Hi, I know of it but haven't done it. You may have found it through Micki Rose but if not here is her oestrogen page purehealthclinic.co.uk/?s=o... and here is her DUTCH page purehealthclinic.co.uk/?s=D..., which may give you a bit more information. Cheers
My pleasure - depending on what you've asked she may ask you to book some time (if she needs to look deeper into your question). Most of the information is on the site so well worth reading around and searching the A-Z etc. Best wishes
Hi, it is a useful blog. He quotes Ray Peat quite a lot and that is a really interesting site. I first found him when I was looking for natural blood thinners and his info on Vitamin E and fats is fascinating, but here are his oestrogen pages if you haven't seen them raypeat.com/articles/articl... and raypeat.com/articles/aging/.... Cheers
I follow a lot of hormone-y/women's health podcasts, and they all hold the dutch test as the gold standard for home hormone testing. I've been tempted to try it myself, but the cost is a bit prohibitive.
I think it can be important to work with someone who knows how to properly interpret the results though, as we might miss some important inter-relationships ourselves.
sorry to hear you had breast cancer, I also had breast cancer, age 39 I am now 65
I was diagnosed hypo 10 years ago, my daughter hypo. four years ago after Doctors telling her for five years before that she had CFS because her TSH was in "range"
I used progesterone pesseries for PMS years ago and continued after the breast cancer for a while, in hind sight I should have kept using it as I had a terrible menopause and of course could not use HRT, but know now it can be used for menopause and after.
Hi Lucylocks, You are absolutely 100% on the right track with getting a Dutch Test done. However, you will need to work with a Functional Medicine Practitioner who is very experienced in interpreted this test and who also understands how to read it with the interconnection of Hashimotos and how that affects all the other hormones. It is far too complex a test for you to interpret yourselves in order to get the true value from it. Plus it has to be done at a very specific timeframe of the month when you still have your monthly period. Furthermore, you must stop some supplements beforehand and take medication around it if at all possible. I have done it many times and each time it is a military operation preparing for it one week in advance and then doing it either on the day or over two days if you do the one with Cortisol Awakening Result too. This requires both saliva and dried urine samples to be taken. These are actually relatively straightforward to do, it is just what you can and can't eat and drink and take on the day which is why I am seeing to invest in the test you need to have all the information in advance so you don't waste your money and skew the results by doing something you don't realise you shouldn't. I had Estrogen Dominance and Low Progesterone and the tests have helped me to come up with a plan and address them. I now take Biomatrix Pro-Adapt Oral Progesterone (sub-lingual) on Days 14 - 28 of my cycle each month x 20 drops (albeit I started on 10 drops). Plus I take Seeking Health Calcium D-Glucarate and Seeking Health DIM & IC3 to keep the Estrogen Dominance under control because I have methylation issues and the propensity to metabollise Estrogen down the worst pathway. However, all of this was done working with a Functional Practitioner who was experienced in doing this Dutch Test and also working with hormones, herbs etc. She has had a fairly good understanding of Hashimotos albeit I am very much in control of my own health and have researched a lot over the years so I always work with someone who understands and respects this and that we work as a team. I wish you and your daughter well on getting her sorted. You are as I said, definitely on the right track. In the meantime, you can watch lots of videos by Dr. Carrie Jones on the Dutch Test but I think you will agree that unless this is your field of expertise, no matter how good you are at doing research (and I am the Queen over the years), you will need some help with this one. As my FDN says, it isn't always about looking at ranges and seeing where you fall in them but about looking at how all the results link with one another and reading it as a whole picture. Hope that helps! Estrogen Dominance is really soul destroying...I put on 1.5 stone in a couple of months from doing nothing different and I had lost 3.5 stone some 8 years earlier in my life, got fit and trim and so it was a real setback for me. I had come to love my body and then the stress from a lot of things kicked this off afterwards and it was a very dark time but I am proof that your daughter will get through it. All the best, Claire. x
You don't have to still be having periods to do the Dutch Tests. I assumed from what the original person who posted was saying about their daughter that she was still menstruating. There will be different requirements if you aren't or if periods are not regular. That is precisely why working with a Functional Medicine Practitioner is of the utmost important. This is too complex a test to navigate as a Layperson and I say that from experience as I know a lot and manage some other tests myself.
Hi, I did the Dutch test back in February. It was very useful for me and explained a lot of my symptoms. My hormones were all very low so I have been able to feel confident that hormonal treatment was needed. The test results are very well explained. but there is a lot of science so I would recommend having someone to explain it to you. I did it through a functional medicine practitioner.
It has shown me how everything needs to be in balance.
I feel so much better physically and emotionally now and a bit more in control of my health.
As well as the Dutch test I have monitored blood sugar and intend to have a micronutrient test . Good luck
Hi yes I’ve had the Dutch hormone test done - it was helpful in highlighting which of my hormones were high and or low but understandably it only reflects the hormones during the window of time when the test is done so I felt it was a little limited - if u are in a position financially to be able to do it then it is worth doing just to dot the i’s and cross the t’s so to speak - if it would be helpful to see what the results look like I can try this evening to pull them up
Ps) what Clara wrote is true about the functional health practitioner and their input plus it can get very costly for the tests and their work/input (three sessions, tests and supplements came in at over £1500 ☹️)
My healthcare won’t even entertain progesterone do you think the cream thats made with yams would be good substitute? Im often plagued with breast pains and I stop the estrogen and it clears up.
That's really sad and so wrong. As you say, it is all about balance. I tried progesterone (Wellsprings Serenity cream) and all seemed ok for a few months then started to react badly and stopped using it. Now I read that some functional practitioners say that we shouldn't use exogenous hormones, that they can make the problem worse, and that it shouldn't be necessary as there are other and better ways to balance hormones. I don't know if my problem was caused by a build up of progesterone in fatty tissues, which I understand can happen, or whether it was my reacting to fillers etc in the cream (which is likely, as I am hypersensitive to meds and supplements and have to be very careful about what I use). I am now using Calcium D-Glucarate with other liver support and also supporting my MTHFR and COMT function to help methylation and oestrogen metabolism (and eating raw carrot!).
No problem that's what the forums are for! I was definitely erring on petit pois although Wellsprings suggested trying more when I was still having symptoms. I never did as it started to make me feel buzzy and dizzy, nausea etc. I've been voicing concerns about how my liver is supposed to be coping to GPs for several years (lots of medication, poor gut health, stopped sweating, so thought natural detox can't be working terribly well) but getting nowhere. My liver function tests are normal for NHS ranges but when I saw some functional ranges I was not optimal. I did a test (through Micki Rose's site) called a Hepatic Detox, because I wanted to know how well I was methylating (also tested genetically). My phase 1 detox (P450 enzymes) is ok but phase 2 (conjugation incl methylation) is poor. The report gives you ideas (like Vit C, E, selenium, magnesium, glutathione, amino acids), I also use methyfolate and methylcobalamin (B12) plus a bunch of other stuff and then my detox aid (Kirkman's). For COMT (mine is slow) you need to pay attention to reducing and managing stress, support methylation, and avoid or reduce catechol compounds like green tea, apples, red wine, chocolate, some medications. Hope that helps x
Just a thought about the stress, or at least some of it - I took it to mean stress on the body in its widest sense. So I cut out as many toxins as possible - all personal care stuff, house cleaning stuff, food additives, supplements etc etc - ditched the lot and found the cleanest possible and fewest alternatives, organic where possible, on the basis that if I'm not absorbing it I don't have to work so hard to get it out again. I also had been struggling with diet anyway so had identified and got out foods that I'm intolerant to and also went AIP so cut other likely inflammatory foods. Also do a bit of EFT (tapping), exercises for vagus nerve, meditation, get outdoors with my feet in the grass...... and the magnesium helps such a lot x
Yes you are right in what you say. On further research I have found they can do the "Dutch test plus cycle mapping" to show hormonal activity throughout the month, which I would think would be helpful but obviously more expensive.
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