If you know of such a list, would you mind sharing its source/ link?🤔
If not, do you have any ideas of where I might find 🔎 such a list? 🤔
(I’m stumped. 🤷♂️ 🤦♀️ )
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Per usual, I’ve:
. . . • ‘Google Scholar’ searched "ratio of ‘Omega 3’ and ‘Omega 6’ for common plant foods": scholar.google.com/scholar?...
[Which comes up with scholarly 🎓 works 📜 , which is a struggle to comprehend 😳 🤯 🥴 for us ‘untrained layman’. No simple/ comprehensive list seen 📝 👀 .]
. . . . . . And, found interesting info, but didn’t find a List of Quantities & Ratios of Omega 3 to Omega 6 in Common WFPB/ Vegan Foods. 😳 ]
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If you’re ‘search 🔎 savvy’ & know how to go about finding such a list 📝 , I’d greatly appreciate 🙏 any help you can provide.
Any pointers 👉 💡 , much appreciated. 😌
Thank you. 🙏 😌
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[Oh, this is what I’d recently learned as an interesting ‘aside’ from an interview with Dr. Brooke Goldner ( plantsuperpowers.com/dr-bro... ) of "Goodbye Lupus" & what spurred the aforementioned query. BG mentioned that instead of taking (vegan) Algae DHA/ Omega-3 supplements (which are all(?) in (Omega-6 laden) vegetable oil ☹️ ), we can by-pass those pricey Omega-6, oil-based supplements whose Omega-3 Algae ‘benefits’ are possibly outweighed?/ negated? by being in Omega 6 oil, such as sunflower oil 🌻💧. Instead we can ingest (far less pricey) freshly ground flax seeds. Doh! 🤦♀️ [May be inconvenience/ nuisance to grind (& ingest) flax seeds daily, yet for by-passing Omega-6 oil (& significant cost 💰 savings) it may be well worth the inconvenience of ‘the daily grind’. 😬 👍👍 ] This is what raised further investigation into other (non-animal) foods containing high Omega 3 (in relation to Omega 6) in common WFPB (non-animal, non-oil, ‘vegan’) foods.]
[Apologies for asking rudimentary 🔢 seemingly boring 😴 , tedious 🙄 layman’s queries. 🤭 😬 Yet, this stuff is fascinating for some of us laymen seeking authoritative 🧐 — yet ‘simple to understand’ information. ☺️ Unfortunately, I’ve no 🚫 scientific 👩🔬 / medical 👨⚕️ training, so I’m unsure about reliability, accuracy, authority of these resources (especially if it hasn’t been vetted/ filtered through (my) usual ‘reliable’ sources (Michael Greger, Dean Ornish, Neal Barnard, T. Colin Campbell, Caldwell Esselstyn, John McDougall, Michael Klaper, Joel Fuhrman, et. al.). That’s why I’m reaching 🤲 out to you knowledgeable 🎓 / experienced 🧑🧓 folks to help point me 👉 in the ‘right direction’ ⬆️ ➡️ ↗️ of credible, scientifically 🧫 🔬 🧪 ⚗️ sound ✅ , provable ✅ , accurate ✅ , verifiable ✅ information/ data 📊 . 😳 Thank you kindly 🙏 😌 for your time ⏳ ⌛️ & experience/ knowledge 👨🎓 👩🔬 👨⚕️ & balanced ⚖️ judgement 👩⚖️. . . . 👍👍 ]
The best source of this information (and in fact most raw nutritional information) is the USDA database (ndb.nal.usda.gov/ndb/nutrie..., and most other sources ultimately reference this. For example the tables here on wikipedia en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ratio...
I think the UDSA is pretty accurate as far as it goes, but the thing to remember is that raw foods aren't standardized the way drugs are. Each potato for example, is going to be different for every other one, even if they were grown in the same soil at the same time, so the data in USDA will be based on an average of a range sampled, but this might be different from food grown under different conditions.
So if you want to get precisely xxx.xx g of omega-3 you need a medical grade drug, but if you want to get a broad idea, the UDSA database is great.
I generally follow Dr Gregors advice. Since I don't add any oils when cooking, the issue of vegetable oils being high in omega 6 doesn't arise, and is probably a reason Gregor doesn't bother with the omega-6/3 ratio. Instead the emphasis is on total omega-3 (through flaxseeds, walnuts etc), and algae derived DHA , EPA.
I've got into the habit of starting my day with 30g of nuts (usually walnuts), and overnight oats with ground flaxseed. (You can buy it pre-ground but its cheaper to grind your own, i usually do a couple of weeks worth in one go with a simple electric coffee grinder - actually the same one i use for grinding spices).
Good to know the data from SELFNutritionData site ( nutritiondata.self.com/fact... ) is sourced from USDA (United States Department of Agriculture, Agricultural Research Service, USDA Food Composition Database): ndb.nal.usda.gov/ndb/nutrie...
Another fascinating (& fun) Nutrient Search Tool 🔎 !! 😃
✔️ Makes sense raw foods can’t be standardized because of so many variations in conditions, so an ‘average’ seems reasonable/ realistic.
✔️ Love that you follow Dr Gregor too! 👍👍 Spot on! We also don’t use any oils in cooking/ food prep 🥘 or on salads 🥗. (We were disappointed to learn they’re in an issue in our ‘Algae DHA/ Omega-3’ 💊 supplements. 😞 ) We’re also learning about the ratios ⚖️ of Omega-3 & Omega-6 in flaxseeds & walnuts as well ( 44uc8dkwa8q3f5b66w13vilg-wp... , en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rat... ). Fascinating stuff! 😯
✔️ Brilliant overnight oats & nuts! 😊👍👍 My understanding (from hearing Dr. Brooke Goldner’s 👩🏻⚕️ recommendation in an interview) we’re only ‘supposed to’ grind flaxseeds just before we eat them. 🤔 That’s because omega 3 oxidises rapidly when exposed to air & thereby loses potency 📉 . Therefore, grinding flaxseeds just before we ingest them is supposed to provide the maximum Omega 3. Grinding the seeds in advance reduces (dissipates?) the potency of Omega 3 the longer it’s exposed to air. 😯 I’ve heard it said elsewhere: "avoid 🚫 buying pre-ground flaxseed" — if we’re trying to maximise Omega 3. Buy whole seeds & grind them ourselvesjust before using. [How true/ accurate this is, I haven’t a clue! 🤷♂️ 🤦♀️ 😂 But I place Dr. BG in the category with my other ‘trusted sources’. ☺️ ]
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🔙 to the USDA tool ( ndb.nal.usda.gov/ndb/nutrie... ). I’ve been playing with it & getting a kick out of it! 😁 I’m not finding a direct label option of ‘Omega 3’ or ‘Omega 6’ (in the 3 Nutrient options fields), but am finding options of ‘DHA’, ‘EPA’ . . . The numerous Fatty Acid ratios have me stumped! 😳 🤔 Am speculating the ‘Omega 3 & 6’ are somewhere in those ratios, but (because of my science ignorance/ illiteracy) I haven’t been able to decipher what’s what. 🙃 😁
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Thank you kindly for your insights, benwl. Much, much appreciated. 😌 🙏 🍀 🌺 🌞
This text ( nutritiondata.self.com/topi... ) "Omega-3 and omega-6 isomers include "n-3" and "n-6" markings, and the letters c and t are used to indicate whether the double bonds are in cis or trans configurations."
. . . . explains the number designations in these ‘highest’ & ‘lowest’ search field options
"Nutritionists commonly classify dietary fat as either saturated, monounsaturated, or polyunsaturated, based on the number of double bonds that exist in the fat's molecular structure. For each of these three classes, there exists a large number of different chemical variations or "isomers".
For reason of clarity, ND refers to each fatty acid isomer by it's numerical designation. The first number of this designation indicates how many carbon atoms are in the fatty acid molecule, and the number after the colon indicates the number of double bonds. Omega-3 and omega-6 isomers include "n-3" and "n-6" markings, and the letters c and t are used to indicate whether the double bonds are in cis or trans configurations.
Many fatty acids also have systematic (non-numerical) names, as well as common names, which leads to some confusion in identifying them. To help make it easier to understand, we've prepared the table below, which puts all of the equivalent names together in one place."
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[Oy vey! 😳 THAT might explain why it’s so darn difficult to decipher (& compile) a nice ‘n simple Omega 3 & Omega 6 common food list with quantities & ratios. 🤔 The mind-numbing, hair-splitting calculations of such minutiae would drive one mad! 😂 🙃 🤪 ]
Thanks for the links. When I switched from buying pre-ground flaxseeds to grinding my own I looked into the oxidation question, and like you, found a lot of people saying that it quickly oxidizes. But I could only find one study where that actually tried to measure it:
the findings there is it's not much of a problem with ground flaxseed. They suggest that there may be antioxidants in the seeds that give a protective effect relative to pure oil, but i think this is another example of something that comes up all the time in nutrition which is the whole food is usually better than any 'healthy' ingredient that can be isolated and extracted from it.
I do keep my ground flaxseeds in an air-tight container.
I'd not come across Dr Goldner before, i've ordered her book so looking forward to reading that.
Thank you kindly for link to JAOCS Study "Storage stability of milled flaxseed" ( link.springer.com/article/1... ), benwl. 🙏 😌
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Interesting reading Abstract:
Two samples of flaxseed, Linott and a mixture of several varieties, were milled and stored at 23±2°C [73.4±2°F] for 128 d in paper bags with plastic liners. Samples were evaluated at 0, 33, 66, 96, and 128 d for chemical, sensory, and volatile indicators of quality. Neither the mixed variety nor Linott samples showed a significant increase in peroxide values or conjugated double bonds throughout the 128-d storage period. Only the Linott sample showed a significant increase in free fatty acids, which was likely due to the presence of immature seed in the sample. Total volatiles increased with storage in the mixed variety sample but showed minimal change in the Linott sample. Overall, the levels of total volatiles in the milled flaxseed samples were much lower than levels reported in stored vegetable oils containing significantly lower levels of linolenic acid. Dienals, formed during polyunsaturated fatty acid oxidation, and hexanal, a compound used as an indicator of oxidative deterioration, were found at very low levels in both samples and did not reach high levels throughout the 128-d storage period. A trained sensory panel could not detect any differences in the odor properties of fresh or stored milled samples. No differences in flavor could be detected between bread made with 0- and 128-d milled flaxseed. This study showed that milled flaxseed can be stored up to 4 mon at ambient temperatures without noticeable changes in quality. The presence of endogenous antioxidants in the milled flaxseed may account for the stability observed.
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Very interesting to hear ground flaxseeds were stable for ~4 months (128 days) at ~‘room temperature’ (23±2°C [73.4±2°F] ) . 😯 😃
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Merely thinking aloud aside:
Wondering if being stored in a paper bag (in addition to an (airtight) plastic liner) contributed to the benefit of ‘oxidative deterioration’ being at a ‘low level’? 🤔💭
That is, wondering if being within a paper bag — outside of direct light — was a positive ‘contributing factor’ in the oxidative deterioration being low? 🤔
Wondering if it’s not only being sealed (airtight) in plastic but also being out of direct light (such as a bag or a closed cupboard where light ☀️ 💡 is reduced) that might contribute to low oxidation as well? 🤔
Dunno 🤷♂️ . . .
Merely speculating aloud. 🤔 💬❓
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Like your idea of keeping self-ground whole flaxseeds in airtight container. Good thinking! 👍👍
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If you get a chance, benwl, would you mind letting us know what you think of Dr. Brooke Goldner’s book — if you don’t mind sharing your views? 🤔 That is, if you’ve time/ inclination to do so. 😌
[I’ve only seen Dr. BG’s videos ( google.com/search?as_q=Dr.+... ) & have been impressed 😯⚡️✨ each time — not only by her personal story of recovery, but her deep knowledge 🤓 🧠 of nutritional healing. She "knows whereof she speaks". Truly remarkable physician 👩🏻⚕️ who’s experienced both sides of profound illness (& healing) not only as a patient but as a physician! (She reminds me of Dr. Terry Wahls 👩🏼⚕️ ( google.com/search?as_q=Terr... ) another patient/ physician who’s also been on both sides of disease & healing. Remarkable ladies 👩🏻⚕️👩🏼⚕️!!]
Thank you again, benwl. Much, much appreciated. 🙏 😌
"Purslane also contains oxalic acid that makes it non-recommended 🚫 in large quantities for people who have ⚠️ uric acid or kidney problems or must restrict dietary oxalate levels." ( en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Por... , healthline.com/nutrition/pu... )
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❓Can’t find it in my local shop/ grocery/ supermarket 🏪 , so where do we find it?
[Not heard of purslane until I stumbled upon it in ‘Omega-3 fatty acids in wild plants, nuts and seeds’ (Artemis P Simopoulos MD): apjcn.nhri.org.tw/server/AP... . Didn’t find any HU (HealthUnlocked) posts when searching 🔎 for "purslane".]
Google searched 🔎 "Purslane videos" ( google.com/search?as_q=Purs... ), but haven’t viewed any yet. Am curious 🤔 about your 1st-hand experience if you’d like to share? 😌
[Aside: If Jeff Nelson (VegSource: m.youtube.com/user/headveg/... ) is correct, sad/ disappointed 😔 😞 in Dr. Michael Greger 👨⚕️ (NutritionFacts.org: nutritionfacts.org/?s=DHA ) & Dr. Joel Fuhrman 👨⚕️ ( drfuhrman.com/search?search... ), but shan’t "throw the baby 👶 out with the bath water 🛁 ‘’. But, must be vigilant 🧐 — think more critically 🤔 — when ingesting information 📚 from even from my ‘trusted sources’ to include JN himself. Oy vey! 🤷♂️ 🤦♀️ . . . It’s never simple is it!? 😳 🙃 😯 ]
Per usual, lots of interesting thoughts 💭 💭 💭 under the ‘Comments section’ (of the video) as well — 700+ comments to date. ☺️ 🙏 🍀 🌺 🌞
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