con you have osteoarthritis all over and still have pmr

[arvine]

seems i feel both with chronic pain, muscles and joint pain daily , all day

[Bcol]

You can indeed, had OA for the last 40ish years. I don't find it that difficult though to distinguish which pains are PMR, OA or something else. Co-Codamol for OA which does nothing for PMR or neuropathic pain and Pred for PMR.

[arvine in reply to Bcol]

When you say co cofomol is that tylenol with codeine?

[Bcol in reply to arvine]

Think your equivalent is Tylenol 4. Mine are 30/500, 30 Codeine, 500 paracetamol, only on prescription.

[lkcreedon in reply to Bcol]

It's Ok to take Co-codamol and Pred ? I take Panadol Extra to help with OA. It seems to work

[Bcol in reply to lkcreedon]

Co-Codamol and Pred is fine together. Panadol Extra should also be fine as its Paracetamol and Caffeine, although there is some info that says Caffeine can worsen bone loss.

[lkcreedon in reply to Bcol]

Thanks Bcol. I will investigate the Co-codamol 🤗

[Nextoneplease in reply to arvine]

I have OA and have a prescription for 15mg codeine and 500mg paracetamol. Have been on it for maybe twenty years - and like Bcol, I’ve learned to tell the difference between PMR and OA (although I didn’t find it easy at first)

[arvine in reply to Nextoneplease]

Thank you, and can you tell me what differnces in pain have you found between osteoarthritis and pmr please?

[Nextoneplease in reply to arvine]

OA (in my experience at least) feels sharper and more distinctly in the joints eg left knee gives way if I don’t stand exactly right, and right shoulder and wrist hurt like **** if I so much as try to slice a loaf or put on a seat belt. PMR is overall stiffer and is a constant ache that gets better/worse during the day.

But mainly: OA responds to cocodamol, whereas PMR responds to pred….

Really hard to describe so I hope this helps xx

PS OA should show up on x rays, PMR doesn’t really, although I believe it can be seen on PET scans in some circumstances. These are rarely done for PMR in theUK though.

[arvine in reply to Nextoneplease]

Thank you yes have same priblem using right hand to cut sandwich or unscrew lids off a jar, but rather than ache I would describe muscle pain as a hurting feeling, inflamed even does subside very slightly late day but returns full firce early evening

[Nextoneplease in reply to arvine]

Hi arvine 😊

Do you think the muscle pain could be PMR ? OA is more usually felt in the joints, although it can cause often referred pain in muscles and tendons etc.

Also, do you have aids ? My favourite ones are jar openers ( I like the silicone pad type), key turners ( a hard pad that fits on your door key and makes it easier to turn) and soft close sink taps. All these and many others help to protect your joints from strain….

All the best x

[arvine in reply to Nextoneplease]

Well my symptons when diagnosed back in 2016 were stiffness and pain, at that time couldnt raise arms, brush teeth, hair or hardly get dressed , so shoulders , arms mainly, this doesnt feel quite the same, except do have the priformis muscle syndrome on right right side most noticeable, , it s like you have to self diagnose these times, and yes have looked into thise aids you refer to, havent gotten yet, everything you do seems to be such an effort and exhausting

[Nextoneplease in reply to arvine]

Certainly your original symptoms sound like PMR arvine. If you now also have OA, I can only say that I’ve found those small helpful gadgets like jar openers to be wonderfully helpful. Once you’ve got them, they really do help to take some of the strain 😊

[arvine in reply to Nextoneplease]

Yes I think they would be, thank you

[herdysheep in reply to Nextoneplease]

I agree. I have a lot of round door handles in house which are becoming hopeless - gradually changing to oval or lever. Most taps are now lever. Have 3 types of jar opener! Wouldn't be without any of them

[Nextoneplease in reply to herdysheep]

Agree - round door handles are a nightmare! I find these small adaptations as helpful in their own way as grab handles and stair rails 😊

[PMRpro Ambassador in reply to herdysheep]

I would love one that actually works for me!!!

[herdysheep in reply to PMRpro]

I couldn't chose just 1 - depends on the hands on the day!

[PMRpro Ambassador in reply to herdysheep]

Haven't found 1 of any use any day as yet!!

[Pixix in reply to PMRpro]

Nor me! S x

[Countrykitten in reply to Bcol]

Same here. Juvenile idiopathic arhritis in teens then OA from twenties on..Co codamol 30/500 only thing that really helps pain..Rheumy said my 'widespread advanced OA' was confusing PMR diagnosis but, like you and others here, I can certainly feel the difference. Some 'experts' say Co codamol doesn't help arthritis......tell that to our horrible bodies!!!

[Bcol in reply to Countrykitten]

Naproxen was the only other one that worked for me but it's a no no with Pred. (NSAID)

[piglette]

I am afraid it is possible.

[Pixix]

Oh, yes, very definitely! I’m just discussing, with my Doctor, which joints to choose to inject this winter, & in what order. My worst pain is right thumb, atm, & is making life very difficult, as I have a bad tremor in my left hand! Can’t lift a mug/glass with either right now! I have had PMR for 4 years, & have arthritis in both thumbs, 4 fingers, knee, hip, toes, especially big toes, & ankles. I would say that my PmR pains have been achey, muscles are the problem. But OA is a very bad pain in my joints. NOT muscles. The two are quite different. For me, Polymyalgia is a chronic pain (mostly), while arthritis pain is acute.

[Countrykitten in reply to Pixix]

Will they do injections now you're on Pred? I've been told I can no longer have steroid injections in hip/shoulder/knee because I'm already full of steroids!!!

[PMRpro Ambassador in reply to Countrykitten]

Utter rubbish. Who told you that? The localised more concentrated effect of injections is totally different to the more diffuse effect of oral pred and one doesn't greatly affect the other, Many of us have had steroid injections for localised problems.

[Countrykitten in reply to PMRpro]

Two different Physios!!! (At different clinics) This is obviously what they are being taught these days. I don't know if it makes any difference that I have Depomedrone injections rather than oral pred, but you actually have less steroids that way. I avoid Physios where possible. I know there are good ones but I've had some bad experiences.

[PMRpro Ambassador in reply to Countrykitten]

They want to learn more about PMR then don't they. Longterm pred may not be good but until the NHS offers an alternative, if you have PMR, pred it is. i.m. depomedrone is supposed to reduce cumulative dose and adverse effects.

[Pixix in reply to Countrykitten]

Yes, of course. I’ve had them throughout the 4 years I’ve had 0MR! I’ve had thumbs, wrists, toes, heels, hips, coccyx & probably a few more body parts that I’ve forgotten!

[Pixix in reply to Countrykitten]

sorry, just read your other bit…whoever to,d you that’s is talking complete rubbish, I’m afraid! Ah, not a Dr, I see, physios. I’m sure, if your Dr feels you need a steroid injection you will have one! My injections are always depo medrone. When I need more than 2 sites done at once it’s a bit different, as it doesn’t go into a specific joint…but it still happens…I’ve had them while on at least 10mg pred.

[Countrykitten in reply to Pixix]

Thanks. I'm glad you can get yours. Unfortunately, IF you manage to see a Dr here ( only get to see ever changing Locums) with anything joint related they automatically refer you to Physio attached to the practice. If he thinks you need more than exercises he sends you on to MSK where they say you can't have more injections..........At least I now have the same nurse to administer my four weekly Depo injections, so some continuity of care.

[Pixix in reply to Countrykitten]

The wait to see a Dr at my surgery, for routine & no emergency, is 6 weeks. I’ve waited 3 months to be able to get a slot to have my depo medrone injection. There’s no way you could get monthly ones done in the UK, I don’t believe. We all have to be grateful for what we can get! Especially if it’s free. Now that I’m suffering from/with Polymyalgia, Osteoarthritis in hands, hips & feet, Trochanteric bursitis on left side Sciatica on right side, Fibromyalgia, Familial high cholesterol, Asthma, Hypertension, Hypermobility, Essential tremor, Orthostatic hypotension, Coccydinia & Haemangioma, spinal, I do get good attention from my Dr, if I need help. I guess I get extra attention, sometimes, as the normal appointment is 10 minutes here, & my Dr gives me 30 minute appointments, one time it was over an hour!

[Countrykitten in reply to Pixix]

I am in UK. My four weekly Depo injections are intramuscular instead of oral pred which I cannot tolerate because of stomach problems.

[Pixix in reply to Countrykitten]

ah, I beg your pardon! I thought it was on,y inthe US where people could get injections instead of oral pred. Glad they found an alternative for you, great news!

[PMRpro Ambassador in reply to Pixix]

The original concept came from Dasgupta. In Southend ... Several on the forum have had them.

[Pixix in reply to PMRpro]

Very interesting. I’d love to get depo medrone monthly through winter, but that wouldn’t be for my PMR, really, as I’m just about down to 1mg now. But it’s not helping Country Kittens arthritis in hip, shoulder & knee, just the PMR. Not sureiunderstandthat, as I’m going to have depo medrone to help arthritis. Perhaps it’s different dosage strengths?

[RachelJDH]

Interestingly I have only just worked that out. I have OA in my right shoulder and am waiting for a replacement. I was getting awful muscle cramps and pain in my right arm and thought it was an extension of the effects of OA. Then I realised that no pain killer was touching it and I was unable to sleep so I have increased my pred to 14mg from 11 and the improvement has been v marked. I then remembered my last flare included lots of cramp/pain in my thigh muscles. Dah!

[Heron82]

I find that the methotrexate I was prescribed for steroid sparing also helps with the OA pain.

[jls93]

Yes,I have both. "Arthro" = joint, "itis"=inflammation. Many flavors of each.

ie:rheumatoid, osteo, gouty to name a few