Help with interrupting daughters results (Hashi... - Thyroid UK

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Help with interrupting daughters results (Hashimoto’s)

KIRM profile image
KIRM
20 Replies

Have not posted on behalf of my daughter for a while as she has gone through a very low period when she just given up trying to feel half alive. She has had to suspend University due to terrible brain fog, inability to retain information and inability to even construct a paragraph, so anxiety set in. Frustrating for a once academic child and hard for me to see.

These are her latest bloods. Would be grateful for any kind of feedback or thoughts on how to help her. She has always struggled to get her folate levels up despite supplements. I know her GP will just look at her low TSH but her FT3 and 4 are not in a great position within the range. I have also thought she struggles to convert T3.

Thank you.

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KIRM profile image
KIRM
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greygoose profile image
greygoose

I don't think conversion is a problem at this point. But, it may be just that her failing thyroid is producing more T3 than T4. Failing thyroids often do that.

The main point is that she has high antibodies, meaning that she has Autoimmune Thyroiditis - aka Hashi's. And, by the look of it, she's coming down from a Hashi's 'hyper' swing (low TSH and high antibodies, euthyroid Frees). It will take a while for the TSH to catch up with the other levels, so perhaps not the best set of results to set before a doctor. Perhaps if you could wait a few months - which I know will be difficult, but she won't get any sort of diagnosis with those results - and see what things look like when they've settled down.

Her ferritin is very low, and she should have a full iron panel done. So, maybe see her doctor about that? It will be causing her a lot of symptoms.

KIRM profile image
KIRM in reply togreygoose

thank you for your quick response and sound advice.

greygoose profile image
greygoose in reply toKIRM

You're welcome. :)

As Greygoose says, the ferritin result is very low.

Less than 30 indicates iron decifency. Less than 15 indicates total depletion of iron.

Would recommend trying to get her a full iron panel and full blood count. (You'll need them if you want to go private.)

I had an iron transfusion and it improved my health dramatically. I was slow to notice the difference at first but I put that down to my body being slow to recognise what it had been given since it had been deplete for so long. 😂

KIRM profile image
KIRM

thank you for your feedback

Hedgeree profile image
Hedgeree

Hi KIRM,

I'm just echoing what others have said regarding your daughter's low ferritin levels. Also I experienced lots of symptoms when mine was low in range, dizziness, tiredness, breathlessness and hair loss. Also just feeling worn out and drained. Does your daughter include much meat in her diet? Is your daughter a vegetarian?

Hedgeree profile image
Hedgeree

Is your daughter still seeing an endocrinologist? I was just reading through some of your earlier posts. Is she still taking thyroid hormones? Apologies for lots of questions!

KIRM profile image
KIRM

She is on 125mcg/ day of Levo. She is not a vegetarian but we don’t eat a lot of meat particularly red meat. She was gluten free but gave up 2 years ago when she went to Uni. And she has not been great at remembering her Vitamins! She has just seen yet another Endo who requested a Full blood panel so these results are from Blue Horizon and she awaits the full NHS ones. I went for a copy yesterday and was told I had to wait as the GP would not release them before he spoke to my daughter. Hope he concentrates on the low Iron and Cortisol and not the low TSH. Not holding my breath over the latest private Endo either.

Forgot to mention that I accidentally found out she has put herself on the anti depressant Serteraline, which I am not happy about but slowly getting her to understand her feelings of anxiety and low mood is the result of her Thyroid and not depression.

Thank you for feedback.

Hedgeree profile image
Hedgeree in reply toKIRM

Make sure the endo is aware of your daughter's above range cortisol; they can then indicate other blood tests that may be necessary for your daughter to undergo.

SlowDragon profile image
SlowDragonAdministrator

Is she taking sertraline at least 2 hours away from levothyroxine

B12 is far too low

Folate deficient

Ferritin deficient

Likely vitamin levels crashed once no longer on gluten free diet

She needs full iron panel test for anaemia including ferritin via GP. May need iron supplements

SlowDragon profile image
SlowDragonAdministrator

low B12 and low folate

Suggest she starts with separate B12 initially and adds dail vitamin B complex after a week

supplementing a good quality daily vitamin B complex, one with folate in (not folic acid) 

This can help keep all B vitamins in balance and will help improve B12 levels too

Difference between folate and folic acid 

chriskresser.com/folate-vs-...

Many Hashimoto’s patients have MTHFR gene variation and can have trouble processing folic acid.

thyroidpharmacist.com/artic...

B vitamins best taken after breakfast

Thorne Basic B recommended vitamin B complex that contains folate, but they are large capsules. (You can tip powder out if can’t swallow capsule) 

Currently cheapest via eBay at £18.75

IMPORTANT......If are taking vitamin B complex, or any supplements containing biotin, remember to stop these 7 days before ALL BLOOD TESTS , as biotin can falsely affect test results

endo.confex.com/endo/2016en...

endocrinenews.endocrine.org...

In week before blood test, when you stop vitamin B complex, you might want to consider taking a separate methyl folate supplement and continue separate B12

Low B12 symptoms 

b12deficiency.info/signs-an...

methyl-life.com/blogs/defic...

With serum B12 result below 500, (Or active B12 below 70) recommended to be taking a B12 supplement as well as a B Complex (to balance all the B vitamins) initially for first 2-4 months.

once your serum B12 is over 500 (or Active B12 level has reached 70), stop the B12 and just carry on with the B Complex.

B12 drops 

healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...

B12 sublingual lozenges 

amazon.co.uk/Jarrow-Methylc...

cytoplan.co.uk/shop-by-prod...

B12 range in U.K. is too wide

Interesting that in this research B12 below 400 is considered inadequate 

healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...

How other member saw how effective improving low B vitamins has been 

healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...

SlowDragon profile image
SlowDragonAdministrator

iron and ferritin

Ferritin needs to be at least over 70 minimum on levothyroxine

Does she suffer heavy periods?

cks.nice.org.uk/topics/anae...

In all people, a serum ferritin level of less than 30 micrograms/L confirms the diagnosis of iron deficiency

Also See page 7 on here 

rcn.org.uk/-/media/royal-co...

Look at increasing iron rich foods in diet 

Eating iron rich foods like liver or liver pate once a week plus other red meat, pumpkin seeds and dark chocolate, plus daily orange juice or other vitamin C rich drink can help improve iron absorption

List of iron rich foods

dailyiron.net

Links about iron and ferritin

An article that explains why Low ferritin and low thyroid levels are often linked 

preventmiscarriage.com/iron...

 

irondisorders.org/too-littl...

davidg170.sg-host.com/wp-co...

Great in-depth article on low ferritin 

oatext.com/iron-deficiency-...

drhedberg.com/ferritin-hypo...

This is interesting because I have noticed that many patients with Hashimoto’s disease and hypothyroidism, start to feel worse when their ferritin drops below 80 and usually there is hair loss when it drops below 50.

Thyroid disease is as much about optimising vitamins as thyroid hormones

healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...

restartmed.com/hypothyroidi...

Post discussing just how long it can take to raise low ferritin 

healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...

Never supplement iron without doing full iron panel test for anaemia first and retest 3-4 times a year if self supplementing. It’s possible to have low ferritin but high iron 

Medichecks iron panel test 

medichecks.com/products/iro...

Iron and thyroid link

healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...

Excellent article on iron and thyroid 

cambridge.org/core/journals...

Posts discussing why important to do full iron panel test

healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...

healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...

Chicken livers if iron is good, but ferritin low

healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...

Heme iron v non heme

hsph.harvard.edu/nutritions...

Ferritin over 100 to alleviate symptoms 

healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...

Low Iron implicated in hypothyroidism 

healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...

Here’s absolutely excellent reply by @humanbean

on iron and ferritin panel test results for another member 

healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...

Good explanations of iron 

theironclinic.com/iron-defi...

theironclinic.com/ironc/wp/...

Helpful info on iron infusion and supplements 

healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...

Excellent reply by Blearyeyed about iron in this post

healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...

KIRM profile image
KIRM in reply toSlowDragon

yes heavy periods.

We will both plough through all the above links. Thank you

SlowDragon profile image
SlowDragonAdministrator in reply toKIRM

So it’s a vicious circle

Anaemia often results in heavy periods….heavy periods results in anaemia

Poor iron and ferritin levels results in levothyroxine not working very well

Request/insist GP do full iron panel test

She likely needs iron supplements

KIRM profile image
KIRM in reply toSlowDragon

she will has telephone consultation tomorrow.

Re: Pure Encapsulations do you think this brand is worth paying more for with the hope of a quicker result?

SlowDragon profile image
SlowDragonAdministrator

Free T4 (fT4) 16.2 pmol/L (12.0 - 22.0) 42.0%

Free T3 (fT3) 5.4 pmol/L (3.1 - 6.8) 62.2%

Folate - Serum 6.86 ug/L (8.83 - 60.8) -3.8%

Vitamin B12 (active) 216 nmol/L (145 - 569) 16.7%

Vitamin D 75 nmol/L (75 - 200.0) 0.0%

Ferritin 25.6 ug/L (13. - 150) 9.2%

Results show she likely needs small dose increase in levothyroxine

Perhaps 137.5mcg and 125mcg alternate days initially

Which brand of levothyroxine is she currently taking

Low vitamin levels tend to lower TSH

All four vitamins need significant improvement

Retest in 8 weeks

likely to see benefits going back on gluten free diet

Sallina profile image
Sallina in reply toSlowDragon

Do you mind telling me how you do calculations of vitamins as well, it's very useful. Please 😊 🙏

SlowDragon profile image
SlowDragonAdministrator in reply toSallina

Lovely new calculator made by Decant

healthunlocked.com/thyroidu...

thyroid.chingkerrs.online/

KIRM profile image
KIRM in reply toSlowDragon

she is still on Euthyrox. Will get her to start alternating her dose. And get the B12 into her before adding a B Complex as you previously mentioned.

Is it the same formula to find out % in range for all results and not just Thyroid?

Thank you

SlowDragon profile image
SlowDragonAdministrator in reply toKIRM

yes ….I guess so (maths not my strong point)

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