I'll health retirement

[Jacko37]

Hi, has anyone been successful in claiming I'll health retirement because of severe raynaurds? Work has become more and more of an issue over recent years and I think that I am at the end of the road with regards to sick leave. I have asked if I can now take unpaid leave when things get really bad in the winter and this has also been refused. I think that I have reached the point where they just want to get rid of me. No reasonable adjustments gave been suggested. I am office based and the change in temperature from one moment to the next plays havoc with me.

[OldTed60]

Hi Jacko37. I’m afraid I can’t answer this question from personal experience because I’ve been freelance since leaving university many moons ago. But I wanted to suggest that, in order to get more replies, it helps to provide context in your post and on your profile. Not everyone here will bother looking past the info in your post in order to find out you also have Rheumatoid Arthritis and Osteoporosis, meaning your Raynauds is therefore secondary and that severe means you get digital ulcers and are on iloprost, Rituximab etc. These extra facts, which I only gleaned from your other posts, shed more light on on your Raynauds. Most with primary Raynauds won’t have it as severely and HR wouldn’t do more than make reasonable adjustments I’m guessing. But with RA and Osteoporosis in the mix I would think you should definitely be getting more support from your employers and might well be qualify for ill health retirement. Maybe update your post and, as importantly, your profile? Also email or phone and ask SRUK and NRAS if they have information that supports your claim? X

[positivedaybyday]

Hi Jacko37,Unfortunately I'm the same as OldTed60.

In all my working life I only came across one incident where a lady was given early retirement on health grounds. That was in 1999 and it was one of the best places in my sphere of work which took care of their staff

Her back was deteriorating and as she was in a seated position all day she was in severe pain.

I have a friend who struggles to walk with bad knees, osteoporosis & many other conditions. She has had a lot of time off in the last few years.

She tried to ask for early retirement many times and has been refused.

She has been taken down the disciplinary route because of the amount of time she's had off ill.

Obviously all this has only added more stress on her. She has always had doctors/ hospital back up for any of her periods of absence from work. She's gone through HR and has had in house health meetings.

It's really been horrible for her.

She's felt many times that they want to get rid of her as its a cheaper option. She plods on counting the days until her official retirement in 18 months.

It's sad to say but a lot of companies are really tough if you're generally ill. It sounds like yours aren't supportive either.

To have a company support you and really care is a treasure these days.

I'd involve HR and see if there is anything work can do to make your daily routine more manageable.

So sorry, I don't have a good solution for you.

[OldTed60 in reply to positivedaybyday]

I meant to add in my long post that a friend with Addison’s and severe osteoporosis, later also diagnosed with Sjogren’s, was forced to go to an employment tribunal appeal to finally get ill health retirement. She had been a head teacher for decades and found the process very degrading and depressing. She did qualify for full PIP easily at least.

What I wondered when I read this post and your reply was that both osteoarthritis and Raynaud's are common conditions affecting many in the work place, even if just mildly. So I’m guessing that it’s harder to generate enough compassion from employers for these because they don’t want to set a precedent for others who might say “hey my fingers go white too” or “I have arthritis in my hand/ knee/ hip/ back so if she qualifies then so should I?”. This is why I suggested emphasising the RA and, if diagnosed, Systemic Sclerosis or others - because these are less common and are autoimmune and inflammatory so may help to get taken more seriously for Raynaud’s with digital ulcers, days off needed for powerful infusion treatments etc.

[Jacko37 in reply to positivedaybyday]

Thanks for your reply. I work in the civil service and have done for the last 27 years. I really can't believe how much things have changed during that time. I feel sometimes that they just want to make things as difficult as possible for you and more or less force you to resign.

[positivedaybyday in reply to Jacko37]

I totally agree. I wish it was a lot better for everyone. Staff are the wealth of a company but unfortunately these days its all about money.It's too easy to replace someone with a lot of years for someone on a new lesser contract and lesser pay.

Don't let them try to force you out. Be strong and use any means possible to continue to work until you get all the company benefits you deserve for all those years.

Don't bank on your present job being loyal to you. In there eyes you're just a number, easily replaced.

However if a better job somewhere else comes up don't hesitate to move on.

Sorry I don't have good news for you

[Jacko37 in reply to positivedaybyday]

Would just like to add that occupational health even told me a few years ago that HR would want to get rid of me, but that just makes me more stubborn. If I leave it's my decision and I would never make it that easy for them.

[positivedaybyday in reply to Jacko37]

I totally agree with you. Keep fighting and don't let them intimidate you xx

[AJOC4]

I worked for a company for 23 years. I had a mental breakdown because my job was getting too stressful and made my systemic sclerosis, psoriatic arthritis and Reynaulds rapidly worse. I now have lung disease and gastrointestinal problems made worse by stress. After 8 weeks on sick note, I couldn’t cope with the bullying to return with Special Delivery letters just before my sick notes expired. I was so ill I had no choice but to resign. I applied for the New ESA employment and support allowance and got it. You need to produce a sick note and full details of your illnesses. Before making a decision to leave, I spoke to ACAS who can help you negotiate with your employer how to make adjustments to your job to help which I highly recommend you do first. They were really helpful. My employer bullied me out in the end. The allowance is for 12 months. You will get support from the Job Centre to find a new job or they may determine that you are not well enough to work and continue the allowance. My 12 months is up in April and I was anxious about having to look for a new job because I can’t afford to retire. I have just found out that they will continue the support which is such a relief. I can now concentrate on my health. For the ESA is if you have been paying NI contributions or you may also consider applying for PIP.

[StormySky]

I was not offered ill health retirement, but was dismissed for ill-health. My employer was unable to make the adjustments recommended by occupational health (despite them implying they may do up until the point I was dismissed).

As with other replies my experience of that process was horrible.

I did the same as AJOC - applied for ESA, which I was awarded. Another good thing about ESA, that I don't think has been mentioned yet, is that it is possible to do 'permitted work'. The work has to be authorised by DWP (essentially they make sure tasks completed for the job don't contradict what was on the ESA assessment - so for me I have a flexible, remote job for an employer who is very supportive e.g. they installed speech to text software on my laptop and all team meetings are recorded so that people who are unable to attend can catch up). There are also restrictions on how many hours/earnings for permitted work.

[Jacko37 in reply to StormySky]

Thanks for your reply, I think that's where I am heading, being dismissed on capability, even though for the most part I am well capable of doing my job. Just can't get them to understand that at times things do get really difficult. I was even told once by occupational health that HR would want to get rid of me.

[StormySky in reply to Jacko37]

I am so sorry you are going through this.

Not sure if this is helpful, but I remember the consultant I saw around the time of my dismissal advising me stress would not be helping my condition, and her suggestion to concentrate on my health and to consider alternative employment. For me that was good advice.

I wish you all the best

[LilyInTheSun]

Sorry you are having to deal with this. I don't have any advice regarding retirement, but are there any other things you can try to make work more practical for you (at least in the meantime)? You've probably tried these, but just in case here are a few things I thought of:

- Do you have an HR team or a line manager or someone who could advocate for you a bit in getting some support? It doesn't sound like the company are being very accommodating, so is there someone else you could speak to? Even a colleague who might back you up?

- Would working from home be an option, even if it was only occasionally? That way you could better control the temperature.

- What's your setup in the office? Is it a large open-plan office? If so, are there areas that are less draughty or nearer a radiator that you could move to?

- Could you have a portable fan heater or oil heater near your desk to add some warmth?

- I find keeping my core warm makes such a huge difference with my Raynaud, so is there anything else you could do with clothing layers? Thermal layers can be really helpful, blanket scarves add a lot of warmth, and lots of people on here recommend wrist-warmers.

- Are there any other heating devices that might help? For example, you can get fingerless heated gloves that plug into the USB drive on your computer, to help keep your hands warm if you have to do typing. I think you can also get heated mousepads and heated chair covers. I use a Dreamland heat pad when sitting at my desk - it plugs into a normal electric socket under my desk, and I can have it on my lap to keep me warm. It's a bit more discreet than a heated blanket. In my last job, where I was in a draughty office, I used one of those long hot water bottles, and that helped too. You can also get heated gilets and socks and other items of clothing now, although I haven't tried them.

- Hot food and drinks help too - again it's about keeping your core warm.

- Are you on any meds for your Raynauds? They can make a big difference. And if you are, maybe speak to your consultant to see if there's anything else they can offer - any other meds or infusions that might help.

Even if your company isn't being very forthcoming with suggesting adjustments, there might be things you could suggest (/push for) that they'd agree to. And at least you'd know you'd tried everything you could to make it work.

I hope you're able to find a solution. Thinking of you.

[Jacko37]

Thanks for your reply. I work in a large open plan office where the temperature changes all the time. One minute it can be freezing and the next tropical, it's that change in temperature that really affects me. Working from home would be great but not an option for me. As for my consultant, think he has emigrated, totally useless. I am meant to have infusions twice a year for the raynaurds but it just doesn't happen these days. Sometimes I think that I would be better leaving my job myself, taking some time out and then looking for something else.

[KI2024]

Hi, it seems like you are not getting enough support from your employer. In my workplace ill health retirement will only be offered if you have less than 5 years to go till retirement and that is only if all avenues have been exhausted of trying to help support you to get back into work. You say you are office based- is there a requirement specific for your role or can the work be possibly done from home? If it is possible- then they should try to accommodate your request esp in colder months. You may have already done this but do check your hr policies for sickness/reasonable adjustments. I requested working from home for 3 days over 4 days but was told by my line manager that this won't be feasible as we need to do 60% in office and if I am unable to then I would need to contact HR - Who then referred me to occupational health which I was happy to do so as Rayauds/Sceleroderma you have to take one day at a time. Then through the OH they agreed my requests were reasonable and so my manager couldn't say nothing further and it works well for me. Weeks I am able to go in more - I try do that and weeks I can't then there is less pressure.

[Jacko37 in reply to KI2024]

You are so lucky that you are able to do that. Unfortunately, working from home would not be an option for me

[MizzyM]

HI there,

I Have been a carer for my husband for many years after his brain heamorage! I do all his applications etc for health related benefits. The applications etc can be rather daunting and confusing. I suggest that you make sure that you have as much written evidence of your situation, both physically and work related, before you start. There is advice on the CAB Website, who also offer personal advice and help.: citizensadvice.org.uk/benef...

To find out what you could apply for , the website is TURN 2 US.

For the actual application process, the website that is most comprehensive and helpful, is :

benefitsandwork.co.uk/ Their guides are most helpful.

They update their website regularly and there is a forum also.I do hope that it helps.

[Jacko37]

So sorry about your husband, things must be really tough for you both. Thanks for your reply, I will definitely look in to that.

[Nw6London]

hi there, I’m so sorry you’ve had to experience this. Whilst I can’t help with your HR claims, I could offer you a potentially helpful lifeline whilst you await (or take back) your outcome. I have very severe secondary raynauds and also work in the office. The AC and generally, the cool air causes me to go into attack. I have three things that are vital to my being comfortable at work. I could not go to the office without them:

1. Heated desk mat. You place it under your keyboard and switch it on throughout the day when you need some extra warmth. Currently mine is on as soon as I get in and off when I leave. It’s wide enough that it also heats your wrists too. I would honestly suffer before. I bought mine here and can vouch for this one completely!

heatka.co.uk/

2. I also get raynauds in my toes, and got their foot warmer. I put it on when I get into the office and change from my flats to heels. Lifesaver and brings my toes back to normal temperature quickly without discomfort.

From the same company above. I think they have a deal when you buy both.

3. Heated hand warmers from ookpa(?) you can buy these on amazon. I use them in meetings and to head out to lunch/when I leave the office. I buy the one with the highest capacity (about £40 each) and honestly these are all money well spent to reduce ulcers and further discomfort.

Good luck. I hope they help change your fortune.

also, one final tip… if you do believe you are going down the involuntary resignation route, I would suggest getting an employment lawyer who can help you understand your rights and help you navigate these conversations. HR is never there for the employee, but there to protect the company. Never nice having to engage in this process when it does come to it. They should also guide you, along with the information from SRUK, so that you’re not making a decision prematurely and not to your benefit at the time. (After all, why should you resign because you’re a burden to them?!! They can pay you to leave!)

It’s tough, hang in there!

[Jacko37 in reply to Nw6London]

Thank you for your reply, I'll certainly look in to the heated desk mat. I think you just get to the stage where you just can't fight anymore. Keep warm