Nature thyroid

[jwoodward5]

Is one grain of nature thyroid equal to 100 mcg of levo?

[Aurealis]

I believe it is, but others may use different conversion ratios.

[jwoodward5 in reply to Aurealis]

Ok thanks im getting different answers so confused

[Aurealis in reply to jwoodward5]

Having looked at all the responses to this question below so far, I can see why you’re confused! I’ve used the conversion ratio you asked about successfully over a number of years, but I have been using Armour. Think you’ll have to try it and see. Good luck!!

[AnnaSo in reply to Aurealis]

What is your conversion rate Aurelis?

[Aurealis in reply to AnnaSo]

1 grain = 100mg Levo = 20mcg T3.

Is that what you were asking me?

[helvella Administrator in reply to Aurealis]

Think there is a mistake in your units there!

1 grain = 100mcg Levo = 20mcg T3.

[Aurealis in reply to helvella]

Yes I agree, whoops

[helvella Administrator in reply to Aurealis]

Easily done.

[helvella Administrator]

There is no definitive conversion ratio.

The 100 micrograms of levothyroxine being equivalent to one grain of Nature-Throid is a pretty safe estimate. If you were on 100 micrograms and switched to one grain, you would be very unlikely to be over-dosing. It is what the manufacturers suggest and I am convinced they do so precisely because it is "safe".

Many people later report they had to increase Nature-Throid to something like 100 micrograms to one and a third grains - or so. (Or 75 micrograms to one grain, if that is easier.)

We are all different. The two medicines vary in lots of ways and our absorption of each will be different. There is nothing you can do but try it and see. Best try to have sufficient tablets to be able to make dose adjustments and not worry about running out.

In the best of all possible worlds you would have some quarter-grain tablets to make fine adjustment easier.

[jwoodward5 in reply to helvella]

Ok thanks

[McPammy]

Hi. I was on 75mcg of Levothyroxine. I was having trouble with it suddenly after 11 years on it. My Endo suggested NDT privately. So I did. He said 1 grain/ tablet of NDT = 75mcg Levothyroxine. I took I grain and had overactive reaction. I then found an NHS UK conversation paper stating 1 gran = 100 mug Levothyroxine. I emailed him and attached the NHS UK conversion paper. He replied saying that he doesn’t work it out like the NHS but he’s an NHS Endo plus private. Go figure. So I’m unsure what it equates to. He is also a Endo Professor?!

[AnnaSo in reply to McPammy]

I agree it is close to 75 more than 100. 1 grain= 39mcg T4 + 9mcg T3 = 39 + (9*3) = 66

You could have experienced over medication for a number of reasons. If anything you had a good endo to suggest NDT!

[jwoodward5]

A strange one then

[adin]

In my opinion is equal to 65-50 mcg of levo.

NT provide 38 mcg levothyroxine (T4) and 9 mcg liothyronine (T3) for each 65 mg (1 Grain) of the labeled content of thyroid.The normal thyroid gland contains approximately 200 mcg of levothyroxine (T4) per gram of gland, and 15 mcg of liothyronine (T3) per gram. The ratio of these two hormones in the circulation does not represent the ratio in the thyroid gland, since about 80 percent of peripheral liothyronine (T3) comes from monodeiodination of levothyroxine (T4). ( pdr.net/full-prescribing-in... ) and here find useful information; restartmed.com/armour-thyro...

[helvella Administrator in reply to adin]

The ratio of these two hormones in the circulation does not represent the ratio in the thyroid gland, since about 80 percent of peripheral liothyronine (T3) comes from monodeiodination of levothyroxine (T4).

I agree fully that there is no reason to suggest or assume that the ratio inside the gland is the same as in the bloodstream. (I'd suggest that would be true even if there were no conversion in the rest of the body!)

But we very often see the argument that pigs have more T3 than humans. I doubt there are more than a handful of endocrinologists who know the typical T4:T3 ratio of a healthy pig's blood. I don't know despite having tried to find out.

[Howard39]

Hi

It’s 74 mcg to be really accurate.

Adin is on the right lines.

38 mcg of thyroxine and 4x 9 ( 9 mcg of t3 in a grain which is approx 4 times stronger than t4). Added up that equates to 74.

Always use a thermometer and check your temps as you increase. Everyone is different but if you aim for 36.50 and how you feel you should be fine. If you take 4 readings a day and take the average- any variation above 0.3 will show your adrenals are not fully functioning.

Best wishes

[Joesmum in reply to Howard39]

My endo always used to say that 1 grain was about 75mcg levo.

Having used both I would tend to agree.

However ...

We are all different in the way we absorb and utilise these hormones so in truth, all figures and comparisons can only be an approximation.

[Angel_of_the_North]

it contains 38 mcg T4 and 9 mcg T3 as far as I know. So would be the equivalent of 38+36 = 74mcg levo or possibly only 38+27 = 65 mcg levo. So no, it's not the equivalent of 100mcg levo.

[Nutripea1220]

I was told it was 25. When I was on 125 levo I was converted to 5 grains armour thyroid (as though 25). It actually wasn’t enough. 1 grain is a very small dose (someone else please correct me if I’m wrong)... the smallest possible just like 25 levo is smallest dose possible.

The thing with Armour though you have to increase slowly -not take it all at once because of the T3. I ended up on 9 grains armour but certainly I couldn’t have taken them all at once at the beginning. I also started in one.

I don’t want to confuse things, just adding a different opinion. From what I was taught it’s 25. (Maybe 60 due to t3, but not 100).

Edited to say: ignore me; angel of the north has correct answer. 😒

[helvella Administrator in reply to Nutripea1220]

9 grains of Armour is one of the highest doses I have ever seen reported!

There are many who need far less than five grains, less even than the three grains that Stop The Thyroid Madness often appear to suggest as the lowest possible full replacement dose.

They do actually make quarter-grain tablets of desiccated thyroid.

[Nutripea1220 in reply to helvella]

That is so interesting! I had. I idea! I know someone in 15 grains. Go figure. We must be part-rhinoceros or something. I do also know someone who is sensitive to 5 cytomel and I’m on 250. I think each person is so individual. That said a conversion is a conversion. And I stand corrected 🤗

[helvella Administrator in reply to Nutripea1220]

If you consume that much porcine thyroid, maybe I won't be inviting you for barbecue spare ribs...

[JaniceJ7]

I think it's a bit like comparing apples and oranges - both fruit but totally different. I was on 100mcg levo before switching to NDT. Saying that, 100mcg was not my ideal dose but if I tried to raise it I felt awful. I'm now on 3 grains (180mg) of NDT and feel much better.

[jwoodward5]

Well im more confused now

[CSmithLadd in reply to jwoodward5]

When taking T4 alone, if you're having difficulty converting it into the active thyroid hormone T3, then you'll experience malady when raising your T4/Thyroxine dose.

NDT gives both T4 and T3 which helps many who have difficulty trying to regain their health with T4 alone as T4 must be converted first (via nutrients). If nutrient levels are lacking (ferritin/iron, vitamin d and selenium are among the most common in that regard), then T4 builds up and becomes a negativity to thyroid function as Reverse T3 (RT3).

RT3 blocks receptors to the cells. When T3 is lacking in the cells we are hypothyroid. T3 is what makes all systems of the body function in a timely and precise manner. Everything runs smoothly.

This is why I think all patients who are experiencing any difficulty with thyroid hormone should have their RT3 checked.

To explain:

Many will keep taking higher and higher doses of T4 hoping for an improved result and don't get it. Nor do their doctors. That's because their doctor stops at the most elementary testing. Thus, the discovery of why a patient isn't improving -- even though their usual tests (which are inept and shouldn't be used for maintenance dosing) state they are -- is not found.

When RT3 is high or when inflammation is high (as with many, many who are hypothyroid), then conversion of T4 to T3 is greatly impaired. This also occurs due to a decrease of stomach acid. Ample amounts of stomach acid facilitate absorption of nutrients. That can be corrected by taking HCL supplements.

The whole Reverse T3 issue was probably the greatest help to me in my journey to correct the damage done by doctors who are ignorant of the needs of Grave's Disease patients (and others who have specific needs, which equates to all individual patients as we are all different).

With Grave's (the antibodies still exist), TSH needs to be completely suppressed to control all symptoms. That is in conjunction with high levels of Free T4 (if applicable), and high levels of Free T3 with low levels of Reverse T3.

It was like a miracle when that RT3 cleared for me. So, if you don't feel absolutely great on what should be adequate thyroid hormone, there's no doubt RT3 is part of the problem. Nutrient replenishment usually helps facilitate more efficient conversion of T4 to T3 and that will keep RT3 at bay.

Read the in-depth article below. It's very informative and spot on. Do not hesitate to print it out and show your physician why you need an RT3 test. Many conventional doctors are just coming around to see the benefits of their patients after adhering to how to clear RT3. The proof is in its success!

restartmed.com/reverse-t3/

Hope this helps!

[jgelliss]

jwoodward5

It all depend what multiplier you use /go by . Some multiply T3 by 3-multiplier and some by 3.5 .

[LAHs]

Here's my two cents worth. You cannot ask, "What is the conversion between Levo and NDT". You have to specify WHICH NDT because they are all quite different. If it's Armour it is approximately 1 grain = 60mcg Levo.

[McPammy in reply to LAHs]

Hi do you know the conversion of NDT brand Erfa 60mg x1 grain please. NHS conversion table says it equals 100mcg Levothyroxine.

[LAHs in reply to McPammy]

Hi McPammy,

Basically, sorry no, I do not know that. HOWEVER... there are numerous discussions about these conversions on this forum, a very good one is:

Confusion about NDT levo equivalent from "jodypody".

I think the best way I would approach the problem if you want to convert to ERFA is to start on one grain, see how you feel and then increase or decrease your dose until you feel well AND you do not have palpitations, high blood pressure or a racing pulse - drop back to your previous dose if you get any of those (bearing in mind that T3 only has a half life of ~8 hours - so don't get too scared, it all calms down by early evening). I think the reason there is so much confusion about these equivalents is because it boils down to their biological effect on the individual. 1.5 grains Armour does the work of what 135 mcgs Levo used to do for me, but if you calculate it by the numbers only 1.5 grains Armour is the same as 100 mcg Levo - and I was very ill on such a paucity of Levo.

But read that post, someone found the equivalents for (I think) every NDT.

[McPammy in reply to LAHs]

Hi. Thank you for all your help with this. I since trialed myself of the NDT and now I think I may have the right quantity for me. I will see for sure once I get my next blood test done. I’m starting to feel a bit better

I have other issue going on too which cloud my situation. I have low ACTH. Low cortisol on many occasions. T4 going too high. TSH high and low. It’s a roller coaster. I also have severe muscle weakness. So much so I can’t sit up or walk much. Blurred vision and facial muscles effected. I’m being investigated for myasthenia gravis and waiting for my appointment. Before March this year I was running about getting on with my life as usual and working full time. Now I’m reduced to being housebound I’m so weak.

Thank for your comments and help it’s mych appreciated 👍

[25joyce]

No it is 38 t4 and 9 t3