I'm having some early and well as middle of the night insomnia. Melatonin, I mg helps often just to fall asleep, but I usually wake up two hours later and then dont fall asleep again or one or hour. Tried Benadryl twice and got inconsistent results. Besides Benadryl is not advised for anyone over 65 and did cause "restless leg syndrome." Does anyone have any suggestions? Thanks in advance for any help.
Need help with Insomnia : I'm having some... - Kidney Disease
Need help with Insomnia
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drmind
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Bet117NKF Ambassador
I have taken chewable
Melatonin 5mg and read for a bit when I have had insomnia or waking up during the night and and it has helped. I also keep some of the aromatherapy lotions from Bath and Body Works near by there is one for Sleep which have been great.
As far as the Benadryl, ask your doctor about its use as it can leave you groggy when you wake up as well as the restless leg syndrome that you mentioned.
Hope this helps!
Thanks for the tip about aromatherapy. I know lavender is noted to induce sleep. Is the 5mg Melatonin youre taking the slow release one? Usually, if I take anything over 1 mg of Melatonin. I get a rebound effect and stay awake longer. Its nuts,I know. Been reading about the time release Melatonin, but there seems to be more warnings about taking it for any length of time than any for the plain Melatonin.
I'm never going to take the Benadry again. Phew. It was weird and there are warnings that it causes cognitive problems in the elderly. I then remembered that many years ago when I worked at a hospital, a neurologist who worked with our staff was doing research with Benadryl and told all of us not to take it as it leads to cognitive decline. Life is such a crap shoot.
Anyway, I did not fall asleep until 4:30 am last night. I know this is so unhealthy. When I get my 7 or 8 hours. I have so much energy I can paint the house if it needed it. I'm in another world when I have my rest.
Anyway Bet. Thanks for sharing. I have lavender spray and sachets that I'll try using. I guess I shouldn't be complaining about insomnia when others are dealing with other serious issues. Thanks again.
Hi drmind,
You are not complaining! Don't be silly! And no thanks ever needed.
Whatever the root; having to "function" when sleep deprived is totally frustrating.
The Melatonin; I buy it at Wal-Mart of all places. They are 5 mg tablets; flavored. I will suck on the tablet and read a bit which usually helps. I also deep breathe.
I have also had a hot cup of herbal tea before I go to sleep or if I wake up.
Chamomile is great; many brands are good. Regular or organic. "Sleepy Time "by Celestial Seasons, "Caramel Bedtime" ( Yogi) are are among others that both myself and one of my friends have used.
I buy them in the supermarket or a health food store.
Give it a try. Read while you are sipping it.
As far as the Benadryl; you bet it's a crap shoot as I am sure that it yields more than cognitive decline.
The unfortunate thing is it is in many of the over the counter sleep aids as well.
Tylenol PM was also discouraged as too much Tylenol is not liver friendly and Advil PM is an absolute no.
As far as -Lavender great! I have Bath and Body works Lavender Chamomile body lotion in the house. Smells wonderful. If you have a sachet, put it near your pillow and see how that works. Your bedroom will smell wonderful as well.
Hopefully this insomnia will wan; or appear once in a while and one of these thoughts will help. Give it a try.
Please let me know how this works. Happy to talk.
Positive thoughts!
Bet
I've had trouble falling asleep and staying that way for years. This is what I use, 2 5mg of melatonin, Unisom, Tylenol extra strength. Sometimes if that doesn't work, then another Tylenol and maybe more of the other two OTC sleep aids or some Nyquil. I know sounds like a lot and i fully expect to one day overdose on OTC sleep meds. Just kidding. One more thing that has helped. I've learned to "clear my mind" of thoughts that might interfere with getting or staying asleep. Breathe in, breathe out, Learn to meditate during the day and then use it at night. Good luck
Wow, that's a lot of OTC meds but if it works and it helps you, so be it. I could never take all those OTC meds as my nephrologist would never approve.
You so right about putting worries aside because somehow the night has a way of making them feel worst! I try to do it and I do some meditation as well. I will look into more.
Thanks for sharing your experience. This insomnia is so weird that when at 4:00 am in the morning and one is still.awake, you're tempted to do anything to get some sleep. Best to you
Unisom and Nyquil are the exact same as Benadryl and are very toxic drugs.......cognitive decline, RLS. Tylenol is known to be VERY bad for the kidneys. I am surprised at your doctor. I totally agree with the meditation.
I'm really not sure why you mention this OTC meds [Unisom and Nyquil] and my doctor suggesting I use it. I never took these meds and my doctor never recommended them. I guess you may be responding to someone else's post?? In any event, I took Benadryl two times last week and noted in a posted that I was never taking it again. My doctor never recommended Benadryl as I haven't seen him yet and I've never discussed insomnia with him yet.
Right now, I'm concentrating on diet and I'm looking into another diet than the one I'm on now. Best to you....
Tylenol may be ok for CKD, but it's rough on the liver.
Good luck getting a good sleep
Yes it is but not getting enough sleep is hard on the body and mind. It's all about choice. At my age I make different choices than I would have 10 or so years ago.
We all make choices. I just mentioned it in case you didn't know. My friend took a lot of Tylenol for a bad back and died of liver failure in her late 30s. Very sad, it sounds so safe.
Sophie you are so right. I did know about the liver and I'm careful with how many I take. Usually no more than 2 in any 24 hour period. During the day I live with the pain, at night it's harder and it interferes with my sleep. Many years ago I took handfuls of Tylenol & nsaids every night for pain. I stopped that and stuck with Tylenol which my neph approves of. All meds sound so safe until we learn they are not.
Hi Sophie: everything in moderation, but I do understand when the insomnia drags on until the wee hours you'd do anything to get to sleep. I rarely take tylenol if ever. I've never been a medication person and just dislike taking meds now for BP and vitamin D/calcium and magnesium.
Again, I thank everyone for sharing their experiences. It's a great feeling to have everyone's support and know there's a bunch of people out there that cares. Best..
Hi drmind, You need some good sleep. My whole day is a mess if I don't sleep at least fairly well. I found these non-medication recommendations in this link to help with sleep and fatigue from chronic kidney disease.
bcrenal.ca/our-research-sit...
For me, if I nap during the day that is going to mess up my night sleep. I also exercise in the morning or afternoon hours. It is really hard for me to change my habits and routines. I need to try and go to bed and wake up at the same time. If you haven't already tried some of the non-medication ideas, it may be worth a good try and then if that doesn't work ask your physician for a medication to help.
Sara
Hi drmind,I also just found this video where Dadvice talks about CKD and insomnia. He says RLS/iron deficiency, sleep apnea, high toxins in the blood, and stress/emotions can cause insomnia in CKD. He’s not a doctor but he may have some good advice.
Thanks for all the tips. I don't nap and never have. I also try to go to sleep and wake up at the same times every day. But, because of the heat where I live, I stopped walking my one mile a day. So, you reminded as well as others that exercise is important. Will try to get it started again soon. However, I'm pretty active at home even though I'm old. I'm always doing something in the house that needs attending as I'm not one to just ever "sit around." Anyway, it was so nice to have your support and tonight with all the help I've gotten so far, I'll be smiling as I try to get back in the sleep groove.
BassetmommerNKF Ambassador
HI drmind, I also take 2.5 melatonin. Any more than that it makes for weird dreams, and I wake up. I guess that's the rebound. I have a lot going on right now and I also have winter blahs and so my sleep is not as good as it should be. I wake up multiple times in the night. Exercise helps and on the days I go to the pool, I sleep much better. I try not to worry about it when I wake up and I stay in bed and solve the issues of the world. (Just joking) But I hate those nights when a good worry gets the best of me. I know I am not helping you much as others. Just thought it would be comforting to know you are not alone. Maybe we should all get online and chat in the middle of the night. 
I love the idea of an insomnia chat online in the middle of the night. Sounds like fun. And it really helps to know I'm alone.
About the dosage of Melatonin: working for years as a psychologist, I learned from sleep specialists that the lowest possible dose is what works, such as 0.5 mg! The more you take, the more the likelihood of the rebound effect. Its always hard for me to reason with this, but many times during the middle of the night, I take half of the l mg and fall fast asleep. Yet, when you go to sleep centers as my sister did a few years, they recommended very high dosages of Melatonin, but I never got to ask her if it was the Melatonin, slow release item. I "think" those start at 5 mg dosages and then go up. This never helped my sister, She got into a horrible mess of just staying up all night with insomnia and not able to get up in the morning when she wanted to get up. The sleep center at Northwestern Hospital in Chicago put her on high doses of Melatonin and had her use a bright white special light in the morning. Nothing helped and she was miserable. Sometimes, I worry that I may follow this pattern. Fingers crossed.
Its very likely that Melatonin reacts differently for various people. I know 0.5 mg or 1 mg works for me. Anything else then I'm wired. I have to get back to walking my one mile a day. I had to stop because of the heat here in Florida and waiting until it cools down only get the mosquitos biting.
And, you mentioned worry: isn't it odd that the night seems to intensify some simple worries that seem to not be so bad during the day. I have a pad near my bed and just jot down stuff that may come into play and get it out of my mind.
Tonight, Ill be exhausted, but I'm taking 0.5 mg of Melatonin, a cup of chamomile tea, and lots of lavender around me. Then, I'm going to try to mediate some as well as read and not try to sleep until I'm sleepy. Hoping it works tonight and tomorrow and the next day. Sweet dreams everyone.
I forgot; I now take my fish oil at night also since I read that is also can induce sleepiness. I tried lavender and had the worst nightmares with it. I also try not to drink anything after 7pm so I do not have to get up six times at night, only 2 times.
👍yes
Lavender gives me asthma and migraines, so I don't go near the stuff myself.
Oh, no. I just love the scent but dont as a rule spray it around. Sorry that you're dealing with so many issues....but its wonderful that you do so with a sense of humor!
I meditate once or twice daily for about 20 minutes. Half hour daily walk. Sometime I take Melatonin 5mg, Chamomile tea, Sleepy Time is great and a little lavender oil under my nose.
One other thing I do when all else fail is to count backwards 100 to 0.
Hope this is helpful 😊
Dear Win: It all helps....I forgot about the tea, but I will be drinking it tonight. I also have a lot of lavender around that I got for a friend who didn't need it as much anymore. I have sprays, sachets, soap, etc. and I love the scent. So, tonight I'll get it out and I'll try to mediate a little as well.
Odd that today I read in the military, they have gotten troops to sleep fast by having them count breathes and say "Don't think" whenever thoughts came in their head. Well, it worked for them and not me.
Thanks for you quick reply and helpful suggestions.
Hi drmind,
I've had insomnia since I was a kid. I've never gotten more than 3 hours sleep, maybe 4 if I take an Imitrex for a migraine. I never nap.
I quit fighting trying to get or stay asleep. As a kid I had a tv in my room and would watch movies or read under the blankets with a flashlight.
Now I listen to books on tape in bed. It distracts me, and sometimes I'll get back to sleep for 15 - 30 min. My book player has a sleep timer, so I know if I dozed off or not within the hour timer I set.
Trying to go to sleep is counterproductive for me. When I worked, I'd watch the clock and think "I have to be up in 4 hours, 3 hours, 2 hours" and hadn't slept yet. Some nights I'd get less than an hour and get up and go.
I'd be stressed without my books to listen to all night. My kitty Henry and I are very well read. We "read" 8 - 10 books per week.
It's something to try and it distracts you from thinking about not being able to sleep or stay asleep.
Soothing music might help, I just prefer books. I tried a noise machine where you listen to rain and the ocean. I shut that off quickly, it made me need to get up and pee!!! LOL
Good luck ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
Insomnia Kitty
You're too much. I know what you mean about working with just an hour or two of sleep. Did it often in my day. And, we survived! I used to love books on tape but did not think about it for insomnia. I would be best listening to the radio and may get my son to set it up with a timer. With the books, I'd stay up all night waiting to finish it. Years ago I'd often listen to books on tape traveling to different jobs around the state. And, I'd frequently wait in the parking lot to listen to the end of a chapter!! Thanks for the tip and take care. Give Henry a hug for me.
How is your Hg & iron panel values? Iron deficiency anemia causes restless leg syndrome which interferes with sleep. Chamomile tea & vitamin c have relaxing effects -may be good for sleep,
As far as I know, I do not have any anemia and my nephrologist is very careful to go over my labs which I get every six to seven weeks. Only Magnesium fell in the low normal range and I've been taking supplements for a few months now. I go for new labs on Monday and will see the doctor a week after that. Hopefully, he'll be able to determine if I need to treat anything.
With the Restless Leg Syndrome: I only had it one night after I took Benadryl which incidentally is known to cause it. Hoping I never get it again as its not very pleasant.
Thanks for the tip about anemia. Its possible that something may be starting as I had a big change in diet these last few weeks with considerable less animal protein than I had in the past. Wow, there is so much chemistry that we have to attend to with CKD!
Best to you...
Yes, Restless leg syndrome is related to a category of disorders known as movement disorders & is caused by iron deficiency anemia. The theory is that iron is a component of the inhibitory neurotransmitter that causes relaxation & prevents RLS & perhaps other movement disorders. So insomnia & restless legs may occur with anemia. I wonder if insomnia in the absence of RLS is related to this. Heme iron from animal foods is better absorbed than plant based iron so if on a plant based diet an iron supplement may be needed. Be well, paul
Thanks for this important information. My son has been telling me for a few weeks now that he thinks my diet has become too restrictive. I guess I'll be on some new supplements soon. I get new labs and see my nephrologist in the next week or two. I'll have lots to discuss with him. Hoping and expecting that some changes will take place soon. Again, thanks for this useful information.
It's something in your diet that is keeping you up. You have to troubleshoot and find out which foods/drinks it is.
Good Morning, British Man here
I will cut it short
*Stay a way from any kind of Caffeine related drinks (I know that you Americans loves to drink Black coffee ☕️ (yuk)
(We love to consume Tea with milk ,so less harm)
* Always read during the bed times
* Take a warm bath before the bed time if possible
* Try to forget argumentative issues in your life
* Calm music with headphones helps I guess
*****I'm suffering with Insomnia my self but because of some very powerful people trying to make me not to have a good night sleep, otherwise I have no sleeping problems *****
Hi there, I use a weighted blanket on my bed which helps me get to sleep. I also make sure my diet is good in terms of pre and probiotics. I also use a prebiotic supplement called bimuno. Scientific trial from the university of Colorado Boulder has shown it to be beneficial. I also find speciality bedtime herbal teas can help to relax my body and drift off. Hope this helps, insomnia is such a horrible problem so dont apologize for it.
Thank you. Isnt it weird how these weighted blankets work? I have a very heavy quilt that I occasionally throw over my light blankets and darn it works! It does help to get you asleep, but being in Central Florida it's not always a problem solver. I did do Chamomile tea last night with a 0.5 mg of Melatonin and fell asleep in 5 minutes. However, Melatonin only helps to get you asleep. It doesn't keep you asleep so I was up 3 hrs later. But, hey, that's few hours of good sleep.
Thanks again
DRINK 3 BEERS ABOUT 10 PM
long walks are probably the best medicine.
I know, but I have back problems and standing fir any length of time is painful. However, I have no pain sitting so I'm looking at recumbent bikes or just using a little Walker. Thanks for your support.
I have had insomnia all my life and have FINALLY found the solution. I take THC cannabis oil (6 mg) 2 hours before sleep time and it does the trick. I live in Canada and there is a team of doctors that prescribe it at Greenleaf medical Clinic (all online).It has changed my whole life. You could get it at a cannabis store.......THC.
I used to use Benadryl and anything else i could find out of desperation.
Now i might supplement the THC with a very small amount of trazadone and that's all i need.
I hope you have found a way to sleep again by now, but I thought I'd add my 2 cents.
I have tried every herb I heard about. I take prednisone for lupus, which tends to cause insomnia, plus I have borderline anemia from the lupus which doesn't help either. I find magnesium works for restless leg syndrome (and also for sleep) since the lupus is afraid of my red blood cells and isn't quite suppressed. Here's what works for me:
1. Tamezapam every 3rd night. It doesn't work if I take it more often and my doctor says it may cause cognitive decline in older people, but maybe not as much as chronic insomnia. I think it probably helps to not take the same thing every night anyway because your body adapts to most chemicals.
2. The other 2 nights: Much as I hate to take a drug that seems to also be a diuretic, at least 5 mg of diphenhydramine, an OTC sleep medication. This is half of the lowest dose pills I could find.
Also, 30mg of CBD oil, also theanine and ashwaganada. These are the ones that keep me asleep best; I seem to wake up more without them.
I also sleep better when I get in a half hour of aerobic exercise. Lavender doesn't help me (glad to read that it helps you). A rain noise machine helps.
Thanks for the info. I'll look into it, but it's been a lot better these last few weeks. It's nice to have the support and kindness of others on this forum. Its especially helpful when others can relate to your issues and share information.
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