t3 dosage

[juliebuzz1]

I need help, I am taking t3 only as thyroxine does not suit me.only eighteen years to find out ! Anyway I am unsure what the equivalent dose is to the 100mcg of thyroxine.

[Clutter]

Welcome to the forum, Juliebuzz1.

T3 is 3 x the potency of Levothyroxine so an equivalent dose is 33mcg T3. UK Liothyronine is only available in 20mcg tablets but are easy to cut in half with a pillcutter to achieve 30mcg. They're a bit small to quarter evenly but approximate quarters can be achieved, if necessary.

[juliebuzz1 in reply to Clutter]

Thank you, I have been reading about other peoples dosages and they seem very high, do you have to match the same dose when on thyroxine or just stop when you feel better with t3, very confused. I do find it hard to raise the dose I am only on 15mcg of t3 at the moment.

[shaws Administrator in reply to juliebuzz1]

Hi juliebuzz,

Everyone is different in their doses of thyroid hormones. As T3 is the active hormone we may not need exactly what the dose was in levothyroxine.

We shouldn't increase doses too quickly. It's better to leave around 4 to 6 weeks before adding a little extra. Take note of your Pulse and temp because if we take too much our pulse will increase and we might feel quite hot but when temp is taken it might be normal. If you have any symptoms of being over-stimulated, just drop dose to the previous one.

[Clutter in reply to juliebuzz1]

Julie, don't try raising it faster than you can tolerate, the symptoms are very unpleasant. Do you take the 15mcg in one dose or do you split it?

[juliebuzz1]

Thanks,have been trying for quite some time but will persevere.

[helvella Administrator]

In a healthy human, without any thyroid problems, it is suggested that maybe one third of T4 is converted to T3, one third to reverse T3 and one third disposed of.

Normally, about one-third of T4 is converted to T3 and about one-third to rT3. The remainder of T4 is metabolized by different pathways, in particular glucuronidation and sulfation.

thyroidmanager.org/chapter/...

That would go along with the rough and ready 3:1 "potency" often suggested. For example, if you take (or your thyroid produces) 100 micrograms of T4 a day, then you'd have about 33 micrograms of T3. However, there are many things that would mess this up.

If you have a "conversion problem" and only convert half as much to T3 as usual. Then the 100 micrograms of T4 would end up as only about 17 micrograms of T3.

If you have a levothyroxine absorption problem so that of the 100 micrograms you swallow each day, only 50 micrograms is absorbed, then again you'd end up with abut 17 micrograms of T3.

In either of the above two examples, a single 20 microgram tablet could end up supplying more T3 than you would get from a 100 microgram tablet of T4. That could suggest a ratio nearer 5:1.

I don't know of any specific examples, but it seems equally reasonable that some people might convert T4 to T3 rather more effectively than others - maybe they produced 50 micrograms of T3 from each 100 micrograms of T4? Ending up with an effective ratio of 2:1. (I suggest that this is more likely to happen in people who are desperate for T3.)

The only thing that matters is whether you are getting enough thyroid hormone - and in this case, enough T3. How much T3 that needs is very individual and is likely to change over time. Remember, some of the people who report very high doses will have resistance to thyroid hormone or (possibly) impaired absorption and/or retention of T3 in their bodies.

Rod

[juliebuzz1 in reply to helvella]

Thanks Rod for your reply wow I am even more confused with your reply, I was on t4 for 17 yrs and it did absolutely nothing for me, just worse really, so I have to try a different route towards a healthier life, I have no choice in the matter !

Thanks again

[helvella Administrator in reply to juliebuzz1]

OK - I understand that it is actually complicated!

The important point is the last paragraph.

Maybe another way of looking at things is this:

How much T3 do you need? (You obviously don't know the answer unless you are on T3-only long enough to get a stable, successful dose.)

Then work backwards and ask "How much T4 would I need to take to get this much T3?" Absolutely anything that affects T4 from the tablet itself, through absorption, conversion, excretion, etc. will affect the amount you'd need.

[juliebuzz1]

Hi,

Yes I split it, 10mcg at bedtime, I find it helps me sleep? Strange I know and I split 5mcg in the day, have tried to up the dose to 20mcg but it does make me feel odd, anyway will persevere.

Thanks

[greygoose in reply to juliebuzz1]

Not strange at all. I take all my 75 mcg T3 at bedtime and I sleep like a baby. It's what suits you best that is right for you. Never mind what anybody else does or takes. It's all trial and error, and you have to find your own way through.

[humanbean in reply to greygoose]

I think I read somewhere that the body produces about 60% of its daily T3 between 10pm and 10am.

I may have imagined this, and I don't have a link, sorry.

I also remember reading a post related to thyroid, can't remember where or who. The author had seen a cardiologist and had been told to stop taking T3 at night because "the heart doesn't need T3 at night". *Facepalm*

[greygoose in reply to humanbean]

Yes, I remember reading both of those. The second one was on here, but can't remember who said it. They are all clueless when it comes to thyroid!

So it would make sense to take it at night.

[juliebuzz1]

Thanks, you say you take 75mcg, that seems a lot , I am struggling to take 15mcg, did you take t4 at all ? I really don't know what dose is right for me, I was on 100 mcg of t4 originally ,so to replicate that dose is very difficult, I do have side effects from taking thyroid medication so I get nowhere fast all the time! Just want to feel well on regular basis !

[greygoose in reply to juliebuzz1]

Well, it may sound like a lot to you, but I can assure you that it is not a lot for me! If I try to take less, I get nasty palpitations. I have taken as much as 225 daily, with no ill effect. But I think at that time I was getting rid of the rT3 that had built up from T4 which I can't tolerate.

I was initially put on T4 only, but got much worse. I added T3 and felt a bit better. Then one doctor put me on Armour. Got up to 6 grains but still wasn't doing very well. I persisted for several years, trying all the different brands of NDT in turn, but then, one day tried T3 only and felt so much better. I've been taking T3 only for several years now. I've come to the conclusion that I can't tolerate T4 in any shape or form.

When you say you have side-effects from thyroid medication, what exactly do you mean? Are you sure it's not just low thyroid symptoms? Taking too low a dose can be worse than taking none at all!

As to replecating the dose of T4, as Rod said, if you weren't converting it, it was no dose at all.

Have you had all your vits and mins tested? If things like iron and B12 are low, you won't be able to use that T3 you are taking. And nutritional deficiencies can cause lots of symptoms in and of themselves.

I only found my dose - and my choice of thyroid hormone replacement - by experimenting. No doctor, nor anyone on a forum, could tell me what dose I was going to need. I tried all possible solutions, at lots of different doses, before I found what suited me best. I'm afraid you're going to have to do the same. Increase slowly, but surely, til you get there. But you will get there, I'm sure!

[juliebuzz1 in reply to greygoose]

Hi greygoose

I didn't mean it to sound I was questioning your dose of t3,as you say it what suits you. Anyway when I try to increase any thyroid meds, I get odd symptoms like fuzzy head, dizziness etc just a peculiar feeling and when I drop my meds down again I feel OK.

My doctor doesn't really understand what I am going on about, but she did prescribe me t3 when I saw Dr Skinner and he suggested it, so I have just stuck to t3 but not successfully as am unable to raise the dose, just one big vicious circle !

[greygoose in reply to juliebuzz1]

No, no, I didn't think you did. I was just explaining. I replied with an internal laugh. Ha ha ha!

But I'll repeat what I said before, you are probably having difficulty raising your dose because of nutritional deficiencies. Hypos usually have nutritional deficiencies because they usually have low stomach acid which makes absorbtion difficult. Best to get as many tested as possible. From the sound of your symptoms there, you could be low in B12. Its very common.

Do you take vit c with your T3? That could help you absorb it better. You should take lots of vit C, anyway, it's good for everything! Have you tried taking it all at night? Or all in the morning? Have you tried taking it sublingually? We have to keep trying different things until we find the one that works. I'm sure something will work if you keep looking!

[juliebuzz1 in reply to greygoose]

Hi, greygoose, OK I will try and take it all at night , I do take vit c but will take some with the t3, I think my bloods were OK last time,however that was a while ago, do they test specifically for B12 or is that your blood count ? I think my doctor thinks I am a bit crazy so have to make myself go and ask for these bloodtests ! I put off going to doctors all the time. Thanks for your help its soon nice to speak to people who understand what you are going through, its quite isolating this disease !

Thanks again.

[greygoose in reply to juliebuzz1]

This disease is very isolating, for many reasons. If only doctors unstood how it affects us, they wouldn't be so judgemental.

Vitamin B12 is a seperate test, as are Ferritin, iron, vit D and folate. All these things need to be at least mid-range to be useful. Vitamin B12 needs to be at least 600, preferably more. Don't take 'fine' as a diagnosis for anything! Always get the numbers - and ranges - and see for yourself, because doctors just have no idea about these things! My B12 was 350 about, doctor said it was perfect. But I was losing the use of my right arm and had no feeling in my feet. Since I've been supplementing, my arm has regained normal usage and my feet are slowly coming back to life. They just have no idea how dangerous it is.

If you supplement with vitamin B12 (sublingual methylcobalamin) take a vitamin B complex with it so that the Bs are balanced. But look for one with methylfolate so that if your folate is low, that will bring it into range.

If you supplement with vitamin D3, also take a little magnesium and zinc with it because they work together.

[juliebuzz1 in reply to greygoose]

OK I will go and get these bloods done, wish me luck, I seem to have lost all confidence in doing anything about my health lately, its funny you should say about your feet, my feet are very uncomfortable and both heels and my big toe feel numb ? I did injure my foot and put it down to that ! I am taking a b complex Plus vit c ,selenium,evening Primrose oil, but never sure if I am taking enough of any of them.

[greygoose in reply to juliebuzz1]

Yes, that is the problem, isn't it. We need frequant blood checks, but getting them can be very difficult!

If you are deficient in B12, a B complex will not have enough in it to raise your levels to where they ought to be. You need something like 5000 a day.

Vit C you can't over-dose on because it's water soluable. But Selenium is more dicey. I posted something about it recently. If you go to my profile and look through my posts you'll find it. Evening primrose I have no idea! Best to stick to what it says on the bottle. You might want to try Borage oïl with that. They compliment each other.

Good luck!

[juliebuzz1 in reply to greygoose]

Thanks, might be back in contact if thats OK with you, its nice to have a bit of moral support !

[greygoose in reply to juliebuzz1]

Of course that's OK Hope you get on alright.

[faith63 in reply to juliebuzz1]

I could not raise my dose of t3 dose, until i was off all t4 meds for about 10 weeks or so.

[Veggiequeen]

I take 50-75 mcg daily and I split it into two or three doses. When I stopped taking Levo and started on t3 only I split it into 4 doses per day but I didn't take any later than 6pm. I gradually started to feel better but started on a very low dose and worked my way up in increments after taking the dose for 2 weeks and making sure I was ok. It is a difficult balancing act. I find if I take any later than 6pm I have trouble sleeping. But also if I don't have enough in my system I can't sleep either. It really is individual. Just take it slowly. Let the body get used to it and do what works for you.

Carrots