Thyroxine and Oestrogel

[Spangle15]

Hi.

This is a question for anyone taking thyroxine and HRT (specifically Oestrogel).

I used to use the gel at night and take my thyroxine in the morning. However due to my sleep issues, a couple of months ago, my endo suggested trying the thyroxine at night. So I swapped them around (thyroxine at night, Oestrogel in the morning). It didn’t help my sleep, so I’ve moved the thyroxine back to the morning. Which means I’m now taking the thyroxine and Oestrogel both in the morning.

But I have noticed I’m starting to feel more irritated, less patient and more angry like I was prior to starting HRT.

So my question is, when do you use your gel?

Thank you.

[Mollyfan]

I take my thyroxine in the morning and oestrogen at night. I found that my TSH went down a bit when I stopped the oestrogen for a while.

[Spangle15 in reply to Mollyfan]

Thank you. That’s interesting.

[FancyPants54]

It's more likely that you are in need of a dose of gel increase if symptoms are creeping back in. The thyroxine should not affect it or be affected by it as it's not going through the digestive system.

I take my HRT and thyroxine first thing in the morning. I use the new spray for oestrogen, so still transdermal.

[Spangle15 in reply to FancyPants54]

Thank you. I’m already on 4 pumps of gel so a high dose.

It’s so hard to know what’s going on when you’re taking multiple medications.

[FancyPants54 in reply to Spangle15]

That's not particularly high. Plenty of women using 6 pumps, some even 8 pumps. God knows where they find to apply all that.

For me, gel stopped being well absorbed after a period of time. I had good blood levels of oestrogen on it at first and then they fell. (Same seems to be happening with spray at the moment!). So number of pumps doesn't mean you are actually getting that much absorbed. You need a blood test to check.

When I was on 4 pumps I had to apply 2 in the morning and 2 in the evening or I had symptoms from it. In my case excessive sweating and anxiety. So that's another experiment you could try, splitting your gel dose.

Sounds like you really need a couple of blood tests. Oestrogen and thyroid. The results could guide you or you can use experiment.

[Spangle15 in reply to FancyPants54]

Your comment about where they put it made me laugh. It’s hard to get it to rub in with 4! I might try splitting the dose, I’d wondered about that.

I’ve had recent thyroid bloods and levels have gone down but still ok. However I’ve upped my thyroxine and might increase T3.

I’ve had very confusing oestrogen results on 3 pumps. I had two tests and one was at the bottom of range (day 3 of cycle) and the other was way above range (day 16 of cycle). The doctor had no idea why 🙄 but I suspect it’s because the range should change throughout your cycle but they just have one they use regardless of day of month. But it hasn’t really helped with knowing if dose is right.

[FancyPants54 in reply to Spangle15]

I'm currently trying to get a dose of T3 that works with my Levo. So far I think I'm failing. I feel no better at all and probably worse. So depressing.

[Spangle15 in reply to FancyPants54]

I'm sorry to hear that. Have you had your bloods done recently? I have been adjusting my dose for a year and it still isn't quite there, but I have kept notes in the past and know that I feel better when my T3 and T4 are right at the top of range. My TSH is suppressed because of T3.

[FancyPants54 in reply to Spangle15]

Yes, bloods were done and consultation had a couple of weeks ago. My T3 was raised from 15mcg a day to 20mcg a day with my 125 levo. But I feel no better. My body is leaden most of the time and energy very low. Yesterday I had to put a delivery of logs away in the fuel store. God it nearly kills me now, it used to be a breeze.

I'm not sure I should have raised the T3. I think I might have been better off raising the T4 as it dropped quite a lot when I introduced T3. But I'm working with a private endo. so did as told and now need to stick with it until next test. I have the Dio2 gene defect. But the endo. won't allow my TSH to drop below 0.5 because I live with persistent atrial fibrillation. My heart rate is rather too high at the moment, even with a beta blocker, so I have to keep an eye on that. Before atrial fibrillation my heart beat at a nice regular rate of around 77bpm. Now if I'm really lucky it's in the upper 80's but most of the time in the 90's. Add in the new higher dose pushes it to around the 100 - 108 rate. Although, interestingly, when I take a dose of T3 my heart rate goes down into the 80's for a while. It rises as the T3 wears off!

My last results were FT4 56% through range and FT3 45.83%. However the test was taken as he wanted it, not as directed here, and I think that makes a difference because it probably means my FT3 is higher than this shows. He didn't want me to space my T3 out to 10-12hrs before test. He wanted me to leave it as I normally dose it which is 8.15 am and 3.30 pm. I don't think I'm going to do that next time. Or if I do, I will follow up with my own private test the next day with the dosing recommended on here just to see what difference it makes.

I'd say my only consistent benefit from the T3 is my brain works better. I the first week I took it I felt so much better. Happy, lively, wanting to do things. I even thought I was going to make a Christmas cake and started planing which recipe to use. But it only lasted a week. It means I know it's possible. But not how to achieve it.

[Spangle15 in reply to FancyPants54]

I really feel for you. It seems for some of us establishing the correct dose can take a long long time. I know personally that I feel better when my T4 and T3 are right at the top of the range. I hope you get things sorted soon.

[Panda_26]

Hi there,I've just come across your post and interested as I have a similar problem and I'm wondering whether the estrogel is affecting my thyroid meds!

Only difference is that I'm on ndt not thyroxine but have noticed that since raising the estrogel despite blood tests that look OK I definitely have hypo symptoms back. The gynaecologist who originally prescribed for me did mention that it can occasionally skew thyroid meds and so that might need monitoring.

Its a pain when you need both levels to be right !