[Lilylui in reply to greygoose]

Does this mean soya milk as well?

[greygoose in reply to Lilylui]

Absolutely, yes.

[Lulu2607 in reply to greygoose]

Hi Greygoose. I don't eat or drink soy products but I see soya lecithin is in a few products I like (eg chocolate). I reckoned it's probably OK, particularly in small doses but am I wrong? Should we avoid that too?

[greygoose in reply to Lulu2607]

Soy lecithin is not quite the same, because it's derived from soy, it isn't the full soy spectrum - if you see what I mean. And, from what I've observed, it's ok for some people, but bad for others. It's never had an adverse effect on me - not that I eat much chocolate, but I think I would have noticed if it made me feel bad, give that the smallest drop of soy sauce puts me to bed for the rest of the day - I react very badly to it. So, maybe soy lecithin is OK for you, too.

[Lulu2607 in reply to greygoose]

Thank you Greygoose. Yes, for years I reacted to various things but couldn't work out what. I now know I react to barley malt extract ( been gluten free since diagnosed hypo though), msg and flavourings generally, yeast extract etc. It's a minefield. Thanks for the reply, I do have a sweet tooth.

[hashihol in reply to greygoose]

I wonder if it might be that soy sauce contains gluten. If you're on a GF diet and had soy sauce that might cause a reaction? Tamari soy sauce doesn't contain gluten so I have that occasionally.

[greygoose in reply to hashihol]

No, I'm not on a gluten-free diet. I tried it for a while - over three months - and it did nothing to help me, so I gave it up. So, it's not the gluten in soy sauce that affects me. It's the soy!

[hashihol in reply to greygoose]

Ah! Scary! No eating out in chinese restaurants for you then! Yes, I tried the gf before for nearly 6 months and I didn't find it helped. But I've decided to give it another go for longer this time. It's AWFUL!!!

[Farrugia in reply to Lulu2607]

Lulu2607 if you like dark chocolate then the ones that are high percentage cocoa (eg 75 - 80%) often don't have soy lecithin in. They often don't have emulsifiers in either, emulsifiers are not helpful for the gut microbiome so I prefer to avoid them (Gut absorption is often poor with Hashimoto's). It does mean you have to scrutinise the ingredients list though!

[Lulu2607 in reply to Farrugia]

Thanks for the tip. 😊

[foxglove in reply to greygoose]

What substance is the evil stuff? Do you know?

[foxglove in reply to greygoose]

What is the evil substance in soy/ Do you know? that would help to explain why you are so anti soy . Or am I misjudging and you don't mind those who take soy with no upsets

[greygoose in reply to foxglove]

Sorry, can't remember.

I'm anti-soy because a lot of people are making big money out of destroying the rain-forest to grow something that isn't even food. Fermented soy is a condiment, fine - although I can't take it - but it was never intended to be a main meal. This is the west's interpretation of it. They stick soy in all processed foods, in one form or another, because it's cheaper than real ingredients. And, I'm pretty sure that that has something to do with the epidemic of thyroid problems that we're currently seeing. It's harming people for greed.

Apart from the problem I quoted, which affects those on thyroid hormone replacement, soy is also a qoitrogen that does affect the thyroid itself in people who rely on their thyroids for thyroid hormone. And, whilst I agree that you do have to consume an awful lot of goitrogens for it to have any effect, some people do consume an awful lot of soy in one form or another. It's not good for people and it's not good for the planet.

[foxglove in reply to greygoose]

Good well explained reply I do my bit to help the planet but perhaps not so well as you!

[endofdays in reply to greygoose]

Thank you so much for this info. Is Tofu no good either then?

[greygoose in reply to endofdays]

Tofu isn't fermented, is it, so not good either.

[endofdays in reply to greygoose]

Ah ok, thanks so much!

[greygoose in reply to endofdays]

You're welcome.

[foxglove in reply to fiftyone]

Agree! good on you for this reply - I'm thinking of starting a "Praise soy campaign"

[foxglove in reply to greygoose]

Hi greygoose thanks to you and all who replied please see my reply to hashihol for the reason for my Query!

[foxglove in reply to greygoose]

Sorry meant to say I'm still no wiser re soy!

[greygoose in reply to foxglove]

Why are you no wiser? If you're taking high doses of thyroid hormone replacement, and it isn't getting into the cells because of soy so you stay hypo, I would have thought that's a pretty good reason not to eat it. Or am I missing something?

[foxglove in reply to greygoose]

I'm on low dose NDT and recent bloods show my thyroid is ok...not hypo!

[greygoose in reply to foxglove]

But a blood test will not show you how much hormone is getting into the cells. It only shows you what's in the blood. There is no way of measuring how much gets into the cells.

[foxglove in reply to greygoose]

So? if no way of measuring why bother? if feeling ok stop chasing the impossible

[greygoose in reply to foxglove]

So? Why did you ask this question in the first place if you're just going to ignore or argue with everything anyone says? Good luck for the future, I'm out of here.

[Mazmacapaca in reply to greygoose]

Not wishing to sound annoying as I respect your advice having read your posts for a number of years and found the information valuable. Can you advise if soy beans (aka edemame beans) also affect thyroid hormone uptake Into cells?

[greygoose in reply to Mazmacapaca]

Yes, they do. Because they're not fermented.

[Mazmacapaca in reply to greygoose]

Good to know, I was thinking about adding some to my salads but won’t bother now! 👍

[greygoose in reply to Mazmacapaca]

Not a good idea, no.

[serenfach]

Most soy is imported in the UK from America, Brazil and Argentina, so it is not "green" either, and leads to deforestation.

[Mostew in reply to serenfach]

So no rice no fruit from far away counties etc? The way things are going at present we are going to see far more imported from Australia another far away places .

[Mostew]

I have small amount of organic tamari. Occasionally have tofu . No harm if very limited . .If it was the only thing one could find to eat I doubt one would say it’s evil… !?

[foxglove in reply to Mostew]

Agree the usual ...in moderation, I'm sure there are a lot more harmful things and yes I would use if starving. Don't think soy evil at all

[Kenley]

What about fermented soy? The only soy I have have is organic tamari or miso. I know that fermented foods are great for the macrobiome and I assumed that fermented soy would not be bad for the thyroid but maybe I am wrong.

[Lalatoot in reply to Kenley]

It is the isoflavones that have been found to disrupt the working of thyroid hormones and in this study ingesting soy resulted in a period of elevated rt3. Though how much soy you would need to take is not clear, for those who struggle to find a symptom free balance with their thyroid hormones it is better for them to avoid it completely.frontiersin.org/articles/10...

[Mostew in reply to Lalatoot]

Interesting study. I noticed the participants were given snack bars . Wonder what else was in them!! So different from a naturally fermented organic pure product .

I would. think the process of how the body respond changes ?

Others thoughts welcome …

[foxglove in reply to Lalatoot]

Interesting study thanks

[Mostew in reply to Kenley]

I assume the same as you . Guess we all react differently . I rely on how my body responds to what I eat . As well as advice from my great Ayurvedic practitioner .

[hashihol]

Interesting. I didn't realise you weren't meant to have it at all. I thought it was just like calcium, ie not having calcium containing products within 4 hours of taking medication. So, it seems we can't have soy at all? Or is it ok as long as it's taken away from medication? I love soya beans and tempeh, organic, non GMO of course. It would be a shame to remove them from my diet. Why are they 'evil" 🤣?

[foxglove in reply to hashihol]

Interesting reply! I am taking a product to calm over active bladder, it contains pumpkin seed extract 270 mg and isoflavine glycosides 15 mg, been on it for a little bit and feel well (think bladder prob is being helped) and as almost anyone who suffers with OAB will realise help is wonderful. Would rather put up with hypothyroid!

[Lulu2607 in reply to foxglove]

Hi foxglove, just to say I did find that when I was undermedicated I suffered from an irritated bladder which was worse when lying down, but stopped when my levo dose was increased. Just a thought.

[foxglove in reply to Lulu2607]

Interesting all thoughts gratefully received. Pleased you found your answer. I'm fed up of pelvic floors so I'm going to try increased dose of NDT (treating myself) Will continue with OAB med. also as I think it helps!