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Advanced Prostate Cancer
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CANNABINOIDS ANYONE?

My pharmacist has referred me to a person who supplies "a full spectrum of cannabinoids for use during chemo. Has anyone had experience with this?

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Just CBD oil. helped at times with rest.

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Some have reported use, but we have no direct post, on this--THC, will far out pace CBD oil in relief of Chemo SE, as well as almost all SE from various other treatments. This is IMO, only.

Nalakrats

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no doubt

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1. There appears to be a lot of evidence that it is good for Chemo side effects.

2. Prostate Cancer Cells have extra cannabiniod receptors. There is reason to believe that when these receptors are activated, they promote the growth of the cancerous prostate cells.

So, perhaps prostate cancer is not the best choice of cancer to self treat with cannibinoids... unless you are already in hospice.

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Prostate Cancer Cells have extra cannabiniod receptors. There is reason to believe that when these receptors are activated, they promote the growth of the cancerous prostate cells. If this were true I should be long gone. Maybe when receptors are activated apoptosis occurs.

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This is an observation made by Dr. Myers. He said all his cannabis evangelists seem to suffer disproportionately from aggressive prostate cancer.

A similar observation was made by a speaker at the last pcri conference. His presentation was all about alternative therapy and such.

I can't speak about your case without seeing your medical records. But Myers noted that his cannabis evangelists had very strong reality distortion fields. LOL

Do you consider yourself a cannabis evangelist?

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I must add my 2 cents:

I had aggressive PCa before getting my medical marijuana ID card. It works very well for chemo side effects. What it doesn't fix at least doesn't bother me and I can get some quality test.

I've seen studies and articles go both ways on the effects it has on cancer. If it does promote growth, and chemo attacks fast growing cells, then it might make the chemo more effective. Just speculation on my part.

What's not speculation is that I'm using as needed, it's helping with symptoms, and my PSA is still going down.

Cancer is very complex, does cannabinoid receptor activation have an effect in the absence of testosterone? Is being able to eat and maintain a healthy weight more important? What about quality of sleep?

Yes I do have a reality distortion field, as I'm hoping I'll be amoung the lucky few to achieve complete remission despite how unlikely that actually is.

sperlingprostatecenter.com/...

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You are correct. There is no clinical study showing its effect on prostate cancer.

Not is there likely to be any in the foreseeable future.

At the same time there are clinical trials showing the effect of specific cannabinoids on the side effects of chemo.

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I like your distortion. Even the wise man admits Luck is a factor. I wish you plenty of luck. With good living and your positive aspirations I believe that you’ll succeed ..

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My father has been on 1g of cannabis oil a day since November. He started in September. Built his way up. At a high dose like that daily, going by Myers study, his cancer would be out of control. Latest PSA is 0.9, dropped from 40.6.

My motto in life - keep an open mind. Things are and always have been put in our line of sight to deter us.

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That is nonsense cesanon..

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Its somewhat humorous to me how the same people who talk down to anyone presenting "anecdotal" evidence of a possible positive effect for some non-pharmaceutical substance, give unquestioning credence to anecdotal evidence from a private practice oncologist. As if he or she could not be subject to he same confirmation biases as the rest of us.

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Myer's 1500 prostate cancer patients is less than a clinical trial, but more than an idealog seeking a predetermined result.

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Yes, but how many of the 1500 were regular cannabis/cannabinoid users?

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The ones that stuck out. They seemed to consistently have inordinately aggressive prostate cancer compared to his other patients.

And they would brag to him about the positive effects of their cannabis consumption.

Another pcri speaker mentioned he had noticed a similar pattern. He subject was about eating healthy, organic food. Not a person you would expect to be prejudiced against cannabis.

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Let’s find the humor and irony in all of this....

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Which part and why?

There are 2 FDA approved cannabinoids. One is Marinol. I can't remember the name of the other.

Facts please.

Thank you

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F the F.D.A they are part of the problem not the solution yet for any of us.

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Simple solutions to complex problems coupled with conspiracy theories. Yeah. Hey it works for our grifter in Chief.

Don't Bogart the joint.

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As some here are fond of saying:

"Correlation is not evidence of causation."

Can't have it both ways.

Be Well - cujoe

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"Correlation is not evidence of causation."

You are quite right. It could be people with aggressive pca gravitate to cannabis.

It's an imperfect world.

But the prostate cancer cells have extra cannabinoid receptors. Given how the cannabinoid system works, you would expect cannabis to either generate or suppress the growth of those pca cells.

I decided to follow Myers medical intuition that it was encouraging prostate cancer growth.

It might be different with other cancers. But this is the one that concerns us, isn't it.

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I say scruffy was wrong on that one.

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Hail to the chief I’m non political...but he’s the grifter if all grifters. We will see how his gritting works out for the public? Excuse me! While I bogart that joint my friend. Let’s bring some humor to these subjects .

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LOL

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We have bigger fish to fry than each other... Take care..

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Have a good day or evening Lulu.

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You too friend..

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BTW, Lulu, Good to Have You Back!

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Thanks , sic em cujoe..

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Trying to help hold the fort in your absence.

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I’m fighting for my sanity and to achieve my own daily happiness. This sparring of opinions is just entertainment to me.. if we all thought the same it would be a boring world. I’m here to encourage others and find answers for myself too. No expert . Just one of the guys trying to survive. Take care cujoe and keep up the good work.. “ keep away from people that try to belittle your ambitions .Small people always do that,but the really great make you feel like you, too, can become great .”- Mark Twain

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Good words from two wise individuals. In most ways, everyone here is working for the same cause(s). I sometimes think the long threads like this one are for people venting their frustration (and maybe for some, a bit of physical/emotional pain) at the circumstance we all find ourselves in with PCa.

I'm in the school that works hard to treat every day as the gift it truly is. At 71 that is maybe easier to do than it is for those who are dealing with PCa at a much younger age. May we all live long and prosper. Be Well - cujoe

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I’m too guilty of the long ranting venting monologues . Sorry ...although my venting is less then in the recent past . I plan to join your school of thinking that each day is a gift.. My lack of hormones is a powerful deficit of which I’m adjusting...or am I ? Either way . I rise and fall each day in prayer ... My woes pale in comparison to one that can’t walk or see.. I don’t complain or explain I just give thanks... To you cujoe , I commend your attitude .. very fine indeed. Enjoy this weekend dear sir.

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Lulu, No reason to be apologetic. I only did 3 mos of ADT, but that was enough to realize the genuine assault it makes on men's "maleness". I suffered through 3 years of severe incontinence after surgery, before having the AUS 800 installed - just in the time for my biochemical recurrence 2 years ago. The QOL improvement from the AUS has been life-changing - and allowed me to deal with ADT without joining the Hemlock Society. I would have been one truly miserable SOB had I had to deal with ADT and 3 to 5 pads-a-day at the same time.

For the 8 weeks of my IMRT , I stayed at a hospital-affiliated facility (sort of a Ronald McDonald House for big people) and had the opportunity to get to know patients (and family of patients) with the full range of health issues - from all types of cancers, to organ/stem cell transplants, eating disorders, severe burns, and even gun-shot victims. The patients and family pretty much ran the full gambit of the socio-economic strata. Coupled with my first-person hands-on experience with my cancer and that of both my parents and all my siblings, that live-in experience enlightened me to the transient nature of our presence in the here and now.

Above you mentioned comparing your condition to someone who cannot walk or see. I also have a very good friend who recently suddenly completely lost his eyesight. He is my age and since that happened last Fall, I find that at least once a day, every day, I find myself trying to imagine what that must be like. Hard not to be thankful for my better-by-comparison health condition. Think positive, reduce stress, get out & interact with the world, eat well, and Be Well - cujoe

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I did those 8 weeks also..My good friend Tom Morey ( inventor of the boogie board ) and surf legend went blind at 80 , four years ago.. it was a rough start. He always felt like he was falling off a cliff. He has handled it well. For an inventor it’s torture.. he’s one tuff cookie and has a great wife. Hes taking it well. If he can do that , then, I can do this . Let’s stay out of the hemlock society .. interact with the world and eat well .. we do learn from

Others experiences.. Enjoy the weekend..

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Agreed! My guy is not adjusting very well and has been booted out of "blind college" twice, but hopefully third time's a charm and he will eventually graduate with honors. Later - cujoe

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My guy is Delving go into a dream

World . He’s in darkness . A Baha’i and a spiritual man . He’s able to go in and out of awesome dreams.. Blind or not. He a champion amongst men.. my heart ripped when he lost sight So yah, the eyes are everything to us . He’s doing better recently some new drop are giving him a little back . He optimistic now. He had gone thru hell. Hope your friend adjusts as well with time.. Later cujoe.

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Wow, I have a Morey board. And a original Burton, a set of Head skis with screw in edges plus Marker explodimat bindings. Plus an autographed Jobe waterski!

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Classics in design..

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A couple of well meaning friends have been trying to get me into cannabis for ages (in fact they offered it to me regularly even before I was dx with PCa 😀. Now I have aggressive Stage 4 cancer I have been thinking - we why not enjoy the time I have left. But cesanon's comments are a bit scary. But looking at it another way - PSADT is 1 month after multiple SOC treatments including ADT, Enza and chemo. Is some THC oil gonna make this worse? Or will it just make it bearable?

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"Is some THC oil gonna make this worse? Or will it just make it bearable?"

I think you frame the question well. I think it's early use is dubious risky behavior. But at some point it makes sense.

Then the issue becomes one of getting quality product. As a private investor in this industry, I have learned there are substantial variations in quality and formulations.

There are over 150 non THC cannabinoids. They each behave differently. There are wide variations in effects. You really need to experiment.

And reproducibility from batch to batch is an issue. Most of the management are pot heads, and the employees are basically high all the time. These are generally not buttoned down environments.

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"........Most of the management are pot heads, and the employees are basically high all the time..............."

Talk about suffering from, "....very strong reality distortion fields....", not to mention Verbal Diarrhea.

BTW,

businessinsider.com/scienti...

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Facts are facts.

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Just the facts mam. You no not what you speak...we all have opinions..

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“ Loyalty to petrified opinions never yet broke a chain or freed a human soul in this world——- and never will” Mark Twain

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“ Loyal to petrified opinions never yet broke a chain or freed a human soul in this world——- and never will” Mark Twain

Ah yes I see. You are unchained.

When the facts change I change. Over the history of humanity, pretty much most of human suffering has been caused by idealogs.

Go girl go.

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Just don’t call me sue!

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I agree.. I’m not against you or any mans right to opinion.

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The only "fact" is that you posted nothing more than a sweeping generalization backed up by assumption and opinion..... as I learned in my 9th grade debate class such silliness equates to nothing but verbal diarrhea.

BTW here's a link to the "management team" of GW Pharma, perhaps you could point out the "potheads" in the group.

gwpharm.com/about/executive...

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Yes yes yes don't listen to the ideological fool. LOL

Are you truly looking for facts? Or just relying on your gut.

Maybe I just live in a more complicated world than do you. Mine has lots of grays and little simplistic black and white.

Maga

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I'm sorry but trying to make this about me is silly, juvenile and testament to your inability to answer the question I posed. As you repeatedly say "LOL".

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What was your question?

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I made mention to your "inability' once, so no need to beat a dead horse.

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Too many people too obsessed with cannabis.

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And yet you choose to privately invest in this industry that is run by a bunch of pot heads? And you have no desire to use?

I'd invest in a company like this:

bakededibles.ca/

Excellent products and a very well run company-nobody is snacking on the job.

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That is a good investment..

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1. As we all know here, it is an imperfect world. Isn't it.

2. I am very pleased with my investments to date. I got in early.

3. A good product and a good company doesn't necessarily mean a good investment. And vice versa.

4. So you think the founders were not users? You think they fired their original user employees? Maybe. Or maybe not?

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There are a lot of very successful micro breweries around that are doing very well. I guess by that statement, you would assume that the owners are all alcoholics that stay drunk all day.

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What I said is common knowledge within the industry. Everyone knows it.

I have no opinion about the microbrewery business. It has an entirely different origin, entirely different dynamics, and didn't require as an original condition of entry the willingness to blithely violate state and federal narcotics laws.

ITCandy why do you continue to attempt to seek out and match wits with me such puerile argument. Please up your game or stop it. It is embarrassing just to watch.

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Not sure where that came from but you have yourself a great evening.

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I say do what you think you need or want to do. I'm on my second round of Prostate cancer first in 2004 and was treated with brachytherapy which lasted until Dec. of 2012. From the middle of 2012 until Dec. of the same year my Urologist was treating me for an infection all the while the cancer was growing and got to my bones and nodes, thanks Doc. I'm on Zytiga with prednisone and low dose blood pressure pill (since Oct. 2017). Also I go in for Lupron and Zometa couple times a year. Whole bunch of other things went on before I started Zytiga, Provenge being one of them. My point is during everything I've been through I have smoked weed everyday and I mean everyday not because I had to but because I wanted to due to the fact that I couldn't because of my job. Psa "0" Testosterone undetectable. Good Luck to everyone out there. And that's from my heart because I know how everybody feels, I've been through it all.

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I consume industrial hemp, not marijuana. The stuff I get is very high in CBD and no THC, so it doesn’t get you high. For that I drink kava. The hemp helps with appetite, inflammation and any low level or chronic pain. Industrial hemp is legal in all 50 and safe.

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"The hemp helps with appetite, inflammation and any low level or chronic pain."

I don't think many informed people would disagree.

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People are seeking relief friend.. each to there own.

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FWIW, yesterday just finished week 4 of salvage IMRT. I was great until about a few hours later. Horrible pain just below the base of my spine had this old man crying. CBD hemp flower treated the pain very quickly. I rarely get any pain, but it is nice to have something cheap (much cheaper than mm), safe and legal, though I live in MI where both recreational mj and mm are legal. Not recommending to anyone. DYODD, but this did work for me yesterday, to my tremendous relief.

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That is great. Keep flying low under the radar.. Tree top flyers...

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In Fiji they say “ Bula! Bula!

As they chug the kava . I did it at a kava bar in Ft. Lauderdale...do you really get high from it..? isn’t it like valerian root or Valium like a downer.?

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That's the stuff and for over 2 years now I've been drinking it daily, 2 - 4 litres of it. I drink it Fijian style, not too strong, but all day long. You have the option of becoming intoxicated from it, something I rarely do but do not disapprove of. I drink it in smaller doses, for other reasons, but it is still always pleasurable. I drink it mainly as a safe, legal NSAID that I can drink in high enough dose to be therapeutic without being harmful, unlike any other NSAID I know. I use it to treat my undifferentiated spondyloarthropathy, an inflammatory disorder related to ankylosing spondylitis. Works great for me, plus, if you feel you must, you can become pleasantly intoxicated if you do it right. For further info go to kavaforums.com Kava got me to lose weight from obese to a normal range (in only 8 months), cured my wife's GAD and insomnia, and got me to completely stop drinking any alcohol, well before my cancer Dx. This made an insanely huge amount of difference in my options with the cancers. And I used kava as my painkiller after the original biopsy (19 cores, no anaesthetic, took one hour), the RP and also a TURBT. Works much better for me as a painkiller than drugs, way fewer negative side effects, in fact I don't get any negative s/e from kava, though some people do. Anyway, definitely not recommending it to anyone, but happy to discuss this off-list with anyone.

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I did it in a kava bar in Ft laudrrdale. I liked the intoxicating feeling. I didn’t know it had pain relief and nsaid effects. That is great.. I’m open minded.. I say anything natural that make us feel better ..go for it.. keep healing self amigo... Bula Bula! 👣

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I suggest you go to leafly.com if you want to research the different strains and means of consumption. I have my medical marijuana card and I am living large. I wonder if anyone else can share this observation -- I seem to be a better person (less judgmental for sure) when I am high. I also use small bits of gummies (3 mg or so) to help me fall asleep. It's all good. I don't over-do it.

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LOL, how do you think Leafly calculates it's ratings? Then how do they assign numbers to them?

The same way they do with those personality tests in Glamour magazine. LOL

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Yep, no blind, randomized clinical trials for this stuff. Just move along. Curious if you live in a state that provides you access to this medication. I'll be LOL soon after I light up.

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Actually I do. I had my discussion with Myers when I asked him what research if any there was with respect to cannabis and prostate cancer.

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The DEA / FDA, whatever, deems cannabis to be a dread schedule 1 compound. Yeah, not much research on cannabis and prostate cancer. Not much research on cannabis period. It remains illegal.

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Yes that's a problem. Caused by fools with a simplistic view of the world, who believe one way and vote another.

Maga

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What would it take to perform a clinical trial on a substance that contains dozens if not hundreds of active compounds?

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It's algorithmic.

1 compound - 1 trial

2 compounds - 4 trials

4 compounds - 16 trials

It's not irrational. But they could and should find a solution for complex organic derived formulations.

We get the government we deserve.

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No tocixity in cannabis..

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I’ turned Rasta at 53 yrs old. I’m getting more artistic and creative. Losining up a lot.. its very benificial .. Thc is actually a concious raising drug. People normally don’t go out and rob a 7-11 after thc. They’re going to eat laugh and enjoy music friends and partners more than with out thc. It opens awareness to self and those around us.. A closed mind can’t fathom it. 420 for any “C” Ain’t going to hurt nobody..Only for those that seek it.. Im with ya on all fronts . enjoy life WSO

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There are cannibinoid receptors throughout the body (including prostate cells) and the body produces cannibinoids. I have seen no evidence that cannabis either retards or promotes PCa but it certainly helps with side effects, pain, inflammation, appetite and for many, just feeling happier. It has been used for a long long time. Mostly harmless, except for teen agers where excessive use seems to be associated with mental development problems.

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I wonder if DrWrite ever checked back and seen what a pot he had stirred up. (pun unintended) I applaud you DrWrite. I think I shall go and get medicated, re-read this post and turn my chuckles into laughs. I bid all of you a good evening, and it sounds as if at least some are determined to have just that.

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Here’s a bit of a dichotomy, given that most of us on ADT aren’t going to be getting our wives or girlfriends pregnant any time soon...

From The Verge:

For a study published today in the journal Epigenetics, scientists at Duke University compared the sperm of two groups of rats: those who had been given tetrahydrocannabinol (THC), the psychoactive ingredient in cannabis, and those who had not. Then they compared the sperm of 24 human men who smoked marijuana weekly versus a control group who used marijuana no more than 10 times in their life and not at all in the past half-year. In both cases — rats and humans — marijuana changed how genes work in sperm cells.

In both rats and humans, the cannabis affected many different genes involved in two different pathways. (Think of pathways as another set of instructions, this time for regulating various bodily functions.) One is important for organs to reach full size, and one plays a role in cancer and suppressing tumors.

Before anyone loses their shit, this doesn't mean that any kid you conceive while THC is coursing through your body will be more likely to get cancer. A lot more research needs to be conducted before any firm conclusions can be drawn. As The Verge points out, there were no laboratory controls on how much THC was consumed by the test subjects. Additionally, the sample groups used were very small.

Still, the implications of enjoying a few tokes that the study suggest as pretty grim. It's a bit of scientific exploration that's likely worth keeping an eye on

- [ ]

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livescience.com/64693-marij...

livescience.com/64350-marij...

All I know is that after about 2 years of full extract cannabis use I started having nocturnal erections again.

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I likewise have had Rso and nightwood constantly for three years.. I didn’t have that before APC at 53 . Now 57 . I’m

Pleased..

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What's that weird smell in here?

Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.

j-o-h-n Friday 02/08/2019 8:42 PM EST

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The Smell of success

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👍

Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.

j-o-h-n Saturday 02/09/2019 8:42 PM EST

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Or a skunk .?

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🌹🌹🌹🌹

Good Luck, Good Health and Good Humor.

j-o-h-n Saturday 02/09/2019 8:44 PM EST

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That’s a great pharmacist! Go for it!

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We have been recommended from all Of our Doctors to use the CBD with THC but no specific grams.

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Recommended 60 grams in 90 days to whopp “C” there are much better websites for this.. it’s as easy as googling RSO for PC.. tmi on it. I’m a fan .. “ Everyone wants to tell you what to do and what’s good for you.They don’t want you to find your own answers, they want you to believe theirs.” -Socrates,Peaceful warrior, another for you DrWrite..

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