9/2020 Study shows Vitamin D protects against complications from covid-19

[George71]

video link below

youtube.com/watch?v=V8Ks9fU...(Not working as expected?)

[GreenStreet]

Excellent. Thanks for posting George. I reckon D3 is very underrated. I take for anti C19 and PC.

[George71 in reply to GreenStreet]

Yes, I take Vitamin D3 10,000 and Vitamin K1/2 daily (needed to make calcium go to bones -- I get enough calcium in my food

[GreenStreet in reply to George71]

Me too. Exactly the same

[LearnAll]

youtu.be/mg2eBhGB3T8(Not working as expected?)

Please note that this man is a REAL doctor with many medical degrees (MBBS, MD, PhD, MPH) from 3 different countries. He teaches student doctors and lives in southern California. You are hearing from mouth of the horse....not from some "online wanna be doctor" Enjoy.

[Hidden]

There is a link between vitamin D levels and Covid recovery, but there is no benefit above a sufficient level.

Excessive Vitamin D can cause bone loss. 4000 Iu/day is set as the upper limit of safe.

Here's TA's blog on the subject:

prostatecancer.news/2018/07...

[noahware in reply to Hidden]

There is no PROVEN benefit above a sufficient level, and no definitive proof of exactly what level is "sufficient" as opposed to what level is "optimal." These levels may differ for different individuals. There may be unproven benefit, for some, of maintaining levels at the higher end of the "normal" range rather than the lower end, but this potential benefit cannot exist across all individuals and cannot be scientifically proven.

The "upper limit of safe" at 4000 IU is for continual daily dosing, and is a somewhat arbitrary limit. Those who start with insufficient levels may safely benefit from higher loading doses, but extremely high loading doses can and do cause toxicity.

For most people, there is probably no need to ever dose above 2,000 IU but it would be extremely rare for daily dosing at 5,000 or even 10,000 to cause short-term toxicity. But possible long term effects on bone health mean that the higher dosing should either be avoided or that the potential effects on bone are carefully considered and addressed. I do not know that taking vitamin K and Mg fully address that concern, as some seem to say.

[LearnAll in reply to noahware]

Noahware,

The most scientific way of calculating how much Vit D3+K2 one needs is to check blood levels of Vitamin D every few months and modify dosage accordingly. If Vit D level is above 100, there should be a temporary stop to VitD3 supplement and restart after a few months when level falls below 100.

Do we keep filling our car's Gas tank even after it is full. Blood level of Vit D3 above 100 is like a spilling Gas tank.

My VitD blood level last week was 54...so I will keep taking 5000 IU/day until level rises to 90 -100.

[George71]

Less than an hour in the sun produces 20,000 units of Vitamin D, all at once, every time you do it -- daily

" Exposure of a young adult in a bathing suit to one minimal erythemal dose (MED) of UV radiation in a tanning bed was equivalent to ingesting approximately 20,000 IUs of vitamin D2 (Fig. 40).25 When a healthy 75 y old male in a bathing suit was exposed to UVB radiation in a tanning bed three times a week for 7 weeks he was able to raise and maintain his blood levels of 25(OH)D into the healthy normal range of ~50 ng/ml"

Vitamin D3 is made in large quantities when you are in the sun during peak UV times. In fact it is estimated that 30 minutes in the sun (ideally in a bathing suit), midday in summer can make up to 20,000 IU of Vitamin D.

If you get too much sun, the skin is able to convert the excess Vitamin D to other inactive molecules. In this way the body does not get overdosed with Vitamin D from sun exposure.

Vitamin D3 from the sun (or supplement) makes its way to the liver where it undergoes a process (hydroxylation) turning it into 25D to store in your body. Having optimal stores of 25D in your body is very important, as these stores will enhance your body’s ability to make the best use of Vitamin D’s capabilities. If your body does not store enough Vitamin D in the form of 25D, then you will have low or deficient levels of Vitamin D in the blood. Ideally your Vitamin D levels should be optimal.

Then your body is to sends 25D from your liver to the kidneys where it is transformed into 1,25D3.

1,25D3 is the active and potent form of Vitamin D. As 1,25D3 this form of Vitamin D has the job of circulating in your blood to ensure that you maintain appropriate levels of calcium.

[LearnAll in reply to George71]

Lot of good info, George. Just a few additions:

(1) 20000 IU/hour only in white skin people. Black skin only produces 5000-6000 IU in an hour. However, if you coat skin with butter or coconut oil, production of Vit D3 can be increased by 20-30%.

(2) Sun must be bright and continuous with plenty of UV rays in the place.

(3) Sun Screen blocks UV and reduces VitD 3 production by approx 50 to 60%

(4) Not to take bath /use soap for at least 2 hours after sunbath as newly formed D3 is washed of ...as it is produced in superficial layer of skin.

My first preference is always Vit3 from sunlight..but if still not sufficient..tablets are fine.

I use coating of coconut oil on skin to cut down total time in Sun and still produce enough Vit D3.

[George71]

The effect of aging on the cutaneous production of vitamin D3 was demonstrated in a study that exposed healthy young adults and older adults to the same amount of UVB radiation in a tanning bed. The increase in the blood level of vitamin D3 in six young adults aged 20–30 was at least three-fold higher compared with the six older adults aged 62–80 demonstrating that aging significantly decreased the capacity of the skin to produce vitamin D3.

20 to 30 year old outdoor active beach goers have Vitamin D ranging from 60 to 90

[George71]

ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articl...

[George71]

I agree with LearnAll, many outdoor lifestyle people middle earster and African tribe people have levels at and above 100 for life and are healthy -- have remarkably lower rates of bone disease and cancer

[LearnAll in reply to George71]

Its true that Prostate Cancer rates and mortality is much lower in Indo Pacific region , China and Eastern African nations. Significantly much lower than US ,European and central African nations.

The Asian nations such as Phillipines and Thailand who are more westernized, the rate and mortality is increasing there.

Also, Asians living in Asia have low rate and mortality from PCA than Asians who immigrated to USA . Second generation immigrants from Asia have more Prostate cancer than first generation.

Just to remind you that only less than 15% of all prostate cancer are Genetic.

What are some common positive factors in low rate of PCa and low PCa death nations:

(1) Plenty of Sunlight and high Vitamin D3 from Sun.

(2) Mostly vegetarian diet with daily intake of anti inflammatory herbs and spices such as turmeric, ginger, onions, garlic, holy basil, coriander, black cumin and so on.

(3) Lot of walking and other physical activity as most people do not have cars or motorcycles .(4) More intact families and close friends as well as sense of community...causing reduction in stress and sense of belonging.

[Hidden]

sciencedaily.com/releases/2...

Scientists from the UK, Europe and the USA, including experts from the University of Birmingham, have published a vitamin D consensus paper warning against high doses of vitamin D supplementation.

According to the study, there is currently insufficient scientific evidence to show vitamin D can be beneficial in preventing or treating Covid-19. Its authors advise that the population adhere to Public Health England guidance on supplementation.

drugtopics.com/view/experts...

"High doses of vitamin D supplement have not shown any benefit in preventing or treating coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19), and individuals should be cautioned against over supplementation of the vitamin, experts emphasized in a global consensus paper published in BMJ, Nutrition, Prevention and Health.1"

[George71]

Thanks gregg57,

I agree, there is certainly room for varying opinions.

I will note that those articles were written or published in May 2020:

"According to the study, there is currently insufficient scientific evidence to show vitamin D can be beneficial in preventing or treating Covid-19"

The study referred to in the post by the doctor above -- was just released Sept. 2020 to give an answer to the question "currently insufficient scientific evidence".

[Hidden in reply to George71]

I think we agree that a deficiency of Vitamin D can hinder Covid 19 recovery. It is known that Vitamin D deficiency negatively effects immune response, not only for Covid 19. We certainly need to make sure we are not deficient, no argument there.

If there is clinical trial evidence to disprove the statement in my above reply, please provide a link to actual trial data. My above reply is "High doses of Vitamin D supplement have not shown any benefit in preventing or treating coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19)" Again we are not talking about those who are deficient.

It is not necessary or recommeded that anyone take 10,000 IU per day of Vitamin D to insure you are not deficient. There is no proven benefit above a sufficient level, that's the important point.

[MateoBeach in reply to Hidden]

covid.us.org/2020/09/03/new...

[George71 in reply to MateoBeach]

I posted links to the trial about 3 times now and it doesn't seem to matter to those whose mind is slammed shut.

[George71]

Hi gregg57,

In the video the doctor describes the study and explains that the trial took 76 consecutive patients that came to the hospital for treatment (no one knew what each persons vitamin D levels were -- they just tookthe next 76 patients that showed up for treatment ) and randomly assigned them to one of two groups at a 2 to 1 ratio regardless of their vitamin D levels it was a double blind study: -- one group of 50 patients received something in the range of 20,000 units and again another approx. 10,000 every other day -- the other group of 26 randomly assigned patients did not receive any vitamin D... the ones that received the large doses of D fared extremely well compared to the group that did not receive the additional dose ... only 2% of the high dose vitamin D group were admitted to ICU compared to 50% of the non supplemented vitamin D group who were admitted to ICU and 2 of them died. As the doctor rightly concluded this test proves the benefit in high dose vitamin D in fighting covid19 (and likely many other diseases) and it answered the question

"there is currently insufficient scientific evidence to show vitamin D can be beneficial in preventing or treating Covid-19" (statement made May 2020}

That can not be said any longer after this trial published 9/2020 -- shows definitively large doses of vitamin D improved outcomes dramatically in Covid-19 patients.

No one knows who (if any) of the 76 consecutively admitted patients randomly assigned were deficient Vitamin D - they may have all been taking supplemental vitamin D when they arrived.. ..

[Hidden]

Hi george71

I agree with gregg57's view that one should only supplement if deficient

In the UK anything over 50nmols is sufficient

I've been taking just 600iu for many years now and my D numbers are always around the 80 nmol mark, which I'm happy with

I know that some say that a super high D number of 150 nmols is what you should aim for!

However, I tried just 2000 iu for a week and my muscle aches, my main health problem, was much worse - so, back to 600iu

Thanks

Alps

[LearnAll in reply to Hidden]

Alps,

We are having this futile debate about dose of Vit D we need to take ....because we are forgetting a basic fact and that is ..if the same dose is given to 2 different people for 6 months, one will have a level of say 40 and other may have a blood level of 70.

If some one's blood level is already 90, why should he even take more Vit D ?What,s the need. But your level is 80, which is pretty good and you can easily do fine with 600 IU/day.

So my take is..it is not a fixed dose which is good for everyone....and dose should be guided by blood level of Vit D and should be adjusted accordingly.

[Hidden in reply to LearnAll]

Yes absolutely agree LearnAll

We're all different and the same dose for everyone does not succeed in optimising D levels all round

Thanks

Alps

[George71 in reply to Hidden]

Alpsholiday,

I'm only talking about blood level of 80 to 100 myself -- you are very unusual if on 600 will raise your levels to 80 .. that is all mine is @ 10,000 daily.

as I keep pointing out we are basically taking about sunlight -- you get 20,000 in a bathing suit in one hour ..... 20,000 a day its pretty darn safe and I have never heard of anyone being outside for only one hour a day having blood D levels anywhere near 100

[Hidden in reply to George71]

Hi George71

I've been doing Medichecks every 3 months since March 19 to find a possible answer to progressive statin muscle aches, which started during a short 12 week course of low dose statins ending in April 17.

Hence, my trial (to no avail) of 2000 iu D for a week some time ago

I've tried lots else as well, again without any luck

Btw, I have read a few times on here that excessive D intake, without regular monitoring, is also not advised.

Thanks

Alps

[MateoBeach]

And here is a link breaking down this study:

covid.us.org/2020/09/03/new...