to use B12 or not to

[130396]

hello all

My B12 is in range at 409(150-640) but I have burning skin sensations.

So should I start taking B12 or could the burning skin just be anxiety?

Also my format is 4.8(3.5-20)

TIA

[wedgewood]

I somehow think that given that the skin-burning sensation is the only symptom that you describe and that your B12 and folate appear to be in range , that you do not have a b12 deficiency . ( must say though that it’s possible to have b12 deficiency and be within range )

Why not treat with B12 and see if the skin burning goes away ? If it doesn’t , you should see your GP. You can do no harm — you cannot overdose on B12 , which is good to know .

Best wishes .

[130396 in reply to wedgewood]

Folate is only just in range though.

[wedgewood in reply to 130396]

Well , either eat more fruits and vegetables that contain high folate ( citrus fruit is good) or supplement with a modest 400 mcg of folic acid The same dosage as for pregnancy . Dont go overboard , as you can overdose on folic acid ( vitaminB9 )

[Bellabab in reply to wedgewood]

Please say how its possible to overdose on folate and what effect that would have!

[wedgewood in reply to Bellabab]

Well , taking a large doses of folic acid -say over 1 mg daily for several months apparently causes. symptoms like nausea , diarrhoea, confusion , skin reactions irritability . Of course individuals will vary .

The natural folate found in fruit and veg cannot be overdosed .

[Bellabab in reply to wedgewood]

I cannot find any confirmation of that in BNF and I do not experience any of those symptoms from 5mg daily. Indeed 15mg doses are suggested for some conditions. Folic acid is also water soluble just as B12 is, so I expect the same argument applies. Having said that I intend to drop down to 5mg every other day in about a months time.

I agree that getting it from our diet is preferable when possible. I used to grow French beans, runner beans and broad beans and eat quite a lot every day. I am unable to grow them now and developed a severe deficiency when I stopped. I am concerned about people having too little folate as this will reduce the amount of B12 their body is using.

[wedgewood in reply to Bellabab]

Yes , but B12 can’t be overdosed , but B9 ( folate ) can . Yes both are water soluble .

[130396 in reply to wedgewood]

How can B9 be overdosed if water soluble

[wedgewood in reply to 130396]

It is a scientific fact that vitamin B9 , folic acid can be overdosed . Even though it is water soluble .If you look it up , you will see that it is the case . Vitamin B12 cannot be overdosed . The effects and how long it takes to overdose will vary from individual to individual.

[Bellabab in reply to wedgewood]

Where is this scientific fact! Its not in BNF as I have looked and done a search and every time I do so I find people guessing about what MIGHT be happening.

[OldmanD in reply to wedgewood]

I dont think anyone is suggesting that you cant overdose on B9 .. . . . I see bellabab write above that many are prescribed 5mg and in some cases 15mg and that is correct, many are. . . . I have also seen similar to what you say about B9 and that we should not take more than 1mg or less per day yet many have taken 5mg for years without side effects as I have and I have the whole heap checked every 6 months . . . . After having read a few different UK and Ireland guidelines as bellabab has quoted 5mg is pretty normal. .. . . To the extent I may go back to taking what I am prescibed as I ask when I was there this afternoon about 5mg perhaps being a bit too much and got told that is a normal dose for everyone with B12D as you cannot be getting low or your B12 wont work. . . . . . I am confident enough in my practitioners to leave it with them as such. . . . . . Anything is wrong my phone rings. . . . . I was there today again to get my liver function checked again as a month ago an element was one digit higher than it should be but was also told with near certainty that if I didnt need any antibiotics between then and today it would be back down but we still have to check. . . . . I have had many course of antibiotics over the winter but hopefully I will stay clear at least for a while now . . . . . .

[130396 in reply to OldmanD]

Can low folate cause anxiety & burning skin

[wedgewood in reply to OldmanD]

It has always been cautioned on this forum not to overdose on Folic acid . I have several references to overdosing and its dangers . Of course different people will have different tolerances .

normal

[OldmanD in reply to wedgewood]

I dont disagree with you that this 1mg advice exists but it may not be for everyone and may not be agreed with in every instance

If my GP and others prescribe B9 in 5mg and my blood s done every 6 months who am I to roll with. . . . . Bear in mind of course that my GP's believe in such a thing as B12D so should be clued up on the subject. . . . . .

Here is the intro to my 1st search and is NHS info

To treat anaemia, the usual dose for adults and children over 1 year old is 5mg, taken once a day. Sometimes the dose is increased to 15mg a day. If your child is under 12 months old, the doctor will use your child's weight to work out the right dose.

[OldmanD in reply to wedgewood]

Just to add. . . . . You are one of thee most helpful folk on here and I would not wish you stop your postings or answers. . . . . Nor do I wish to offend. . . . . I have read all we wrote and I dont think I have done so but just in case I have please be assured that is not what was meant to be. . . . . . So keep up the good work you been doing. . . . So many folks need your repeated answers . . . . . Repeating is tedious but we see newbee;s every few days and they need the same info time and again. . . . .

[130396 in reply to wedgewood]

What are the effects of too much folic acid?

I am planning on taking FOLINIC acid

[wedgewood in reply to 130396]

I don’t know anything about folinic acid .

If you have low B12 , it is inadvisable to take folic acid before rectifying B12 deficiency . because it can mask B12 deficiency.

[130396 in reply to wedgewood]

I don’t think I’m B12 deficient but not almost top of range as it should be

[130396 in reply to wedgewood]

My B12 is mid range

[130396 in reply to wedgewood]

I have been told to start with folic acid to bring levels up then check B12 & folate before deciding on adding B12

[wedgewood]

If that is your doctor’s advice , I would follow it .

[130396]

it’s not advice from my Dr

[OldmanD]

From the day in early 2020 I got my blood taken which got me diagnosed with B12D I was prescribed 5mg of folic acid and have been ever since. . . . . . I cut down to EOD a few months ago I think it was but have never had any adverse effects or quoted symptoms. . . . . . . I have been on Iron , off Iron several times during the last 4 years. . . . .

[130396 in reply to OldmanD]

Do you take B12 too?

[OldmanD in reply to 130396]

I inject B12. . . . . . And a little B1 and a little more B2 and even more B6 but B12 is ongoing. . . . . . . I seem to absorb B9 just fine or at least I am not low on it, . . . . .

[130396 in reply to OldmanD]

Can it help burning skin pain

[OldmanD in reply to 130396]

Doesnt jump out at me as being a symptom. . . . . Tinglings yes. . . . . Burning pain I dont have and dont know anyone whp suffers from such even outside of B12D sufferers

[130396 in reply to OldmanD]

Many adults and kids who have B12 deficiency report experiencing paresthesia, a burning or pins-and-needles sensation in certain areas of the body like the hands and feet.

[wedgewood in reply to 130396]

Ditto -I have terrible burning in both feet . Never stops or abates . It’s irreversible now . Treated too late .

[130396 in reply to wedgewood]

Mine is burning skin

[wedgewood in reply to 130396]

But where?

[130396 in reply to wedgewood]

Legs inner thighs arms hands chin chest

[wedgewood in reply to 130396]

P.A. Neuropathy is usually hands or feet . I’ve never heard of it over such an extended area . What does your doctor say about it ?

[130396 in reply to wedgewood]

Not a lot

[130396]

what does EOD mean?

[OldmanD in reply to 130396]

Sorry I hardly ever use that one . . . . . And I'll not use it again as it confused me when I first seen it. . . . . . Every Other Day. . . . .

[130396 in reply to OldmanD]

Folinic avvid used used for people on chemo

[OldmanD in reply to 130396]

Never heard of folonic acid

[Narwhal10]

Hi 130396,

I do not think others know that you have MPN nor your other medical conditions. So, live with a whole host of signs and symptoms not just skin-burning sensation as well as your medications. Plus, the anti-neoplastic medication which can impact your stomach.

I air on the side of caution and feel your individual case is beyond my knowledge and skills. I am so sorry. There is some research showing a correlation between MPN and B12 deficiency. It is only 58 people and they had their methylmalonic acid (MMA) and homocysteine levels were checked. Because with your particular illness measuring B12 via blood test tends to be high. See link :-

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/257...

Patients who had myeloproliferative disorders had a high prevalence of vitamin B12 deficiency, despite high serum vitamin B12 levels.

Maybe ask your Specialist Nurse could they order these MMA and homocysteine tests for you. Sorry, again.

😘

[OldmanD in reply to Narwhal10]

Narwhal to the rescue. . . . . . All homework done, boxes ticked as always. . . . . . How do you get the wherewith-all do it. . . . .

[130396 in reply to OldmanD]

??????

[Narwhal10 in reply to 130396]

I think, although I may be wrong, (which happens) that OldmanD meant by where with it all means knowledge and resources at your disposal.

So, my biological father was a GP studying anaesthetics and I read his medical books (anatomy, physiology etc) as a teenager because that is my idea of fun. I was a Software Engineer, so can read masses amount of information and then became a Midwife. 🤷‍♀️

[130396 in reply to Narwhal10]

I don’t have a specialist nurse.

Do you mean that my blood might show a good level of B12 in my blood ?

Can I get that MMA test done privately? I’m in uk

[Oneash]

Considering the way B12 and B9 work hand in hand in the body, if you are prescribed high amounts of B9, I would have thought B12 would help. Sunshine vitamin D important too. But if you don't have absorbancy issues, liver paté, 2 eggs a day, oily fish etc. will give you your necessary B12. Venison liver is the paleo superfood for both B12 & 9.

[130396 in reply to Oneash]

I do use D oral spray every day. I also have MPN . See link below. It explains my condition and B12 issues

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/257...