STTM newsletter about the current situation re NDT

This just arrived in my mailbox; it paints a very gloomy picture as of the future of prescription NDT in the US and elsewhere:

stopthethyroidmadness.com/2...

[Hidden]

Does anyone know if it is a fault in the raw material, or if it is in the processing/fillers/etc? We only get the powder here in Australia, which is compounded to our specific dose, so I'm hoping that it's the latter and not the former.

[Hidden in reply to Hidden]

Unfortunately, no, as there are so many unsubstantiated rumours. I've read that there has been a recent shortage of raw material due to swine fever in Asia, but doubt that would affect supplies in the US as I believe all US manufacturers of NDT get their raw material from US slaughterhouses. So it's very difficult to tell fact from fiction I'm afraid.

However, as far as I know, the problems reported with US brands have more to do with fillers than raw material shortage. We know that Armour was reformulated and the cellulose content increased and that affected how the product worked. Erfa changed somehow after production was moved from one country to another. So, whatever has happened, it seems to have more to do with fillers/production methods than the raw material itself.

However, I have decided to stock Thyroid-S so just ordered 2000 pills. That leaves me with a total of 4000 pills so should last me a while...I decided to do this in case many patients give up on prescription NDT and turn to Thai NDT. If Thyroid-S is the only brand left, I fear a shortage if demand exceeds the supply, at least temporarily. Better safe than sorry.

[MaisieGray]

In true STTM fashion, they don't give the numbers of people reporting these issues, to know what might be the true scale of the problem; and they dismiss those reporting that they are feeling good as it 'must' be because they are being fooled by something else going on. Heaven forfend that patients who know their own bodies, should contradict Bowater's narrative. If these changes are all about $$$$ as they say, then it doesn't seem to make corporate sense to change a great-selling product into one that doesn't sell and patients are fleeing from. As ever, neither STTM 'logic' nor their ire, stack up.

[Hidden in reply to MaisieGray]

But there is a problem...until recently, there were three brands of Thai NDT. Now, two of them have been discontinued due tu ‘lack of demand’. How can there be a lack of demand for affordable NDT I wonder...?!

[MaisieGray in reply to Hidden]

I thought that only one had definitely been discontinued, and that different rumours are being bandied about, regarding what might be going on? Yes, there's something happening in the world of Thai NDT that hasn't yet become clear; but my point was about STTM and how Bowater brooks no challenge to her autocracy - not even to accept patients saying they feel well because it contradicts her rants.

[Hidden in reply to MaisieGray]

Two suppliers of Thai NDT claim lack of demand was the reason and confirm Thiroyd too has been discontinued, that’s all I know at present.

[Hidden in reply to MaisieGray]

Regardless of how one might feel about the STTM in general and Janie Bowthorpe in particular, I tried two brands of NDT, Armour and Erfa, without much improvement. That and the ridiculous cost of NDT in Belgium were the reasons I switched to Thai NDT. But I still feel uncomfortable taking a drug where the mfg is not required to make the list of fillers public. I’d much prefer to take a regulated brand, but feel uncomfortable about the reports of potency problems and inconsistencies from batch to batch. True, the STTM may be biased, but some doctors working with NDT avoid brands such as Armour since the reformulation. Some doctors who then switched to Naturethroid now seem to prefer WP. For some time, WP has been reported to be the only good remaining brand of NDT on the market. I don’t know how many patients have complained about it, but it would be interesting to find out if there are members on it and if you’ve noticed a difference lately?

In any case, development worth keeping an eye on IMHO.

[MaisieGray in reply to Hidden]

I think it was perhaps SeasideSusie or maybe greygoose who said that in their own country, Thai NDTs are prescription-only and therefore licensed drugs, and so manufacture is regulated.

I don't understand the concept of Drs 'switching', they aren't the ones taking it so why should they be prescriptive over the preference and experience of their patients?

[helvella Administrator Thyroid UK in reply to MaisieGray]

I have posted that this is the case - from what I have read. However, understanding Thai pharma is beyond me! Although much is posted in English, it has been difficult to find much information at all and sometimes I have (totally understandably) run up against Thai language.

[MaisieGray in reply to helvella]

Ah, sorry helvella , if I ascribed that elsewhere. However, I feel you are letting things slip if you haven't troubled to teach yourself Thai by now 😂😂

[Hidden in reply to helvella]

Well, just to add to the confusion...I just read a blog run by someone who walked into a pharmacy while on holiday in Thailand and bought Thyroid-S OTC...so even if it's prescription only there, it seems some pharmacies are willing to sell it to tourists anyway (like pharmacies in Greece, Turkey, and Spain are sometimes wiling to sell thyroid hormone to patients without a prescription...it seems to depend very much on the individual pharmacist). The only thing I know is that there is no "POM" on the label of my Thyroid-S bottles, which makes we wonder if they produce one version for export and another one for the Thai market...we are all of course eagerly waiting for your evening Thai language courses to enable you to dig into all this and answer all our questions once you figure Thai pharma out!

[helvella Administrator Thyroid UK in reply to Hidden]

I have also heard of people arranging delivery of Thai desiccated thyroid to hotels, etc. But nonetheless, the general impression I get is that it is not over-the-counter.

[Hidden in reply to MaisieGray]

No, it was Helvella.

And fillers are considered proprietary in Thailand so mfgs are not required to make them public. The mfg process itself may be regulated but nobody can force them to make the list of fillers public. Which sometimes worries me as the same stringent standards may not apply as in the EU or the US.

When Armour changed the Hertoghe doctors - many of whom take NDT themselves - started prescribing Erfa Thyroid (as well as taking it themselves) instead.

[Hidden in reply to Hidden]

MaisieGray,

The following addendum was emailed to followers of the STTM blog:

"ALSO, right after you got your email notification, I added a third reason directly to the actual blog post as to why some may still feel good on the changed NDT’s. It states: Or an unknown, since so many are not doing well. We need to continue figuring this out."

I have been living with this NDT mess long enough to know something is not right. I know and respect the fact that some still feel good on prescription brands of NDT, but I failed to notice any improvement on two of them - Armour and Erfa - which is why I switched to Thai NDT five years ago. No other prescription brands of NDT are available in Belgium where I get mine so I never had the opportunity to try NP or WP or Naturethroid.

But what worries me, more generally, is the lack of information to customers/patients. Why not inform patients every time the formula changes, as fillers are known to influence absorption and cause problems to some patients? Why do we always have to find out through posts on the STTM?

Also, the lists of ingredients of Thiroyd and Thyroid-S posted on the STTM some five years ago have been obtained by patients who have been in touch with the manufacturers, and is not publicly available information as that is considered proprietary in Thailand. Therefore, nobody knows how accurate these lists are, nor if they have since been updated. But I remember that Thyroid-S contains more or less 20 fillers, including three types of dye (yellow, red, and blue). I never understood how they could fit so many fillers into such a tiny pill, but refuse to believe it should be necessary...

[greygoose in reply to MaisieGray]

Greygoose posted that NDT of any kind is illegal where she is, in France. So, you wouldn't get it prescribed, anyway.