Sleep problems and ADT

[cancerking]

I am on ADT, Lupron and Casadex. I go to sleep well but awaken 1-2 hours later and have difficulty returning to sleep. Is this due to ADT or it could be my age of 77 and still working? The working, I can quit,

[smroush]

I was on Lupron and Casodex for 26 months back in 2012 - 2014. I had the same sleep difficulties that you describe. They seemed pretty clearly linked to the ADT to me (the onset of the symptoms coincided with the start of ADT). The symptoms have mostly gone away since I went off ADT. While on ADT I took a slow release form of Ambien, a sleeping pill prescribed by my oncologist. It did a good job of getting me to sleep and keeping me to sleep at least until about 3:00 am or so.

[LearnAll in reply to smroush]

I will be avoiding ambien if I m 77 years old because the risk of sleep walking is too high.

first, will try some melatonin.

[smroush in reply to LearnAll]

While I never had any sleep walking issues while on Ambien, I do currently use a "dual layer" (similar to slow, timed release formulation) form of melatonin. It seems to work well for me now, though with occasional more intense, often mildly unpleasant dreams.

[middlejoel in reply to smroush]

SMROUSH, so you went off ADT, what are you on now?

jal

[smroush in reply to middlejoel]

Nothing. At diagnosis (July 2012) I was a Gleason 9 with mets to pelvic lymph nodes and bladder (I had kidney stents in for over 8 months to deal with a urinary obstruction due to the bladder tumor). I had external beam radiation and spent 26 months on ADT. They drove my PSA to undetectable (< 0.1) and we stopped all meds in October 2014. Since them my PSA has never risen above 0.2. A very good response - not sure why, though I do exercise a lot and adopted a whole food plant based diet after diagnosis.

[middlejoel in reply to smroush]

Amazing and congratulations, been on this thread since 2006 and your story appears to me as being the most successful that I've heard. On the other hand, heard many that validate the conventional thinking that PCa is not curable.

jal

[DarkEnergy]

Look at the pinned post on the right, "Sleep helpful hints and suggestions", it's a compilation of many posts here...

I've been having sleep challenges since diagnosed about a year ago. For me, increased exercise and making the bedroom a freezing temperature has helped a lot.

[LearnAll in reply to DarkEnergy]

Yes. Making the bedroom jet black (not even blue computer light) and A/C temp at 70 or below with light blankets if needed...that is what helps me a lot.

Scientifically speaking, darker the room more melatonin is released by your pineal gland. Darkness stimulates pineal gland.

[Hidden in reply to LearnAll]

Aluminum foil with painters tape on the windows works really well for darkening the room jet black. Then you can go to sleep anytime your body wants; just close the door and it's night time.

[Kaliber in reply to Hidden]

Aluminum foil can make some stylish hats to ward off the rays as well. Stick them on with Elmer’s to keep them on at night as a sleep aid. Ask J-o-h-n for his pdf of drawings and fitting information. His foil hats are the best.

[Magnus1964]

I had that problem. I found doing some exercise in the afternoon and taking melatonin before bedtime works. Remember, not all melatonin is the same. If you want to know the brand I take send me chat message. Darryl does not like broadcasting commercial names on the forum.

[Hidden in reply to Magnus1964]

👍

[Hidden]

I had a lot of sleep problems where I'd lie in bed "awake", hoping I'd fall asleep and get more than 2 or 3 hours. I changed that so I just get out of bed when my mind tells me it's not going to go back to sleep, and then just tough it out for the rest of the day. It has worked so that most nights I do get more than 6 hours of sleep. Another thing that worked is I changed my sleep routine so I get up about 3AM, and go to bed about 7PM or so. I just found that sleeping period as the sweet spot for me, as the medications can all contribute to insomnia (abiraterone, tamsulonsin, prednisone, losartan; orchiectomy instead of lupron). Also, I take all my meds as early as possible after waking up.

[2dee]

CBD drops. 100-200mg a day total. Split into 6hr doses.

Relax, pain reduction, and wonderful sleep.

2Dee

[herb1]

Hi, Im on the same cocktail, Lupron, Avodart, Casodex and do have problems getting back to sleep--each time my bladder tells me to get up. It's stress and mind refusing to shut down. For me, a slice of low cal swiss cheese at about 2AM is my savior. However, it does not prevent the next need to get up. Nalakrats notes the tryptophane; I'd rather get mine from cheese!

herb

[monte1111 in reply to herb1]

A chunk of extra sharp cheddar cheese with saltine crackers is an often bedtime companion. A habit picked up from my chemo days. Not so much the pickle spears anymore. But a couple of times a week to keep the stomach gods happy.

[herb1 in reply to monte1111]

Monte, shame, shame--all those calories. But what caught my eye: pickle spears? That's become my new "taste" too even though I really don't want the salt. Any explanation/reason for our palate ?

[monte1111 in reply to herb1]

Dexamethasone and/or Taxotere gave me sore throat issues. Wife had once advised pickle juice as sore throat remedy. Dexamethasone pills before chemo gave me insomnia and sore throat. The pickle spears helped. Also mild pepperoncini until towards end of cycles mouth was too tender for the peppers. Salt on the crackers was for the sore throat. The vinegar also helps you with stomach issues. But the taste buds change from time to time. Anyone with dentures will tell you that food tastes better without the dentures in. Maybe some one has already looked into aromatherapy and taste bud therapy for cancer patients. Sounds intriguing. Would like to know why my beer tastes like crap now.

[j-o-h-n in reply to monte1111]

To me... it sounds like you're pregnant....

Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.

j-o-h-n Monday 07/29/2019 5:35 PM DST

[Kaliber in reply to j-o-h-n]

Yayahahaha good one.

[monte1111 in reply to j-o-h-n]

Yep. A scoop of ice cream and then a pickle. Sad part is I look like I'm pregnant. People are starting to get up to let me sit. My famous Popeye physique is sadly gone.

[j-o-h-n in reply to monte1111]

Not only do I get a seat...they want to feel my tits..... Remember you're yam what you're yam...

Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.

j-o-h-n Monday 07/29/2019 7:49 PM DST

[monte1111 in reply to j-o-h-n]

Ok. That's funny. Forgot about my little titties.

[j-o-h-n in reply to monte1111]

little? Just call me 'Dolly Pardon me', "Don't touch, they're real"

Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.

j-o-h-n Monday 07/29/2019 9:49 PM DST

[Kaliber in reply to j-o-h-n]

Yep same here. Been looking for a manzier. Need a 54 j cup.

[j-o-h-n in reply to Kaliber]

54 j is not a cup, it's a tankard ....

Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.

j-o-h-n Tuesday 07/30/2019 12:12 PM DST

[Hidden in reply to monte1111]

More spinach pop-eye ...

[Hidden in reply to monte1111]

Love pickles and cheese .

[Don_1213]

Tylenol Pm, 2 at bedtime. Or generic acetaminophen PM Take just before you lay down. Sleep like a baby.

[j-o-h-n]

As I've posted in the past.... In your mind (with your eyes closed in bed with the lights out) start building a log cabin.. From foundation up to the roof. You can fantasize any equipment you want but no help from other people (animals ok if you wish to do it the old fashioned way). I never get passed the first floor and I'm out. BTW when I dream I dream that I'm sleeping. No meds No nuttin.... All mind control....

Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.

j-o-h-n Monday 07/29/2019 5:42 PM DST

[Kaliber]

Welp I’m on lupron - xtandi - Zometa and have exactly the opposite problem. I sleep most of the time. In 30 hours time I can sleep over 20 of those . I can just sit down and be still for a few minutes and I have to fight to stop from nodding off. I awake for pain management but it rarely figures in these days. Anyway, If getting up at night up to pee is waking you , what I do is keep a wide mouth quart orange juice jug at bedside for nighttime use. With very little practice you can learn to use it and almost never actually wake fully up. Every night I fill a quart jug half to three quarters full and hardly ever remember doing it. ( might be the pee fairy tho ). Because of my meds ( I hope ) I’m seriously impaired when it comes to mobility anyway , getting up out of bed at all is an adventure ( I also wear a dual mask cpap) Just walking ( more like shuffling) up and down the hallways a few times causes me to pant hard and gasp for air and break out in a profuse sweat. Being able to stay in bed at night is a real benefit for me. When I was having sleep trouble at night , especially with pain management, I found half a indica cannabis cookie ( medical grade, if it is legal where you live ) and 10 mg of melatonin knocked me out for the whole night. Getting that rem sleep is very important , missing it can mess you up more than you realize.

Not sleeping is hell , I hope you get that fixed soon. Best wishes .

[j-o-h-n in reply to Kaliber]

"might be the pee fairy tho"........... LOL next time look under your pillow for a quarter...

Adding Pee Fairy to my repertoire... Thank you, Thank you, Thank you...

Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.

j-o-h-n Monday 07/29/2019 7:30 PM DST

[Kaliber in reply to j-o-h-n]

I looked under my pillow .... just a yellow wet spot .... hummmmmmm. There are several quarters lying on the floor next to my bed. ( flexibility gone, can’t reach down far enough and pick them up ) .... I always assumed they fell out of a pants pocket. Maybe I misjudged their Origin .... might be on to something. Now got to train the PF to bring $100 bills and instead.... inflation you know.

[j-o-h-n in reply to Kaliber]

Maybe you can convince the PF to do the naughty naughty with the Sandman for money and this way she can increase your rewards.

youtube.com/watch?v=VNUgsbK...(Not working as expected?)

Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.

j-o-h-n Tuesday 07/30/2019 11:33 AM DST

[Kaliber in reply to j-o-h-n]

Yayahahaha yayahahaha genuinely funny ... trippy even. between the funny post and the video , almost like an acid trip .. laughing and Twilight Zone someplace. Kewl , a good laugh is a good thing.

I’d hook up with the PF myself but it would be a chemically induced waste of time ( at 73 that’s my excuse anyway ) yayahahaha. Maybe they’d let me watch . Now whare’d I put that fedora , cane and mink cape.

[j-o-h-n in reply to Kaliber]

LOL fedora , cane and mink cape. That's what I use to wear when I was pimping.....

Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.

j-o-h-n Tuesday 07/30/2019 4:41 PM DST

[Hidden]

Hello king! Welcome! Difficulty in sleeping Is common for most of us . I take a dose of Rick Simpson oil at 420 each afternoon and I myself take 20 mg melatonin and 4.5 naltrexone prior to bed each night for the past 4 yrs .. many take sleep aids . Sleep Is essential ..Good luck finding what’s key for you to get a better nights sleep . I was then 53 now 58 so it can be at any age ... it is adt mostly ..

[RonnyBaby]

I doubt there's someone on this site that has had more trouble with insomnia than me.

Mine is genetic in nature and I've spent most of my life looking for answers.

I need a 'cocktail' to sleep, but I have had success with it.

In no particular order - here goes:

1 -A strong Indica THC tincture ( 1 ml )

2 - Melatonin - 10 mg 'quick release' + 10 mg 'timed release'

3 - Ashwaganda - 1 gram (total) in capsule form

4 - Passion flower - 500 mg in capsule form

5 - NO alcohol

6 - Zopiclone - 7.5 mg pill (1 ea)

7 - A calming cup of tea like chamomile (no caffeine, obviously)

8 - a cool room

9 - a sleeping mask to block out ALL lights of all types

10 - a Set time for lights out - no watching TV in bed

11 - A calming soundtrack (works for some to distract the mind) that lasts

about 8 - 10 hours - I found 'sleep music' on YouTube that uses a particular frequency range that is known to be calming at LO volume

Question - R U hung over in the morning ?

Answer - NO !

Answer con't - I need about an hour to get going in the morning. That includes a good breakfast, 2 cups of coffee and a BM.

NB: I actually play golf in the morning, twice a week - if I was messed up, I would be useless. My game is fine - except that my putting sucks - sleep won't help that particular issue.

Any tips ?

[Victorq1]

Thanks, will try.

Same sleeping problems on ADT.

I have one more "sleeping method"

in addition to imaginary sailing.

With dark band over the eyes

I hook up wireless earphones

to the Internet radio with night

news feed .That gets so "boring" after a while

that I sleep until I need to go to the bathroom--

usually 5 hours.

Than, I continue to "catch up"

on early morning news,

hear all five of them and continue sleeping.

Did I mention a glass of Chamomile tea

or better red wine with pomegranate seeds,

prior to going to sleep?

That also helps in my case,

although alcohol is not advised, by sleep specialists.