I cut out dairy nearly 4 years ago when I was diagnosed with Hashimoto's. I decided to try reintroducing it a few days ago. I've eaten some Greek yogurt for breakfast for the past three or four days. I noticed I've had some headaches and tiredness and today some depressive feelings for no real reason. Since adding T3 a couple of months ago, I haven't had any depressive feelings at all. I'm just wondering whether anyone else has noticed that dairy can affect mood? I know lots of other things might be behind it but it'd be interesting to hear if anyone else has experienced this because of dairy. Thanks!
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Zazbag
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There is so much documented about dairy intolerances and sensitivities that I am wholly unsurprised by this.
I don't have direct experience of this but my nephew is lactose intolerant and still eats small amounts of dairy with some frequency and has terrible anxiety and mild depression.
I have a sneaking suspicion that if he cut out all dairy he'd see a marked improvement but not everyone sees the connection between diet and health, mental or physical!
P.s. there's an easy way to test this; don't change anything and cut dairy out again. When the headaches stop reintroduce it.
If the headaches come back it's very probably caused by dairy. If not, it was something else!
I was tolerant with dairy but became vegan so cut it out. Every single time I've had even the smallest amount of dairy since, I've felt really strange, hypo like. I think I was tolerant but removing it has made me intolerant now. The pattern isn't coincidence either. Ditch dairy people, it's not good for us, the environment or the poor cows
I wasn't asking so this could turn into an environmental debate, it's very difficult socially when you don't eat gluten, dairy, eggs or soy. I've done that for 4 years. I wanted to see if I could reintroduce a bit of dairy to make my life slightly easier, that's all.
Surely the phenomenal growth of vegan options means its never been easier to avoid all those things? Or do you mean at people's houses? I don't find so but I'm sure others will be along soon who can help!
Vegan options mostly contain soy replacements and are rarely gluten free.
Gluten free options are often egg OR dairy free, rarely both. And not often vegetarian.
It can be really difficult to find healthy options that cover all those requirements. Zazbag , I really empathise. Food is a huge part of our social interaction and it can be really hard to navigate dietary requirements, especially when it's not an "allergy". It somehow doesn't garner the same support when it improves your health but ultimately is a choice.
Very true. I have arguments each time I eat with family. An allergy is one thing, but deliberately refusing dairy and gluten, not to mention carbs brings me into conflict all the time. It is easier to fast, but that doesn't mean that they can understand that either.
I am very well used to being thought of as crackers within the bosom of my family. Although I have been hypothyroid since 1997, they still don't try to understand it and don't see any change, just me trying something else!! I really think that it is nothing but a fad.
Unless someone else in the family gets it, they will never see it as any different I don't think.
There is something funny about food and the reactions it generates. It is a really personal choice and any deviation from 'the norm' seems to really spark push back.
We went vegan for a year (and are now plant-based because we missed cheese! although I'm considering giving it up again to see if it helps my health) and the disdain I received from people if it ever came up was surprising. People seemed to take personal offense which I find really curious.
I am very grateful that my family is supportive and holds similar views on food so it's not too difficult. Eating out is nigh on impossible though! Especially now I'm gluten-free and avoid soy as far as possible.
It's so blooming difficult to navigate! As you say, fasting is easiest but then can be seen as 'making a point'. Can't win.
I don't think that fake foods made in a lab are good for you. And soy and grain monoculture is very bad for the environment. It would also mean the extinction of farm animals through no fault of their own - no one is going to preserve unproductive animals - they'll just be killed or allowed to die out. Our domestic pets will also live shorter unhealthy lives without meat. I'm a vegan and I can't understand why anyone would want fake meat. I also have the problem of not being able to find gluten-free vegan options, so I just eat the veg and don't bother with any junk cake/bread/muffin-type foods. Some people have problems with dairy, others don't, but I suspect that not eating higher protein foods makes it more difficult to digest them as your system will try to adapt to what you do eat.
For many people dinner consists of 'meat, potatoes, and 2 veg' some of those same people want to go vegan/plant-based either for health, environmental, or ethical reasons. Not liking meat is another, completely different, reason.
To go from a typical British diet to a *healthy* plant-based/vegan one cold turkey is astonishingly difficult. Fake meat allows those people to eat at they used to but without meat or dairy, which buys some breathing room in which to consider a more rounded plant-based diet.
I try to follow the 'daily dozen' which would have been phenomenally, if not impossibly, difficult for me when we first cut out meat and dairy. It's still hard now, 3 years later.
Please excuse me for interrupting your good post Zagwag, just want to say what an interesting observation that is from you Angel of the North. Although cows and sheep will survive 'in the wild' as they do very well on the Forest where some of my family live, I hadn't thought about domestic pets needing meat/fish. I am vegan so my personal thought is that it would be a good thing for fewer animals/fish to be killed and the domestic pets would be able to have far better 'cuts'.
I'm sure I have read that the bacteria that live in our guts and help us to process and digest dairy products, particularly milk sugars (i.e. lactose), milk fats, and milk proteins may eventually die if people stop eating dairy. So, anyone eating dairy after the bacteria used for dealing with milk have died is going to suffer if they reintroduce it.
I don't know if this is even remotely true. Unfortunately I can't find any links on what I've just written. All I get are loads of links on lactose intolerance which is not what I want to know about.
Yeah I was expecting that to happen, I noticed it has bloated me a little and given me some wind but nothing excessive. I think yogurt is one of the better choices in this regard as it's low in lactose compared to other dairy products (because of the fermentation process).
Datis Kharrazian says the best way to reintroduce dairy is grassfed ghee first, then butter. Then raw goat yoghurt/kefir, milk, cheese, then raw cow dairy in the same order. Reason given is that "raw dairy has live enzymes that make it easier to digest. Dairy has three components; butterfat, lactose and casein. Butterfat doesn't cause a problem for many people; intolerance is more common for lactose and casein. Therefore ghee and butter come first. Goat dairy is easier to digest than cow dairy." He also has suggestions on how much of each to try and how slowly to re-introduce. This is from a short ebook called The Autoimmune Diet, the Gut-Brain Repair Guide, which I downloaded free from his website. Best of luck
I stay away from soy for the most part. I read labels very carefully. However , I have been eating tempeh for quite some time for the high amount of protein. It too is fermented . I have not had any problems.
Yes, this is true. There is a complex set of enzymes that help digest milk and milk products in the gut. If you dont eat any dairy products for a while, these enzymes die out as the body realises they are not needed. Many people have trouble digesting milk, as it is digested from the stomach to way down the gut. Nearly all milk is now homogenised (he fat droplets are emulsified) which makes digestion more difficult. It is worth trying non-homogenised milk if you can find it, as this does not cause bloating. The homogenising is just to help the bottling plants as the cream does not separate.
Please do not believe all the "facts" stated on vegan sites about British dairy. Most farmers love their cows and have to comply with a whole heap of legislation. Did you see how the pollution levels dropped dramatically in the first lock down, and yet we had the same number of cows?
Apologies again Zazbag. Please Serenfach, don't point the finger at vegans as being untruthful. "Love their cows" - would you force anyone you love to go through pregnancy and birth year after year after year. Would you take away their boy babies? Of course pollution levels dropped when cars were used less, it doesn't mean cows don't produce pollution!!!
Thanks Zazbag, nice of you to say that though I could see the comment that led to you having made the comment you did. I just meant that I apologise that two of my posts have not been replies to your initial post. You've certainly sparked off some lively comments!
Naturally in the wild, a cow would have a calf every year. Look into the carbon cycle for yourself - cows eating grass is actually carbon neutral. You dont have to believe me, the science is there.
Anyway, this is off topic. I wish Zazbag luck in finding a diet that suits her, and good health going forward.
Serenfach I don't like you continuing to suggest vegans are untruthful. You are writing from the presumption that you know better which makes me wonder if you come from or married into farming stock. I do know about these things, one of my daughters stood as the Green party candidate, the other is a vet, so I really do know. A cow living naturally would have the potential to calve every year but would have a choice - there's the important part of this.
The gestation period for a cow is around 283 days. The farmer will often try to get the cow back in calf within 2 months of her giving birth, so that she produces one calf per year. However many farmers do not achieve this and cows often give birth every 400 days or more - that's artificially inseminated cows, not ones living naturally.
But, that aside, I don't believe that you would artificially inseminate anyone you love and then take away their baby.
Could you please just back off from suggesting vegans are either untruthful or uninformed, please?
I am a farmer and have been for 50 years. AI is used to get the best bull for the cow, with lots of factors taken into account, size of calf, breed etc. Farmers do not want to keep multiple bulls as it does not make financial sense, and the dairy herd will improve over time with top class genetics by using AI. Cows in the wild will come bulling (on heat) and the bull will serve her - it is a natural cycle. Cows will only conceive when they are on heat, and farmers usually use the second heat in the cycle.
I have worked every day for over 50 years with cows, so yes, I probably do know better.
A baby is defined as a young human being. A young cow is called a calf. Emotive language does not help.
I asked you to please just back off from suggesting vegans are either untruthful or uninformed and you have responded with a lecture. I knew all of that and remain of the opinion that you would not treat anyone you love the way you treat cattle - as money making objects. I questioned your use of the word 'love' which is you using 'emotive language' and I would respectfully suggest that if you don't want to be expected to back up your claims, you don't take issue with the truthfulness of vegans, which is what started this off. I respect your right to the choices you make and would like you to respect vegans' rights to make choices that fit with their moral compass without being unjustly accused.
Thank you for your reply. I do respect your rights and your own moral compass. I just feel that many vegans do not have the full facts and understanding of how nature works. There is a lot of disinformation that is pushed out there, and many do not question it.
Please excuse me again Zazbag and I'm not arguing for veganism here btw, just responding. I have read something similar to Humanbean, that after I think it was 2 years (cd have been 6 months) without eg dairy our bodies are no longer able to digest it.
If I eat gluten I experience really bad night terrors. My whole childhood was basically nightmares every night, night time hallucinations and bed wetting(yikes). I think it definitely contributed to my major depression and anxiety that developed in my teenage years. I typically avoid dairy as it can have the same affects but not as bad.
Thanks this is very interesting to hear. I definitely feel like it has done something to me the past few days...
Theres a site called celiac.com/forums where you will find a lot of posts about food causing mental issues. You are definitely not alone. They mention dairy a lot too.
From my personal experiences in the past dairy made me tired lethargic bloated. At the time I was not aware that I had Hashimoto. I recently tried having some Greek yogurt and got the very same reactions. I guess will just have to say no thank you to dairy. Though I miss and love dairy. But it doesn't love me back.
haven’t noticed this but haven’t really paid attention to that. it’s an interesting observation, thx for sharing. i will try a couple times again to cut dairy out completely for a few weeks and report back if i notice it coincides with mood changes.
So I've continued eating yogurt all week, I've felt unusually bad and there's no other explanation for it. I think I've proven to myself that it's not for me so I'm going to come off it again. I'm surprised by how little I care, I used to LOVE Greek yogurt, I'd eat 2kg a week, I think I was addicted to it. It's very filling which was nice but I didn't enjoy the taste like I used to.
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