PGTA? / Double transfers?

[rainbowbaby8320]

Hi everyone

I'm about to do a long protocol/another cycle... i've always been an advocate of PGTA... however, at my last cycle I had six eggs and only one was developing into blastocyst on day 5 so I just had it transferred....

I had a nasty miscarriage which went on for months previously (D&C to resolve!) so that's why I wanted to do PGTA - I'm nearly 42 and it wastes time as well when you miscarry... after the miscarrige I did another cycle and used PGTA and the one which tested as euploid was transferred - and as a result of that not working, I discovered I have some sort of auto immune issue... so it was useful in that way as well...

My current clinic are saying if I add PGTA to my cycle and then opt out of it at the last minute (due to low numbers), they will still charge me for caremaps (£1k)? which seems unfair/not what the other clinics are doing...?

I just don't know whether to do it or not because of the number of embryos I might end up with? On the other hand, i'm running out of money and may not be able to afford more cycles after this anyway? So maybe timewasting in a MC won't be relevant?!

I just wanted to see if anyone else had any comments or thoughts to share? Should I start doing double transfers!? I'm scared of miscarrying because of it being 'twins'... not to mention the extra stress as a single mum of looking after them?

[Keepondreaming]

hi

I’m sorry I can’t answer much of this here, we have also just been told to consider PGtA if we get a good number of embryos, however I have very low AMH and so far we have only ever had 3 embryos from 5 cycles. So I can’t imagine this is going to be able to go ahead. Do you feel it’s worth it?

We were also advised they would do a double transfer (if we have more than one to transfer) next cycle. We were advised to read etch this. The research seems so conflicting. The clinic indicated there’s a higher songlenlive birth rate with a soluble transfer but I can’t find information on this I can only find info on the risks of double transfer and trying to keep multiple births low. Have you found any info?

I hope someone is able to help you more than I am. Wishing you lots of luck xx

[rainbowbaby8320 in reply to Keepondreaming]

Hey

I think you can see the better rate with rates for embryo “transfer” vs embryos “transferred”… it implies more than one sometimes on the embryo transfer rates whereas embryo transferred rate is only one embryo… I think I’ve seen that the rates for embryo transfer are slightly better? X

[rainbowbaby8320 in reply to Keepondreaming]

I’m not sure it’s worth it! Wish I had a crystal ball… if I experience another miscarriage I might be annoyed with myself ?

[Keepondreaming in reply to rainbowbaby8320]

I know, how much we wish we had a crystal ball. Sending baby dust to u! Thanks for the tip above re transfers xx

[Boo718]

hello we were only ever charged for the embryos that’s tested. If there were none tested there was no charge. If u are unsure about twins I honestly wouldn’t do a double transfer. I know people say one might work if you transfer two but you have to be prepared for 2 xxx

[rainbowbaby8320 in reply to Boo718]

yes I think you are right! I need to think about that carefully! X

[Tir-26]

Has your Dr suggested a double transfer? Sorry I’m much help but I can relate to your post, it’s so hard to know and time just passes so quickly.

[rainbowbaby8320 in reply to Tir-26]

She said I could have that if I want to… 🤔

[Tir-26 in reply to rainbowbaby8320]

That’s what my Dr said to me too, that it was an option 🤔

sorry im not much help and wish you well with your decisions, sincerely hope it all works out for u and us all.

[Rainbow2023]

Hi, our clinic have pushed us to go for PGT-A despite number of embryos. This is mainly due to my age (just turned 42) and history.

In our first cycle last year (aged 40) we suffered an early miscarriage with our best quality embryo. We decided to test the remaining 5 we had frozen and only 1 came back normal, but later didn’t implant.

We are in the process of embryo batching and assuming we have embryos at the end of Day 5 we will have them tested before transfer. Not going to lie I’m still in two minds about the testing given the risks but like you say at 40+ time is not on our side and the thought of dealing with another miscarriage is just not worth it.

I can’t comment on a double transfer sorry - in our first cycle we were given the choice but opted for 1 as it was our very first try. Given where I am now, I will seek guidance from our consultant this time if we are fortunate to have more than 1 to consider.

All the best x

[rainbowbaby8320]

I think I’m going to ‘do it’… however it’s way more cost for me - £3k frozen cycle transfer + £1k PGTA … I didn’t do a multi cycle fee as I wasn’t sure whether the auto immune drugs would work and if they don’t, there is no point in continuing anyway… (I’ve got high NK cells and cytokines not normal)… previously after implantation I got a rash where I think my body was rejecting the embryo/blocking it

[Doodlebug23 in reply to rainbowbaby8320]

Hi,

After my 4th transfer I ended up with a rash pretty much all over my body that my Dr put down to sun which is ridiculous as I’ve always been a sun person and the rash actually got better if anything in the sun. Did you get diagnosed that’s what your rash was? What did it look like?

[rainbowbaby8320 in reply to Doodlebug23]

That’s garbage! It’s an auto immune issue x they checked my NK cells and they are high and also my cytokines ?

I had breast implants which I think have messed up my immune system (just had them removed!!) have you got implants?!

The rash looks like a fungal infection and when they take the breast implants out they find mould in them!

Sadly I only started discovering what was wrong after I used up good embryos and eggs…

[Doodlebug23 in reply to rainbowbaby8320]

I have had 5 transfers and only had the rash once. My GP didn’t consider IVF A factor and my clinic didn’t show interest in the rash either. I don’t have implants. I did have one GP say he thought my rash was fungal though…..

[rainbowbaby8320 in reply to Doodlebug23]

It was the last one that you had the rash on wasn’t it? The issues in my body had been going on for a long time before the rashes… so at the time of the rashes I thought maybe they are like melasma and something good is happening!

My rash got worse on each transfer… I think it’s started to fade since explant! All the other symptoms have cleared as well… I had breathing difficulties… I just didn’t think all these things were the same issue/related until now! / after explant!

Maybe you have fungus in your body from something! Sure that’s what happened with me x if you look up symptoms of mould poisoning maybe you have some of the other ones? It might be due to other chemicals though - they say these things can be triggered by pesticides or other chemicals in our environment x

[Doodlebug23 in reply to rainbowbaby8320]

No I got it wrong sorry. Transfers 1 to 3 I was fine. Transfer 4 afterwards it appeared after a couple of days. Tried all sorts of creams including steroid plus antihistamines that did buggar all. I asked for oral steroids and it’s now started clearing. Not got worse after transfer 5 either. My iron is really low so GP says that can cause skin to be more sensitive…

[rainbowbaby8320 in reply to Doodlebug23]

Hmmm I think it’s like mine -,it’s appearing when the baby is trying to implant! Mine only happens after implantation… on the pgta euploid one, I got morning sickness for about one day… then the rash appeared and all other preg symptoms started dying off! I think it’s a reaction to the embryo trying to become established? I feel like the doctors have no clue sometimes… they are still checking my rash… going to test my blood for mould poisoning! X

I hope it doesn’t happen to you on any more cycles x

What were the outcomes of your ETs? Have you had any positives?! Mine were all negative which is another clue I think… not even chemicals- just nothing!

[rainbowbaby8320 in reply to Doodlebug23]

also I was checked by nhs rheumatology dept for other bits (brain fog , dry eyes etc…)

Text for blood clotting disorder came back slightly high but he dismissed it as only mildly positive - he was a moron … after testing at ivf clinic they are prescribing blood thinners…

The thing that was positive was anti phospholid syndrome and a woman with same test result as me had several mc in a row! See Facebook group for that!

[rainbowbaby8320 in reply to Doodlebug23]

best advice I can give is don’t let them waste your embryos!!

[rainbowbaby8320 in reply to Doodlebug23]

sorry also there is a medical paper somewhere that I saw noting that this is a rare problem but they have noted it in several women - the rash at implantation x they don’t understand it x

I think there is garbage toxins in my body everywhere from the implants and my body is confused between my (or my babies’) tissue, and my own…

Try and consider if you have anything in your life your body is not a fan of - mould in your house? Chemicals? Anything ?!

[CazzyM]

hi!

No advice really just wanted to tell you my experience.

I’m 40 and had pgta on 5 embryos. 3 came back ok. I’m now nearly 21 weeks pregnant after first transfer. I have no health issues and I’m pretty fit and active.

In my case I knew I wanted to rule out as many variables of it not working as possible. That’s why I had pgta. I went through the whole dilemma of how many to pay for. What happens to the ones that are no good. What if I mess up my chances and they get damaged Etc etc etc. it’s just horrible. IVF is so hard. I felt completely like a fish out of water and the clinic, same one as you are using, were very clinical and didn’t really help with emotional side of things really and didn’t realise this isn’t like something people just do on a whim with never ending money.

I think you’re in a tricky situation. There’s no right or wrong answer. Sometimes you just have to decide what’s best with the info you have and put your faith in it and hope for the best. Best of luck with everything xx

[rainbowbaby8320 in reply to CazzyM]

That’s a good rate of quality! Can I ask what you were eating etc? 😊

[Blessed5510]

wow! That is so unfair for them to charge you the extra fee if you don’t have any 5 day blasts. Unfortunately it’s all about making the money for these clinics, nevermind the pain and hard ache of their patients. We decided to do testing, we are using DE. On our 1 cycle with DE out of 6, 3 made it to day 5 but only 1 was normal. We transferred that one but miscarried. This cycle we had 10 DE, but we used Zymot ( a procedure where they pick the sperm with the lease amount of DNA fragmentation), i think it was the sperm last time because my husband has very bad numbers. This time out of 10, 8 fertilized, 6 made it to blast and 4 were normal and 2 were mosaic. We haven’t did a transfer yet, but think that helped.

Praying everything works out for you!!! Hang in there! You are stronger than you think!

[Doodlebug23 in reply to Blessed5510]

That worries me as I’m using DE but never considered PGTA as just assumed that as the donor is young and blasts are all very good grade that they would be ok….

[MagicTourmaline in reply to Blessed5510]

Hi, just read your answer... I am just about to start a cycle in January and we are having the Zymot and the PGT-A... and was very pleased that you said you think Xymot made a difference... ❤️ it gives me hope... 🥰

[leo1980]

only wanted to say I am not opposed on the double transfers. I had both over the years single and double and my only positive ever was on a double transfer. Still too soon to say if it’s viable. On the PGT - had PGT embryos transferred and didn’t get a positive. On the cycle we had a BFP we did a double non PGT tested embryos (one embryo from 2018 and the other from 2021). I am 43. So only a spring chicken at heart and not the womb 🥰

Best of luck lovely!

[rainbowbaby8320 in reply to leo1980]

It’s lovely that you got your rainbow x I just wish it would happen for me 😌

[CyclingAddict]

I just got my embryos PGTA tested. For us it was the right decision because we'd had 4 failed transfers and 1 early miscarriage with untested embryos. We were lucky with numbers this time - 11 tested and 7 euploids. I signed up for PTGA testing well before egg collection as it was advised by our consultant, so I would have gone ahead and done it even if we only had 1 embryo to test. I was so tired of the heartache and time and energy invested in putting back embryos that were likely not viable that doing PGTA testing was the right decision for us.

As far as putting multiple embryos back, you need to do what's best for you and weigh up factors like age and previous experience. It's definitely something to raise with your consultant.

I also have an autoimmune (hashimotos) and was put on steroids before my last transfer (which resulted in a pregnancy for the first time). Really good that they spotted that you have an autoimmune disorder as it's worth addressing before you have another transfer.

Sending you luck and best wishes x

[rainbowbaby8320 in reply to CyclingAddict]

I think you have reminded me of why I wanted pgta and that was another reason - the heartache when they don’t work and you don’t know why… and going through unnecessary FET cycle - not to mention the money I wasted with that (potentially)… I’m sure some of my little babies would have been ok had it not been for my auto immune issue 😔

[CyclingAddict in reply to rainbowbaby8320]

I know that feeling all too well - they discovered I have an autoimmune condition after 4 failed transfers 😔. Really hoping you get some positive news and start some treatment for the autoimmune condition before the next transfer. Everything crossed for you! x

[rainbowbaby8320 in reply to CyclingAddict]

Thanks! Next one will be wit blood thinners and intralipids… if that doesn’t work there’s no point in continuing x

[Skittles11 in reply to CyclingAddict]

Sorry if this is a silly question but how do people learn whether they have an auto immune condition?

[rainbowbaby8320 in reply to Skittles11]

I learnt the hard way after failed transfers - when another PGTA tested embryo was transferred they said ok… there may be something going on here…

We learn the hard way because the clinics start off assuming everything is down to egg quality!

For me I also had a rash appearing after implantation - like my body is attacking the baby /it’s own cells - that’s the foundation of auto immune conditions - when the body attacks itself x

[CyclingAddict in reply to Skittles11]

Not a silly question at all! My consultant suggested I get my TSH levels checked. There was no indication that there was anything wrong with my thyroid (being very energetic with a healthy BMI and not suffering with the standard symptoms of fatigue, weight gain and hair loss) and my hormone levels are normal, but decided it was worth a shot because of my failed transfers. Results showed I have mild hashimotos - an autoimmune disorder that can increase the likelihood of early miscarriage. To deal with it I was put on steroids leading up to and after the transfer to reduce my immune function.

I think it can be quite hard to spot an autoimmune disorder if there isn't obvious symptoms. I ended up going private and they ran a lot more tests, which is helpful. Definitely speak to your consultant if you're worried about potentially having an autoimmune disorder. Good luck x