CATCH-UP CORNER...WEEK 4... Slip off those running shoes and come on inside. EVERYONE is welcome , because it is...

[Oldfloss]

Okay! Hands up all those who thought I had forgotten to open the Corner!

WELL, I hadn't !

Hello everyone...

Welcome to the Corner for this, the last week in April. I thought I would post this today as Next Sunday is the 1st of May

Where on earth did the weeks go ?

Certainly for me this month has passed so quickly, with a real buzz carrying me through! Got back home from the Coast just a while ago!

I have been getting the runs in, albeit sporadically at times and have reached a personal goal a tad early too I have, as I hope some of you have too, been trying to follow the advice of the last few weeks' posts; the Three As, and Kissing the Ground

I had a run yesterday which, as usual, gave me food for thought; it sort of reinforced my ideas about this last post for this month too. Musings coming up!

We do get many, many posts, I have read a fair few in this last week alone, ( not just from new runners either), about something that really does seem to cause a few problems for folk. We do it all the time, automatically and without thinking about it. Breathing!

It can impact greatly, on how we feel when we run, and although many of the posts on this, are from our new runners, it does crop up at various levels of running and to many of us, too. When the runs begin to get longer, in bad weather and particularly after illness, or a while away from running.

I, during my adult life have tended to over-breathe in stressful situations, and this in turn makes things worse. So, this is something I have probably, more than many folk, been aware of and had strategies for settling things down. As a result, when I began running, breathing was not an issue. I was so slow and steady, ( as I am now), that I was never moving that fast! I had plenty of other things to think about anyway!

But, building back, from Square 1, after some big blips over the last two years, I have been taking a lot more notice of the way I breathe on certain runs, ( not all the time), and having found out quite a lot about this, I have been using some strategies to try and improve my running style and comfort under certain conditions. It is exciting and interesting and I have already noticed some improvements in certain areas.

I have found through my research, a runner, ( online coach), whom I can relate too and who makes a lot of sense to me. I understand what he is trying to teach and I can follow the ideas. Which is good

This is ME and my running now...BUT, when we begin running, we do try to follow the advice given in our posts about, how to run C25K. The main thrust being, if you are struggling to breathe, then you are probably running too fast

The solution to that being, slow down.. Conversational pace, being able to talk but maybe not sing a song! We do give this advice and when people employ that very simple tactic, things can improve significantly.

There is a wealth of information around, and argument too, about nose breathing, mouth breathing, etc. etc., and it all gets very, very confusing!

I am not suggesting that anyone on the C25K programme tries to alter their breathing pattern if all is going well, ( we just do it, like blinking ), but, if you are struggling , then the first step, may be as simple as, just slowing down ! If the problem persists, then just ask and we may have some ideas between us on how to help!

One strategy that I have picked up from my findings, that really seems to work for me, is one used on a steady paced run, on road or trail and it fits in with my already established habit of counting.

Since doing C25K the first time around in 2015, I have always counted as I run, 1,2,3,4. The breathing pattern I am using now, just follows it... breath in for four steps, breathe out for four steps. Now, I am probably doing this for most of the time, but I have been focusing a little more on it, particularly on longer runs, and gosh, I am noticing the difference! I am trying a few more ideas too, on my hill runs and if I am feeling tired at the end of a run. It is early days, but it is such fun learning as I go.

Interesting eh?

Yesterday, however, I have to say, as I ran a Park Run on an open, sandy beach in Wales, in a really, really strong wind, I was totally unable to employ any useful strategies at all ! It was all I could do to just breathe!!! Puffing Snail does not even begin to describe it!!!

Maybe running into the wind will be on the next page?

I suppose in all my rambling here, what I am saying is, when we begin to run C25K we should try follow the advice given for our running breathing; if things get tricky, then again, follow the advice to slow it all down, and believe me, there is always slower, whatever you may think!

But, and this is probably the hardest bit for us all, try not to overthink it; if, how you breathe when running is working for you, then don't try to do anything different.

Later, as the runs get longer, and you move on from Graduation, running in Marathons or Triathlons you may then, wish to find a pattern which works for you in other running circumstances

This running lark is about so much more than running... we learn so much about ourselves and our bodies, and it never stops whatever stage of our running we are on !

So... I need to know now, WE all need to know, how the week has gone for you and your running. I know there are so many people graduating and moving forward from C25K. They are beginning to line up as they file past the podium!

Many too are climbing down off the Injury Couch and gradually getting back into their running. Steadily and slowly, and doing what they are able too.

It is good to know that this programme gives us the structure to stop for a while, but then be able to return to the same place or to go back a little, to build up again!

When you have got a moment... please, do pop into the Corner. There are plenty of cushions here and I have some new ones too! New runners, halfway-there runners, nearly graduated runners and repeaters. Everyone is welcome here. Tell us what your experiences are please.

Happy safe running everyone... and simply breathe

Oldfloss x

[Hidden]

Thanks Oldfloss when I started the C25K this was my biggest problem I was even goggling and reading as much as I could on the issue of breathing and running. Im now into a rhythm of in 3 out 3 but my mind still goes there and I still think alot about it when running then I get all mixed up haha. I breath through my mouth. Im really excited to see what other people post here. Thank you for the Corner update.

[Oldfloss Administrator Graduate in reply to Hidden]

Ha ha... Yes, we do try and find everything we can out, and often it can be overwhelming! So much advice and often, quite contradictory!

When we run, as you say, it can all get jumbled and we can get out of step and out of breath!

Lots of interesting replies already and I am hoping, too, that folk will join on and start to find more out about it!

Lovey to see you here in the Corner with us! Thank you!

[Vespina Graduate]

Aw, I love these posts Oldfloss . Always beautifully written and so much to think about.

Breathing is such an interesting topic and one I learned a lot about when I was a diving instructor. One interesting thing to note is that our body has no awareness of how much oxygen is in our system. The breathing reflex is governed by carbon dioxide, not oxygen. So if I find myself a tad out of breath, I lengthen my breaths out and that can help to settle things. I often find I’m not breathing out enough to get rid of the CO2.

This week has been a good one, running while on holiday so the change of scenery was really nice. Back to work tomorrow though. Can’t say I’m excited by that prospect 😆

[Oldfloss Administrator Graduate in reply to Vespina]

That is, indeed, one of the most interesting facts.I know a tad more than many ( Husband is an ex Science master). I get a lot of advice! And lessons! :)The Oxygen/CO2 balance is key...but so tricky... and many folk as you say have no idea how it all impacts.

As a diving instructor you will know an awful lot about breathing! That surely will be helping with your running breaths?

Lovely to have had a great holiday, and you are ready to start work, all refreshed and recharged... ?

Hope today goes well, and remember we have to work, to enjoy the holidays!

Thank you so much for this reply which I feel sure, will help folk and set many, researching further!

[Vespina Graduate in reply to Oldfloss]

Yes, the diving breathing definitely helps for the runs, even if I’m pushing. I feel more connected to my breath and it helps me know what’s going on in my body.

Yes, back to work for a rest. I’ve just calculated that I did 72.3km on my week off (not all running, mostly walking!)

[Oldfloss Administrator Graduate in reply to Vespina]

That sounds like a heck of a lot of Kms!No wonder work will seem like a rest!

[Vespina Graduate in reply to Oldfloss]

Wanted to see everything and no car. So shanks’s pony it was. Add two runs on and it adds up quickly

[WhaleSongC Graduate in reply to Vespina]

Ohh, interesting. I used to use less than half the air of my peers in my youth. I must say, the slow steady breath out that comes with diving does come in handy!

The first few weeks I was breathing in for two counts for most of the jog program but that is improving fast!

I’m on 82km walking for the last week. Traveling is hard work!

[Oldfloss Administrator Graduate in reply to WhaleSongC]

So interesting to see how different activities, singing, swimming, diving etc, affect the breathing in relation to our running. Good that the breathing has improved too when you are running. You are certainly getting some stopes in ...wow!

[Vespina Graduate in reply to WhaleSongC]

Ooh, nice to see a fellow diver on here. Always good to have loads of air left. We used to split our groups and send those low on air up with one guide and continue with those who had plenty, so you often get a longer dive. Sounds like the diving has stood you in good stead with the running.

Wow, 82km is really getting up there. That’s nearing a 100km ultra!

[BrokeyNotSoBusted Graduate]

Thanks Oldfloss. Really interesting post.

My breathing has been all over the place on a few runs, sometimes by going too fast or just an obstacle to throw my pace/stride off even for a short time. Have spent over half my life as a smoker which obviously hasn't helped either 🤭🤦‍♂️

As I've moved through the programme a little I've found that I'm breathing in through my nose more on runs and I quite often do a 1, 2, 3, 4 count, exhaling deeply through my mouth on the 4. Sometimes call out the 1, 2, 3, 4 a few times as a measure my pace isn't too quick. Reminds me a bit of watching soldiers chant while they march and jog to keep in formation and control their pace.

Did notice that always seem to have one nostril that is less blocked than the other so had to look that up and found nose goes through cycles throughout the day as to which nostril is more "open". This running lark opens up a load of very sciency stuff.

Edit: for the windy days I find my neck gaiter very useful. It's light and only need to pull it over nose and mouth when running into the wind. Others have mentioned using a "buff" which seems to have several uses.

[LiisaM Graduate in reply to BrokeyNotSoBusted]

I used my buff today to hold my ear pods in! I use it at night sometimes if my husband gets up and turns on a light nearby--I just pull it over my eyes. Well, and why is it around my neck at night in the first place? Because it takes the chill off my neck (during the daytime, too.)

[Oldfloss Administrator Graduate in reply to LiisaM]

Great use of the Buff! I wear mine on my head and dampened with cold water in hot weather!

[Oldfloss Administrator Graduate in reply to BrokeyNotSoBusted]

Great stuff. All this is really useful and helpful. Thank you.

It is really interesting, isn't it? Things can just throw us off track, we get distracted or have to do a sudden spurt and it can all get a bit out of tune.

And, even our counting paces themselves will be different, a slower or faster 1,2,3,4!

The counting does as you say remind one of the motivational march chants.

When I do it, it can get me running stronger... especially alongside one of the ABBA tracks. Chiquitita and 1.2.3.4 can get me anywhere!

Oh yes, one nostril blocked! I can understand that one! Hay-fever season does make it worse too!

Are you still smoking now, or has that been stopped?

Thanks for this reply, folk will find it helpful!

[BrokeyNotSoBusted Graduate in reply to Oldfloss]

Sadly still smoking because a) I'm an idiot

b) poor willpower / can't control triggers yet

c) I'm an idiot (again)

It's one of the reasons I started C25K... Can't smoke and run 🙂. Smoking less than I did so progress at least.

[Oldfloss Administrator Graduate in reply to BrokeyNotSoBusted]

You are on the way... Small steps.... you are not smoking as much, persevere with that !You are not an idiot.

You are already doing things to change your lifestyle. , it will take time. Just stick at it!

Well done!

[Cowladyrunning Graduate]

That's a really interesting post! I've read a few bits about breathing lately and know I need to improve my technique as it would help me not get a sore throat every day I teach and talk to much (while breathing incorrectly)! And yes it might help my running too! Lots to learn!

[Oldfloss Administrator Graduate in reply to Cowladyrunning]

I can totally empathise with you... my 'early' retirement at 52, was the end result of lost voice and hoarseness, and scar tissue on the voice box. In had not choice as my consultant said if I continued I would quite literally have no voice.I was a Primary school teacher, Literacy... and I was the Music and Special needs specialist too! This is just my experience though. We are not all the same!

So... do take care of yourself.

The breathing for you, is about more than running. Have you taken any advice from your Education Committee Medical experts? It is worth following this up!

I was fitted with a mouthpiece like Keep Fit and Dance teachers wear, to amplify the voice!

Meantime... keep it slow and steady... maybe a Buff over the mouth in colder weather too or in dry, polleny weather. Loads of water ( sipping etc) and that can help when teaching too.

Are you totally mouth breathing...? That can aggravate too. But can be harder to change.

There is a fair bit of advice on the sore throat online.

womensrunning.com/training/...

Let us know how you go on please¬

[Hidden in reply to Oldfloss]

Sorry Oldfloss what’s a buff?

[Oldfloss Administrator Graduate in reply to Hidden]

Neck warmer..multi use..buff.com/gb/neckwear/neckwa...

Shop around though x

[LiisaM Graduate]

Well, Laura says that 4 in/4 out is a good goal, too, but I found I could not do that so I do my own thing and don't think about it. Doing my own thing, I just finished Week 5, run 2 for the 3rd go around in the third year of restarting C25k following a winter break. I can't wait to get to the half hour runs in the follow-up program when I can just jog along for 30-35 minutes or do the "Speed" runs.... But I like these "thinking" posts, OldFloss. It was just what I needed at this time today.

[Oldfloss Administrator Graduate in reply to LiisaM]

That is absolutely great and exactly what should be happening! Sometimes we hear advice and we try to do it and it all goes pear-shaped!

You have done incredibly, Covid, long winners and lockdowns and yet here you are! Still staying positive and still running.

Steady as you go on the last run of this week and then steady again into Week 6. Those lovely long runs are waiting !

Keep it up, my friend

[Liono Graduate]

Thanks Oldfloss, this is very informative.

I found I was already doing the 4 steps in/4 out before Laura mentioned it, possibly something I was taught long ago for school cross country. For some reason I tend to purse my lips on the out breath - no idea why but it makes me self conscious when I run past anyone! Although the lady in the picture on the article you linked is also doing it, so it must be ok 😂 (wish I looked like her when running though!)

I have found counting breaths is a useful indicator of my pace - if I am struggling to manage a 4-count then it usually means I am going too fast so I know to slow down.

[Oldfloss Administrator Graduate in reply to Liono]

I do too..!!!! That's great to know its not just me!!! Purse my lips and let the breath out slowly,Really well done you.

This is exactly what we need to hear and share, so that it can help anyone struggling!

I bet the lady in the picture is an Ad model..you are a real runner!!

Thank you !!!

[nowster Graduate]

Interesting to talk about breathing. Because I have been an amateur singer for 20+ years, I've learned how to breathe more effectively, from the bottom of the lungs. That has helped me a lot in my running. And conversely, the running has helped my singing.

Another tip I remembered was that it's more important to empty the lungs as much as you can on each breath cycle than it is to fill them completely.

And I have sung (a little) whilst running. I can just about manage one verse of Frère Jacques before I have to gasp in a fresh breath.

[Oldfloss Administrator Graduate in reply to nowster]

You have put the nail on the head.... empty the lungs and really breathe from below! I think it is great how one thing has impacted the other... and I am so impressed that you can sing a verse... I usually get a line or two of Waterloo!

Thanks for this!

[CBDB Graduate]

Breath … breathe .. breathing … such an important and wondrous act of being..

My daily yoga helped me with re-discovering the importance of conscious breathing. I found we still have to relearn how to breathe every time we learn a new activity. With yoga, first needing to align certain moves into/out of a pose position with a breath in, and moves out of / into a pose breath out. When practicing Pilates, I was starting to miss that focus on breath.

When starting to run, I remember trying to consciously “arrange” my breathing, until it became second nature.

And rowing. Again I had to first consciously think and even count while breathing, getting the rhythms of breathing into my cognitive patterns depending on how many strokes per minute (SPM) I did. There are still some particular SPMs that throw my breathing off kilter, others which feel comfortable.

We still seem to have to relearn again and again how to do something so basic, and so complex, as the act of breathing.

Thank you!

[Oldfloss Administrator Graduate in reply to CBDB]

So interesting, and I am really glad I posted this. Seeing and hearing what people do, have done and how they breathe!As you say, something so basic, yet so complex! I can imagine how your activities demand different techniques...

I am learning so much... moving through different stages and after certain setbacks too.

It should be easy, like blinking...but it isn't always!

Thank you for this insight! x

[Oldfloss Administrator Graduate]

Morning folk,, giving a shout out for a few folk to fill the empty cushions. I am just hoping folk are all okay and moving forwards. Still testing and uncertain times!Mum22boys Greenthorn GailXrunning Kiwi_Fi Hidden Renidragas Hidden Elfe5 WhaleSongC Tbae

[Hidden in reply to Oldfloss]

Hi Oldfloss. Still enjoying the cushions on the IC, but fortunately COVID is finally done and dusted after 10 days of positive tests!! My rearranged MRI is this Friday, then I’ll find out what is next. D-d xx

[Oldfloss Administrator Graduate in reply to Hidden]

This Covid variant is a persistent one! Glad that's cleared!!Fingers crossed MRI wise!! What a long wait ...take care you...xxx

[WhaleSongC Graduate in reply to Oldfloss]

I’m in Orlando and averaging 8-10 miles a day walking theme parks, so my poor tired feet are not running! Hopefully Friday or Saturday!

[Oldfloss Administrator Graduate in reply to WhaleSongC]

Blimey! You are really getting some exercise in... you will be glad of a rest maybe?Hope you manage a run if you can find the opportunity! x

[Oldfloss Administrator Graduate]

A few more extra cushions left here. There are a fair, few folk still on the IC, and this Covid is still with us and really impacting on folk. I am hoping that all is well with everyone, and that they are managing to get out in some way Katprid Lola-bear BarbieW annatonina Gottostartsomewhere Lablove Indielass00 PJRunner alpacagirl Hidden MrsLydiaWickham , ( I haven't forgotten the video re kissing the ground!)

[MrsLydiaWickham Graduate in reply to Oldfloss]

No worries about the video! You are a very busy person and I'd guess it may be quite difficult to film? I'm tootling along nicely in consolidation, just enjoying it all. 😊

[Oldfloss Administrator Graduate in reply to MrsLydiaWickham]

It is tricky ..but I am keen to learn..watching someone demonstrating is so helpful..Busy hmmm...a tad manic right now but I'll get it done!

Enjoyment is key...just keep on and keep enjoying x

[BarbieW Graduate in reply to Oldfloss]

Hi Floss. Back on IC I’m afraid. I pulled a calf muscle on W8R2 and it really hurts, I had to hop home! And the knees have come out in sympathy so I think a few weeks rest may be necessary. I am thinking of trading my body in for a new improved model, but can’t seem to find anything suitable and affordable. Anyone got a second hand body they’d like to offer? Must have decent knees.

[Oldfloss Administrator Graduate in reply to BarbieW]

Oh gosh!!! I had that very thing once... agony!Well, my knees are good.... some bits a tad old though! Recover and be sure, the runs do wait!

[Indielass00 Graduate in reply to Oldfloss]

I’m late again to the corner, but to be honest I’ve just not been feeling so well recently so I haven’t been on here. After my fab birthday run we went away for a few days. Had a lovely time but husband packed a bit too much into our trip and came back needing another holiday just to sleep and do nothing! Managed a run on Friday, 9 days after last run but felt it was an effort at times. Not run since. Chest has felt tight and breathing a bit off so seeing Drs today about it. Just walking for now until feel better x

[Oldfloss Administrator Graduate in reply to Indielass00]

I did wonder where you were, but knew you had been away for a lovely birthday treat...

I do hope this issue gets sorted soon...High Pollen maybe... anyway you will soon get advice

Do take it steady and keep us posted please xx

[Indielass00 Graduate in reply to Oldfloss]

Not a chest infection so that’s good! Thanks Oldfloss . Dr has given me some medicine and hoping that will do the trick! 🤞🏻I’m sure I will be out again soon! xx

[Oldfloss Administrator Graduate in reply to Indielass00]

Phew! Take it gently xxx

[Lablove Graduate]

Graduated 1 year ago, almost to the day…. For a variety of reasons I haven’t been running regularly so decided to go right back to square one. Also joined a local beginners running group. Not sure how it will go as the majority of people in the group very fit and fast so felt a little disheartened. However, back to week one, lapping in the local park with my lovely furry companion.

One year after graduating and back to week 1 run 1

[Oldfloss Administrator Graduate in reply to Lablove]

How did I miss this!!!!!! SORRY ! xxx Happy Runniversary and 5 days!!!I cannot believe I missed it!

Square one is a great place to start... I have only just made it back to 10K after over a year!

There are so many of us starting again or repeating bits.

Hopefully the group should have folk who are running with the ones who are not the speediest?

Just take it slow and really steady...your own pace xxx

HUGE well done you!

PS

That photo reminds me of a lot of bridges on the trails I run on sometimes..it looks lovely! The tunnel looks nicer than the one where I had my scare !

healthunlocked.com/bridgeto......

[Elfe5 Graduate]

I’m very late on my cushion - busy busy week! I enjoyed your post thanks OF - very interesting about breathing - I use it all the time to estimate my pace. 3 paces in & 3 out makes me go slowly, 3 in, 2 out is my “not thinking about it default” but I know that puts me in the common pattern of amateur runners going a bit too fast too much, 2 in, 2 out is galumphing downhill!! I have never managed Laura’s suggestion of 4 in & out!My good news is that I completed W6R3 this morning, slowly & gently - it is SO good to be back to continuous running after so long on the IC. 🤸‍♂️🤸‍♂️ 🤸‍♂️ 😄

PS Being a flautist years ago meant I could blow up a balloon for my kids in one breath - should have kept it up!!

[Oldfloss Administrator Graduate in reply to Elfe5]

Where do the weeks go.? The breathing is so interesting.. I am trying out different things... like when you want to really go for it... 2 in 2 out is the ideal apparently, end of a race etc?Maybe that is equivalent to a downhill run!

I just listen to a load of things that have a 4/ 4 beat... it suits me ..

Greta news on the run! Huge well done you...!

I always wanted to learn the flute... wrong shaped mouth and lips apparently? So... piano it was! Not so helpful with breathing though!

[Elfe5 Graduate in reply to Oldfloss]

I have heard that there are some people who don’t manage to get a sound out of a flute. It’s like that trick of blowing across a bottle top to make it vibrate & hoot/hum. Playing the piano is a great skill to have. 😄

[SewIRan]

Daft as it may sound, breathing and rhythm have never been an issue for me. At school a long, long time ago I overheard one of the boys talking about their drumming lesson. They had to practise the 'boom ting ta, boom boom ting ta, break' rhythm. I heard it just before we had to run the mile. It got stuck in my head and I naturally ran and breathed to the rhythm. Even now, every time I run I have that rhythm going through my head...sometimes faster, sometimes slower, but on a flat even path I can almost run like a metronome. Cheers, Russell!

[Oldfloss Administrator Graduate in reply to SewIRan]

That sounds great to me.., Finding that pattern that suits OUR running... and what works for one isn't necessarily right for another!

You do realise that I now have that rhythm in MY head !

Thanks for this !

[WhaleSongC Graduate]

Did it! Week 5 run 3. 8 days since week 2, but plenty of walking miles in between.

I found it really tough - my right hip got cranky, and the first half felt like it took forever.

Breathing, however, came naturally :). And I don’t even think I drooled too much! :p.

[Oldfloss Administrator Graduate in reply to WhaleSongC]

HUGE well done you!!! That is fantastic!It's easy, when the run is easy... but when it isn't.... and YOU handled it!

Great on the breathing too... and what's a drool now and then among friends xxx